CEO's 2021 review

[dioxide]

People's responses are much more rude and direct on Facebook from what I've seen. At least people here explain themselves.

[dioxide]

I for one welcome our Reason+ tourist friends. We perpetuals have built a lovely place over the last 20 years. I think you're going to enjoy your stay even though it might only be for a month or two. Welcome!

[cymek74]

And maybe 2022 is the year where the whiners who are consistently unhappy with Reason's sequencer will finally discover something like Ableton, Logic, Cubase, etc. RRP integrates super well as a plugin device.

Yeah, if your new car doesn't run right, just buy another car to tow it, problem solved.

[guitfnky]

And maybe 2022 is the year where the whiners who are consistently unhappy with Reason's sequencer will finally discover something like Ableton, Logic, Cubase, etc. RRP integrates super well as a plugin device.

Yeah, if your new car doesn't run right, just buy another car to tow it, problem solved.

I use Ableton. I shouldn’t have to. Reason was in the business of building a DAW for ~10 years. if they don’t want to support the DAW anymore, shit or get off the pot and just kill it.

I want to use Reason as my main tool. I can’t. I’m going to “whine” as long as it takes, for the DAW side of my favorite music making software to be brought into the 21st century.

so…quit your whining.

[huggermugger]

I suspect it is only a matter of time before perpetual is relabeled legacy

^This^

[orthodox]

I want to use Reason as my main tool. I can’t. I’m going to “whine” as long as it takes, for the DAW side of my favorite music making software to be brought into the 21st century.

so…quit your whining.

Some time ago I hoped I could reason the whiners. Because things are the way they are, there is no special relationship between "loyal" customers and the company, RS are doing what they can and so on, so whining is useless.
Now I see that it's useless.

[Tiny Montgomery]

love the dismissive apologists. "it doesn't bother me, so it shouldn't bother you." is there a more juvenile perspective one could have? herp a derp.

It's not about dismissing concerns out of hand or being an apologist.

It's about having a sense of perspective. It's about raising concerns in a manner that's appropriate to the situation. Like not calling people juvenile when they don't agree with you over a small point.

[Popey]

love the dismissive apologists. "it doesn't bother me, so it shouldn't bother you." is there a more juvenile perspective one could have? herp a derp.

The insult to injury comes when the "dismissive apologists" then go on to accuse those who are bothered of whining.

I don't even think this thread is whining or about improvements to reason. This thread to me is more a response to the ceo of Reason possibly putting the boot into perpetual owners for some unknown/unwarranted reason. Either that or it is a joke that the majority did not think funny.

I just forgot it as it to me is the equivalent of some entitled kid in a playground calling names cause they haven't got what they wanted and I cannot be arsed with the childishness. Doesn't make me want to get r+ and give rs some cash that's for sure

[Lov2sing]

I read the CEO’s year end review and think he is right as a investor. When Ernest was CEO it was a inventor making an invention which turned out to be a labor of love. That can sustain a business for a small amount of time. Now if they wanted to give themselves a better subscription model they could have done the following.

Those that want to own Reason and buy it outright for $199.00 you don’t get anything more than stock devices and whatever comes within that year you purchase at retail. That’s what we have at the present time.

Those which are subscribers get all Reason created devices and sub packs for $20.00 a month. That is what we have at the moment.

Now from a investment strategy it seems they are reaping rewards but let’s do the math. Owner spends $199.00 for the year and he can’t use it unless being on the internet. Demo version does the same you do not receive RE’s of Reason and 3rd party creators.
The subscription makes you totally spend $240.00 for the year and you get sound packs; which came from Allaihopa IMO.
Now they have a $10.00 a month sale but only last six months which makes the subscriber spend $180.00 for the year which totals to be a $60.00 a year savings.

Now did RS make more money? They did if more people subscribed than bought however not really. See the owner model ceased to exist when the system stopped being able to be ran unless you’re on the internet. IMO we are all subscribers. One pays up front and saves $41.00 for the year as the monthly subscriber and the other pays it all up front as they pay once a year (now$199.00).

Now to make it so we all have may have our cake then regurgitate and eat it too, here is the ultimate owner / subscription model.
You purchase Reason Studio 12.5 for $149.00 and are obligated to spend $7.99 a month and you get the base model and all the subscription has to offer.

