Reason 10 announced!

[Exowildebeest]

I think it's a good value for what they are giving. I just don't know if I'll really have a use for these new synths personally.

Things I was hoping for:

-Combinator with modular faders, buttons, knobs, etc.
-Bézier curve automation.

Ah well, those things aren't a big deal anyway.

Back to work.

This would have been a good moment to introduce Combinator 2.0 - to work with the new devices...

[bxbrkrz]

$129 is cheap. As usual it is always fun to read the same people crying while I drink my covfefe. A pinch of salt makes it taste sweeter. The funny thing is I was watching a JXL video just yesterday about the PPG and how you could draw your own waves into the system. He was saying that was still a rare thing to see. Now I'll have it native in Reason. Here is the video:

Around the 7:30 mark. The PPG is a dream machine, but it is cheaper to maintain Reason and you can't combine an infinite amount of PPGs.

TakeMyMoneyProps.png (2.04 KiB) Viewed 3398 times

[Oquasec]

129$ for a big ass update like that? I am glad I saved my pennies then.
Parsec and expanse were steep tho for 150$ each.

[Ostermilk]

Yeah, but there was still plenty of griping at those at the time IIRC.

The thing for me since R8 is the update frequency and the amount of improvements that have been made, so while v10 in itself may involve a fair bit of 'bundling', the bundle looks to be a good one and even today while this is being announced, 9.5.2 has just dropped. So I have no doubt v10 will develop as it goes through it's cycle.

Man, only a few months ago people were still saying VST(i)'s would never happen.

Development seems to be an ongoing thing rather than the old style point to point approach these days and I don't see Reason 10 will remain static throughout its lifecycle.

I'm certainly going to continue the journey this time and see where I end up.

Don't be so darn positive, Ostermilk! You'll be accused of being a Propellerhead employee mole with all of those well measured, thoughtful responses!

I know, it's bad.

I'm quite happy with 9.5 actually, but then again I don't try to run 40+ instances of Kontakt in it or spend much time trying to work out how many more instances of AcmePlugin in A-DAW I can run.

In the real world it takes up less of my time than anything else whilst doing more of the work.

So, a good chunk of new stuff, another full version's worth of software maintenence, seems like a no-brainer. Additionally nobody has seen V10 yet, so it's possible that may even have a few tricks up it's sleeve too.

[firejan82]

More devices from Propellerheads themselves was one of my wishes so I am very much excited about Europa and Grain. Wouldn't mind some new more advanced mixing/mastering/dynamics stuff from Propellerheads and if they added some sort of clip launching I think I would finally feel complete.

[MattiasHG]

So is the Karplus Strong thing just a WT or an actual synth mode? Would like some more in-depth Europa information.

Tricky question to answer, it's both! Europa uses dynamic wavetable generation. We'll get in-depth about that in future videos and stuff, but in short it means that it generates wavetables on the fly which means it can create dynamic algorithms like Karplus Strong and FM feedback.

EDIT #2: WOW. This probably started off as ONE new rack extension and one new IDT device, they just split them up.

Nah, when we outlined the products they started as 2 synths, one focused on cutting edge synthesis á la the modern super synths and one on proper granular synthesis, and 3 sample-based devices in three distinct categories. The reason the 2 synths share a bottom section is that after finishing the first one we liked it so much and realized it'd fit perfectly in both cases. It's super flexible with 4 multi-stage envelopes/LFOs, 3 dedicated LFOs and more.

I can't get the audio samples to play on the What's New page in Chrome - clicking them does nothing

We're on it, hopefully we'll get that fixed tonight! We ran into a new SoundCloud play count limitation we hadn't seen before.

[Exowildebeest]

Nah, when we outlined the products they started as 2 synths, one focused on cutting edge synthesis á la the modern super synths and one on proper granular synthesis, and 3 sample-based devices in three distinct categories. The reason the 2 synths share a bottom section is that after finishing the first one we liked it so much and realized it'd fit perfectly in both cases. It's super flexible with 4 multi-stage envelopes/LFOs, 3 dedicated LFOs and more.

I can't get the audio samples to play on the What's New page in Chrome - clicking them does nothing

We're on it, hopefully we'll get that fixed tonight! We ran into a new SoundCloud play count limitation we hadn't seen before.

1) I hope the FX sections are of high quality (and I assume they're identical in both synths), and not recycled from the IDT stock - those aren't very good imo. But like I said earlier, you guys did a great job at doing the same interface twice while making them visually very distinctive.

2) I guess that's "good bad news" - lots of interest

[Oquasec]

how does it handle 4k monitors though?
Dpi scaling in it yet?

