MusicRadar Reason 12 Review out...

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Billy+
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Post 10 Sep 2021

PhillipOrdonez wrote:
10 Sep 2021
Obviously you don't have any use for such tools cause for you all samplers are the same. That doesn't mean there's no gaps, just cause there's several samplers and to you they are all the same. Your opinion comes from a place of ignorance. 😃
Disinterest rather than ignorance :thumbup:
VST 2.4 MIDI It's definitely on the list of todos
What MIDI tools are you itching to use

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PhillipOrdonez
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Post 10 Sep 2021

Haha, you can call it whatever you want. 🙄

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Billy+
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Post 10 Sep 2021

PhillipOrdonez wrote:
10 Sep 2021
Haha, you can call it whatever you want. 🙄
Just like you can be as over opinionated as you like, however in this case your opinion of me is incorrect :lol:
VST 2.4 MIDI It's definitely on the list of todos
What MIDI tools are you itching to use

ˁ˚ᴥ˚ˀ Time for a good long sleep ˁ˚ᴥ˚ˀ

PhillipOrdonez
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Post 10 Sep 2021

I'm overly ignorant about knitting. Because I'm totally disinterested in it. If I was interested in it, I would learn about it and not be ignorant about it

Do you understand now why my opinion of you is totally correct?

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Billy+
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Post 10 Sep 2021

PhillipOrdonez wrote:
10 Sep 2021
I'm overly ignorant about knitting. Because I'm totally disinterested in it. If I was interested in it, I would learn about it and not be ignorant about it

Do you understand now why my opinion of you is totally correct?
Because your threads have started unravel?

Or somehow I should use mimic to understand the gap it fills and encourage you to take up knitting that way you could fix your panties when they get bunched up ;)
VST 2.4 MIDI It's definitely on the list of todos
What MIDI tools are you itching to use

ˁ˚ᴥ˚ˀ Time for a good long sleep ˁ˚ᴥ˚ˀ

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Billy+
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Post 10 Sep 2021

All joking aside it's not my thing (samplers) but I wasn't shunning it either, I don't know why you would have any attitude towards me and to be fair I don't care.

Yet others thread derailed because someone disagrees with an opinion that they have made up or misunderstood :clap:
VST 2.4 MIDI It's definitely on the list of todos
What MIDI tools are you itching to use

ˁ˚ᴥ˚ˀ Time for a good long sleep ˁ˚ᴥ˚ˀ

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selig
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Post 10 Sep 2021

Or threads derail because folks go off topic and start talking about things like who's opinion is "correct".
Guys, nobody cares. Please either move back to the subject or move along.
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Dabbler
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Post 10 Sep 2021

exxx wrote:
10 Sep 2021
Users here are too company-friendly.

It's like a reason studio employee.

Such advocacy is rare.

Why are you defending the company so much?
I love Reason. You got a problem with that?

PhillipOrdonez
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Post 10 Sep 2021

Imagine dismissing stuff that benefits others just cause it doesn't benefit you! 🙄

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Billy+
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Post 10 Sep 2021

PhillipOrdonez wrote:
10 Sep 2021
Imagine dismissing stuff that benefits others just cause it doesn't benefit you! 🙄
The only thing I dismissed was music radars opinion that Reason had a device gap

I can appreciate mimic enhances sample based workflow, but was there really a gap?
VST 2.4 MIDI It's definitely on the list of todos
What MIDI tools are you itching to use

ˁ˚ᴥ˚ˀ Time for a good long sleep ˁ˚ᴥ˚ˀ

PhillipOrdonez
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Post 10 Sep 2021

You couldn't achieve the same results with any of the other samplers available.

DaveyG
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Post 10 Sep 2021

To get back on topic, for me the most interesting point made in that review was that Mimic is mostly of value to Standalone users rather than RRP users because RRP users probably already have similar options in their host DAW (this is certainly true for Live and Studio One). James has told us that the userbase is now split about 50/50 between Standalone and RRP so the review is effectively saying that the flagship new device is not of much interest to half the users!