[MattiasHG]

1) I hope the FX sections are of high quality (and I assume they're identical in both synths), and not recycled from the IDT stock - those aren't very good imo. But like I said earlier, you guys did a great job at doing the same interface twice while making them visually very distinctive.

2) I guess that's "good bad news" - lots of interest

Europa and Grain has nothing to do with IDT. The synths have pure "Peter Jubel-algorithms", straight from the mad scientist's brain. Looking forward to share more info with you!

[Loque]

We're on it, hopefully we'll get that fixed tonight! We ran into a new SoundCloud play count limitation we hadn't seen before.

Someone might be interested in Reason 10. Guess that are not bad news

[Exowildebeest]

1) I hope the FX sections are of high quality (and I assume they're identical in both synths), and not recycled from the IDT stock - those aren't very good imo. But like I said earlier, you guys did a great job at doing the same interface twice while making them visually very distinctive.

2) I guess that's "good bad news" - lots of interest

Europa and Grain has nothing to do with IDT. The synths have pure "Peter Jubel-algorithms", straight from the mad scientist's brain. Looking forward to share more info with you!

Awesome

I'm studying the screenshots of Europa and Grain intensely. Already wondering if I can use the auxilliary osc on Grain to do FM on the grain osc

[lowpryo]

I'm actually excited for this in a nostalgia sort of way. I've been off in VST-land but it will be fun to explore some new native Reason synths again. feels like something me 5 years ago would have gone crazy over!

[jayhosking]

For what it's worth:

I started reading these forums around the end of Reason 7, when I had just come back to the program after many years. Reason 8 was an incredible upgrade to workflow, and at the time many here griped about there being no new synths. Reason 9 added Players and a huge new soundbank, both of which I use all the time, but many here griped about no new synths or VST support. Then VST support got patched halfway through the cycle for free, and people griped that VSTs were lousy/bad/not perfectly implemented. Here we are with Reason 10, giving one feature that is exactly what people had been asking for, i.e. new synths, and people are griping again. It's incredible. So many of you seem so deeply unhappy that I doubt any update would please you unless it came with Props employees on their knees grovelling for your specific approval and tailoring to your every whim.

Come on. Would I like video support and better editing tools? Absolutely. Would I like Thor 2.0? Sure, yes. This product isn't 100% the product I want and need. But it is a very, very good product, my favourite to use, inspiring, fun, compelling. I would spend all day on it if I could afford to. And I expect Reason will continue to get better and deliver the features that I want. One thing I wanted was REs like Expanse and Proton but simplified and less demanding on my computer, and hey, look at that, it's here. One thing I wanted was updated drum sounds (truly the bane of making a song with non-acoustic beats in Reason at the moment), and hey, look at that, it's here.

If a few new synths and a few gigs of drum samples isn't enough for you to upgrade, I get it. But you know what? You have 9.5 and it's pretty great. And maybe you have other DAWs or music-making solutions. Go crazy with them. But what I suspect is really happening here is that some people won't ever be satisfied. Is it a perfect upgrade? No, nothing is. But compared to ProTools over the years, or any other software really, Reason continues to impress me with each version and improve on an existing formula without breaking what works about it.

[AttenuationHz]

Might as well rename the thread Reason 11 feature requests

oops wrong thread

[Bod]

They worked earlier but don't anymore. Might be a bandwidth limit somewhere. They're probably working on it...

Probably just Soundcloud being shit as usual.

Working again now.

[tobypearce]

My initial reaction was similar to others: there are core advancements in the program that I was hoping for.

However, a few hours have passed and I'm now seeing sense:

I like the idea of new synths built into Reason. With VST support it makes sense to have some synths that you can't get elsewhere.
As a previous poster has said, Prop-designed devices tend to be very CPU efficient, so Europa is quite exciting.
If Reason 10 was mainly about workflow enhancements, I'm 100% confident people would be wondering where the new synths were, especially for a 10.0 release.

I'm looking forward to this.

[joeyluck]

10.0 might not be for me. But that's ok. We'll see what the point updates will bring. The last version I upgraded on day 1 was Reason 7. I didn't pick up Reason 8 until after 8.3 was released (for RV7k MkII). I got Reason 9 sometimes after 9.1 was released (not for Ableton Link, but because I found myself needing Pitch Edit). So that said, everything will be ok

There are plenty of synths in the shop that I haven't purchased. For instance, Expanse and Proton are both fantastic, but I don't own them. And not because they aren't great, but because I just haven't had a need for them in my current projects. Europa and Grain look great, but just not what I need at the moment.

I already own Radical Piano and Synchronous. The sample libraries have more of my attention, but I have the ReFills by Soundiron; Tuned Micro and Olympus Micro Choir. I'll be interested to see what more Klang and Humana might offer that is different.

Before Reason 6.5, we relied on Propellerhead and Reason updates for new devices. After Rack Extensions were introduced, we were given the freedom and flexibility to add what we wanted to the Rack whenever we needed it. And it's been great. But even after new releases that have brought us many new core features all while having the ability to purchase Rack Extensions at our leisure, many users still have asked for new devices with Reason updates. And I'm happy for those folks that prefer to have content and Rack devices curated for them.

Maybe a solution in the future could be to include a shop voucher with the new version? Propellerhead can still announce/release new devices in conjunction with new versions of Reason, but users can decide from new and old devices and content what they will pick up along with their Reason purchase. I think that would especially help in situations like this where many users already purchased Radical Piano and others who didn't get Synchronous for free might have purchased that as well. I still haven't upgraded Parsec, but maybe I'll just hold off to get it when it's included with Reason down the road...

Speaking of, there is a grace period for having purchased Reason after September 1... How about Radical Piano and Synchronous? What if someone purchased those recently?

I did still have fun watching the awesome video and it felt nostalgic with a new version of Reason being about new Rack devices. But again, times have changed since having the flexibility of purchasing REs from the shop (and now VSTs). I'm sure I'll enjoy Grain when it's in my Rack when I do get around to upgrading for other features. I just recently picked up a Roli Seaboard Block and have been spending a little more time in Garageband just for the mutlitimbral/MPE support and to utilize the Seaboard to it's full capabilities. Would really like to see that in a point update.

Will the the new sounds be found in a new ReFill, 'Reason 10 Sounds'?
I think Reason 9 was off to a great start with the new sounds having their own ReFill, but then it got confusing when old content was added to it. It was so much easier to browse new patches in the beginning when it was only new patches.

[EnochLight]

For what it's worth:

I started reading these forums around the end of Reason 7, when I had just come back to the program after many years. Reason 8 was an incredible upgrade to workflow, and at the time many here griped about there being no new synths. Reason 9 added Players and a huge new soundbank, both of which I use all the time, but many here griped about no new synths or VST support. Then VST support got patched halfway through the cycle for free, and people griped that VSTs were lousy/bad/not perfectly implemented. Here we are with Reason 10, giving one feature that is exactly what people had been asking for, i.e. new synths, and people are griping again. It's incredible. So many of you seem so deeply unhappy that I doubt any update would please you unless it came with Props employees on their knees grovelling for your specific approval and tailoring to your every whim.

Come on. Would I like video support and better editing tools? Absolutely. Would I like Thor 2.0? Sure, yes. This product isn't 100% the product I want and need. But it is a very, very good product, my favourite to use, inspiring, fun, compelling. I would spend all day on it if I could afford to. And I expect Reason will continue to get better and deliver the features that I want. One thing I wanted was REs like Expanse and Proton but simplified and less demanding on my computer, and hey, look at that, it's here. One thing I wanted was updated drum sounds (truly the bane of making a song with non-acoustic beats in Reason at the moment), and hey, look at that, it's here.

If a few new synths and a few gigs of drum samples isn't enough for you to upgrade, I get it. But you know what? You have 9.5 and it's pretty great. And maybe you have other DAWs or music-making solutions. Go crazy with them. But what I suspect is really happening here is that some people won't ever be satisfied. Is it a perfect upgrade? No, nothing is. But compared to ProTools over the years, or any other software really, Reason continues to impress me with each version and improve on an existing formula without breaking what works about it.

Another well measured, great response - and I agree with your post pretty much to the letter.

[lowpryo]

For what it's worth:

I started reading these forums around the end of Reason 7, when I had just come back to the program after many years. Reason 8 was an incredible upgrade to workflow, and at the time many here griped about there being no new synths. Reason 9 added Players and a huge new soundbank, both of which I use all the time, but many here griped about no new synths or VST support. Then VST support got patched halfway through the cycle for free, and people griped that VSTs were lousy/bad/not perfectly implemented. Here we are with Reason 10, giving one feature that is exactly what people had been asking for, i.e. new synths, and people are griping again. It's incredible. So many of you seem so deeply unhappy that I doubt any update would please you unless it came with Props employees on their knees grovelling for your specific approval and tailoring to your every whim.