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guitfnky
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Post 10 Sep 2021

Billy+ wrote:
10 Sep 2021
The only thing I dismissed was music radars opinion that Reason had a device gap

I can appreciate mimic enhances sample based workflow, but was there really a gap?
yes.

I don’t need a new sampler either, but clearly if it 1–has a feature/features not available elsewhere in the standalone software, and 2–people want it, then it fills a gap. and since multiple folks have said 1 and 2 are indeed the case, the answer is pretty obvious.
I write bad music for good people

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QVprod
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Post 10 Sep 2021

I think Mimic is very underrated here. Perhaps Ableton's simpler is a match ( haven't used it) but Sample One in S1 is not in the same league. Nor are probably most stock samplers. so in that regard, while I agree that Mimic has more general appeal to standalone users because there was no stock equivalent, in both cases (standalone and RPP) it's appealing if a user hasn't already bought a capable 3rd party sampler.

Perhaps one wouldn't upgrade specifically for a sampler, but as part of the overall package it's a really great add that's far more than just basic as some seem to characterize it.

In that way I agree with the tagline that as a package it's the best Reason' looked in years. Pun intended as well; whether or not they realized the pun themselves. (HD graphics and all)

Edit: I did forget S1 updated some functions with the XT version, but I still think Mimmic is quicker and simpler to work with for slicing.

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arqui
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Post 10 Sep 2021

QVprod wrote:
10 Sep 2021
Sample One in S1 is not in the same league.
I did not understand what you wanted to put in that it is not in the same league. because Sample One XT is infinitely superior to Mimic (because it is) or inferior.

Minic is a Toy
Sample One XT is a Profesional tool
I don't know if we think the same
Last edited by arqui on 10 Sep 2021, edited 1 time in total.
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DaveyG
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Post 10 Sep 2021

QVprod wrote:
10 Sep 2021
I think Mimic is very underrated here. Perhaps Ableton's simpler is a match ( haven't used it) but Sample One in S1 is not in the same league. Nor are probably most stock samplers. so in that regard, while I agree that Mimic has more general appeal to standalone users because there was no stock equivalent, in both cases (standalone and RPP) it's appealing if a user hasn't already bought a capable 3rd party sampler.

Perhaps one wouldn't upgrade specifically for a sampler, but as part of the overall package it's a really great add that's far more than just basic as some seem to characterize it.

In that way I agree with the tagline that as a package it's the best Reason' looked in years. Pun intended as well; whether or not they realized the pun themselves. (HD graphics and all)

Edit: I did forget S1 updated some functions with the XT version, but I still think Mimmic is quicker and simpler to work with for slicing.
Sample One XT is hugely capable. You can drag a bunch of multisamples onto it and if it can find a note name in each filename it will automatically map them sensibly across the keyboard. That was a proper wow moment for me. You can drag a loop onto it and it will slice it automatically and usually as well as Recycle does. You can slice by beat, you can stretch and, get this, it will load Rex files. Imagine that! It's embarrassing that the company that invented the Rex format can't use it in their shiny new sampler. Rex was made for samplers. Mimic is a pale imitation of Ableton's simpler but with less flexibility and more brown. Maybe one day brown will be the new black but today is not that day.

Fact is, Mimic is just OK and nothing more. They hadn't even though about note detection until we mentioned it on here and I guarantee none of the design team have spent more than a few minutes with an MPC or with Serato Sample. A decade ago Mimic would have been bang on the money but now it just has a bit of short-lived novelty value. Maybe their next sampler will be a bit more current. Set your controls for 2030... :lol:

PhillipOrdonez
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Post 10 Sep 2021

Idk, I have live simpler and sampler... Can they get the same results as mimic? I don't think it is only for standalone, in my case I use both RRP and standalone and I'm very happy with mimic.