Come on. Would I like video support and better editing tools? Absolutely. Would I like Thor 2.0? Sure, yes. This product isn't 100% the product I want and need. But it is a very, very good product, my favourite to use, inspiring, fun, compelling. I would spend all day on it if I could afford to. And I expect Reason will continue to get better and deliver the features that I want. One thing I wanted was REs like Expanse and Proton but simplified and less demanding on my computer, and hey, look at that, it's here. One thing I wanted was updated drum sounds (truly the bane of making a song with non-acoustic beats in Reason at the moment), and hey, look at that, it's here.

If a few new synths and a few gigs of drum samples isn't enough for you to upgrade, I get it. But you know what? You have 9.5 and it's pretty great. And maybe you have other DAWs or music-making solutions. Go crazy with them. But what I suspect is really happening here is that some people won't ever be satisfied. Is it a perfect upgrade? No, nothing is. But compared to ProTools over the years, or any other software really, Reason continues to impress me with each version and improve on an existing formula without breaking what works about it.

I agree! it's actually really funny. ever since rack extensions were introduced even, every update cycle had complaints of "why no more native synths???". now we get that update and the complaints are more vocal than ever. if we're being honest the complaints are probably from different groups of people, though. and it just goes to show - you can't please everyone!

[Creativemind]

but can't help thinking, why didn't they update some of the devices they already have such as the Combinator, Thor and the NN-XT?
.

I'm always surprised that so few people understand this idea. How would you feel if 5 years from now or 10 years from now you decided to pull out one of your old compositions and do a little bit of work on it or remix it or edited or change it to included in something new, and you can't because the new version of Reason has changed the old instruments and now you cannot play back your composition from 5 or 10 years ago? If propellerheads changes the native built-in instruments it immediately destroys hundreds of thousands of users musical compositions.

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

Lol! You're completely wrong. It's backwards compatible obviously like new versions of Reason are. Old Subtractor patches would still work on a new Subtractor (say Subtractor 2) but Subtractor 2 patches wouldn't work on the first Subtractor. Like old versions of Reason files work on later versions but not the other way 'round.

[Oquasec]

reason 8 doesn't use reason 9 files, they can update the modules.

[lowpryo]

I'm always surprised that so few people understand this idea. How would you feel if 5 years from now or 10 years from now you decided to pull out one of your old compositions and do a little bit of work on it or remix it or edited or change it to included in something new, and you can't because the new version of Reason has changed the old instruments and now you cannot play back your composition from 5 or 10 years ago? If propellerheads changes the native built-in instruments it immediately destroys hundreds of thousands of users musical compositions.

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

Lol! You're completely wrong. It's backwards compatible obviously like new versions of Reason are. Old Subtractor patches would still work on a new Subtractor (say Subtractor 2) but Subtractor 2 patches wouldn't work on the first Subtractor. Like old versions of Reason work on later versions but not the other way 'round.

you are oversimplifying the problem. if they make backwards compatibility a priority, they are limiting the amount of improvement they can make. for instance, if they gave Subtractor a new sound engine to eliminate the aliasing, that would change how every single patch sounds in subtle or not-so-subtle ways. so if they can't make that improvement, what's the point of a Subtractor 2?

[chaosroyale]

Seeing as the Props seem to be reading this forum:

VST aside, the 2 most common requests for the last couple of years have been:
"combinator with more buttons and faders"
"automatable NN-XT - literally just make all the parameters accessible from a combinators programmer, doesn't even need any new features"

These 2 features would be "a free lunch" for Props: super easy to implement, but solves a huuuuuge pain in the butt for users...but for some reason never forthcoming??

Europa and Grain both look great, and the new drum samples etc are good to attract new users. 10 doesn't look "bad" by any means, but it doesn't feel like an "upgrade", those 2 "tweaks" would be an extremely easy way to get users looking at the upgrade as a completely positive thing.

(oh, and one personal gripe, a switch on the back of the Scream4 to solve that stupid phase issue it has lol)

[TritoneAddiction]

I don't care what anyone says. I'm personally pretty excited about this upgrade. Seems like a lot of fun and useful stuff.
Pretty sure I'll upgrade.

I think it's pretty unreasonable to expect ones particular wishes to come true with every upgrade.

[Creativemind]

A lot of people in this thread seem ticked off that the one or two particular things they want, isn't included. Reason doesn't stop with version 10.

Yeah but how long we gotta wait for simple midi editing features like muting / unmuting notes, note displays and see what key you're pressing in the midi editor. They can put all that effort into making 5, yes 5 new synths but little things like this, along with an undo events list, ganged faders, a notepad, crossfading in the sequencer, manual parameter inputs etc....still missing.