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QVprod
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Post 10 Sep 2021

arqui wrote:
10 Sep 2021
QVprod wrote:
10 Sep 2021
Sample One in S1 is not in the same league.
I did not understand what you wanted to put in that it is not in the same league. because Sample One XT is infinitely superior to Mimic (because it is) or inferior.

Minic is a Toy
Sample One XT is a Profesional tool
I don't know if we think the same
DaveyG wrote:
10 Sep 2021
QVprod wrote:
10 Sep 2021
I think Mimic is very underrated here. Perhaps Ableton's simpler is a match ( haven't used it) but Sample One in S1 is not in the same league. Nor are probably most stock samplers. so in that regard, while I agree that Mimic has more general appeal to standalone users because there was no stock equivalent, in both cases (standalone and RPP) it's appealing if a user hasn't already bought a capable 3rd party sampler.

Perhaps one wouldn't upgrade specifically for a sampler, but as part of the overall package it's a really great add that's far more than just basic as some seem to characterize it.

In that way I agree with the tagline that as a package it's the best Reason' looked in years. Pun intended as well; whether or not they realized the pun themselves. (HD graphics and all)

Edit: I did forget S1 updated some functions with the XT version, but I still think Mimic is quicker and simpler to work with for slicing.
Sample One XT is hugely capable. You can drag a bunch of multisamples onto it and if it can find a note name in each filename it will automatically map them sensibly across the keyboard. That was a proper wow moment for me. You can drag a loop onto it and it will slice it automatically and usually as well as Recycle does. You can slice by beat, you can stretch and, get this, it will load Rex files. Imagine that! It's embarrassing that the company that invented the Rex format can't use it in their shiny new sampler. Rex was made for samplers. Mimic is a pale imitation of Ableton's simpler but with less flexibility and more brown. Maybe one day brown will be the new black but today is not that day.

Fact is, Mimic is just OK and nothing more. They hadn't even though about note detection until we mentioned it on here and I guarantee none of the design team have spent more than a few minutes with an MPC or with Serato Sample. A decade ago Mimic would have been bang on the money but now it just has a bit of short-lived novelty value. Maybe their next sampler will be a bit more current. Set your controls for 2030... :lol:
I'll give Sample One the edge as far as multi-samples go, but that's kind of it. The workflow for slicing in Sample One is tedious unless you have a short sample. There's no sensitivity setting. In Mimmic, adjust sensitivity and add/subtract additional markers if needed without having to delete the way too many slices Sample One creates.

As far as rex files, I'm going go on a limb here and say that the rex format doesn't have the same relevancy it did in the past seeing as everything can time stretch now. I don't really purchase sample packs, but the ones I see rarely have rex files in them these days. You can still however load the the individual rex slices in Mimmic which is effectively how Sample One reads a rex file IIRC.

For a stock sampler, you can't deny Mimic is very good for what it is. I'm not going to compare it to MPC or Serato since those aren't stock. As a Machine user, I'm aware there's better slicing workflows but the workflow in S1 is not one of them. If you're not an Ableton user and don't have the 3rd party options like mentioned, it presents functionality you'd otherwise have to do manually in the sequencer.

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avasopht
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Post 10 Sep 2021

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zoidkirb
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Post 10 Sep 2021

Mimic is great, but far from the undisputed best stock sampler.

It can slice, but can't slice to midi like ableton and cubase can.

You can't drag and drop audio from the timeline into it, unlike the others.
Cubase will even allow you to drop a midi clip into it's sampler and it automatically converts it to an audio sample. Now that's a nice workflow.

Carpainter
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Post 10 Sep 2021

QVprod wrote:
10 Sep 2021
For a stock sampler, you can't deny Mimic is very good for what it is.
Agreed, but it sucks that we have to think in those terms. We've been conditioned to accept the fact that stock devices are generally not going to be as robust as the devices they lock behind the RE paywall, and that's a shame.

PhillipOrdonez
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Post 10 Sep 2021

I think it stands on its own. It does many things many do better, but it does things I'm not sure others do our do as well as it does, mainly the sound mangling capabilities beyond recognition of any sample, and I don't mean simple slicing which is fine, it's cool, but you got Rex for that and other samplers, and it does that and other utilitarian stuff enough, but hat's not the reason it is a great instrument. The stretch algorithms and how very quickly you can make something new out of any kind of sample. You can't do this on any of the other samplers on Reason, unless you bring grain on but then it also does a different job that sounds different and there and is completely different workflow, grain is all about granular while mimic does some granular and then the other modes with a different kind of control over the time and the tuning, I think it really sets it apart from all the other samplers in Reason.

Nobody has answered the question, can simpler do the same things mimic can? All of them? Absolutely all of them?

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QVprod
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Post 10 Sep 2021

zoidkirb wrote:
10 Sep 2021
Mimic is great, but far from the undisputed best stock sampler.

It can slice, but can't slice to midi like ableton and cubase can.

You can't drag and drop audio from the timeline into it, unlike the others.
Cubase will even allow you to drop a midi clip into it's sampler and it automatically converts it to an audio sample. Now that's a nice workflow.
I don't think anyone's arguing that it's the king of all stock samplers. Just that it's a good sampler. And I've only mentioned the slicing portion.

That said, the features you mentioned aren't really limitations of Mimic, but of Reason and the RE format itself. You can't drag audio from Reason's timeline to anything.
Carpainter wrote:
10 Sep 2021
QVprod wrote:
10 Sep 2021
For a stock sampler, you can't deny Mimic is very good for what it is.
Agreed, but it sucks that we have to think in those terms. We've been conditioned to accept the fact that stock devices are generally not going to be as robust as the devices they lock behind the RE paywall, and that's a shame.
I think of this differently. The stock version of anything in any DAW is rarely more robust than what's offered for sale as a separate plugin. At current, there is no competitor to Mimic in the RE shop, and I'd be surprised if they were to release a sampler RE.

However this isn't completely true, as some found it to be a big deal when RS made stock devices like Europa and Quartet as they were competitive with REs in the Shop such as Expanse and Chenille.

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MarkTarlton
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Post 10 Sep 2021

I trialed R12 and used up my free 7 day trial, wish it could have been longer, I got the just of everything in the week I had access. My first impression was positive. I think the new combinator will be what makes me bite the bullet, and with a good deal as far as price like Black Friday, but for now I am sticking with R10.

Popey
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Post 11 Sep 2021

PhillipOrdonez wrote:
10 Sep 2021
I think it stands on its own. It does many things many do better, but it does things I'm not sure others do our do as well as it does, mainly the sound mangling capabilities beyond recognition of any sample, and I don't mean simple slicing which is fine, it's cool, but you got Rex for that and other samplers, and it does that and other utilitarian stuff enough, but hat's not the reason it is a great instrument. The stretch algorithms and how very quickly you can make something new out of any kind of sample. You can't do this on any of the other samplers on Reason, unless you bring grain on but then it also does a different job that sounds different and there and is completely different workflow, grain is all about granular while mimic does some granular and then the other modes with a different kind of control over the time and the tuning, I think it really sets it apart from all the other samplers in Reason.

Nobody has answered the question, can simpler do the same things mimic can? All of them? Absolutely all of them?
Can simpler do the same things mimic can? No
Can mimic do the same things simpler can? No

It is always going to come down to personal opinion but I thought mimic brings some new things to rrp users like myself and if I still used solely Reason daw mimic would be my first point of call when sampling as for me it's workflow is vastly superior to other Reason stock sampling options.

My reason+ trial has ended but I did enjoy using mimic and it was probably the best thing in 12 for me (combi 2 is good in rrp but lost a bit of shine having to keep menu diving to assign modulation compared to the speed of mapping combi2 in Reason daw or live's racks).

I personally agree with the review they did of Reason and the added value 12 brings as a rrp user but if I used Reason daw 12 I probably would upgrade. Each to their own of course.

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