This ends up costing the owner a total of $96.00 more a year plus $149.00 or equals to $245.00 a year.

Benefits would be to have the base model plus sound packs and all the subscription model hast to offers.

Reason elements (No RE’s and only four players) $129.00
Reason 12.5 base model includes RE’s $199.00
Reason 12.5 + $20.00 monthly
Reason Suite ++ $149.00 + $7.99 monthly

That way we all are happy. They get a study stream of money and we get ownership if we like.

If they really want to sweeten the pot then allow us to choose one Reason product if we subscribe for 12 consecutive months.

[orthodox]

That way we all are happy. They get a study stream of money and we get ownership if we like.

I don't understand why we need ownership? To quit the subscription?

[Arrant]

... and you get sound packs; which came from Allaihopa IMO.

Wait, are you saying that RS are stealing the R+ sound packs from user clips uploaded to Allihoopa?
'cause that would be delightfully evil

[guitfnky]

I want to use Reason as my main tool. I can’t. I’m going to “whine” as long as it takes, for the DAW side of my favorite music making software to be brought into the 21st century.

so…quit your whining.

Some time ago I hoped I could reason the whiners. Because things are the way they are, there is no special relationship between "loyal" customers and the company, RS are doing what they can and so on, so whining is useless.
Now I see that it's useless.

this is false. being vocal about what you want is how a company knows what their user base wants.

in fact, it’s more useful than twiddling your thumbs and pretending everything is fine.

[EnochLight]

love the dismissive apologists. "it doesn't bother me, so it shouldn't bother you." is there a more juvenile perspective one could have? herp a derp.

It's not about dismissing concerns out of hand or being an apologist.

It's about having a sense of perspective. It's about raising concerns in a manner that's appropriate to the situation. Like not calling people juvenile when they don't agree with you over a small point.

Meh, don't mind guitfnky. Categorizing people as "dismissive apologists" when they don't agree with him is sort of his thing.

[doze]

Benefits would be to have the base model plus sound packs and all the subscription model hast to offers.

Reason elements (No RE’s and only four players) $129.00
Reason 12.5 base model includes RE’s $199.00
Reason 12.5 + $20.00 monthly
Reason Suite ++ $149.00 + $7.99 monthly

That way we all are happy. They get a study stream of money and we get ownership if we like.

If they really want to sweeten the pot then allow us to choose one Reason product if we subscribe for 12 consecutive months.

Do you work for Microsoft? Please do not give us 10 versions of Reason with handicaps. The problem which any type of scaling feature shutting down version is that it is pretty much useless, unless you just want it for a scratchboard. A Reason that shut's off REs if you aren't subscribing won't be able to play or work with your creations because you won't have those REs available.

The model is okay as it is now (except the upgrade price increase for perpetuals.. that was mean). It allows for different types of users to work with Reason. The perpetual for all the old timers who have significant investments in REs etc, the subscription makes no sense, unless you let them trade in all their purchased Reason Studios REs for cash, or credit to the subscription.

The subscription model I think is good for the casual user who would need like to have a good play with all tools. And fine for a professional or business user (you know you can write off your subscription as a business expense), it also allows you to collaborate by allowing your collaborator quick short-term access to Reason for a minimal expense.

As long as they leave the option and choice between the perpetual and subscription (and maybe bring that perpetual upgrade price down...

Cheers.

[orthodox]

Some time ago I hoped I could reason the whiners. Because things are the way they are, there is no special relationship between "loyal" customers and the company, RS are doing what they can and so on, so whining is useless.
Now I see that it's useless.

this is false. being vocal about what you want is how a company knows what their user base wants.

in fact, it’s more useful than twiddling your thumbs and pretending everything is fine.

I think they have already heard that on several occasions.
And I didn't say everything was fine, I just recognize their freedom to develop their own way.

[guitfnky]

love the dismissive apologists. "it doesn't bother me, so it shouldn't bother you." is there a more juvenile perspective one could have? herp a derp.

It's not about dismissing concerns out of hand or being an apologist.

It's about having a sense of perspective. It's about raising concerns in a manner that's appropriate to the situation. Like not calling people juvenile when they don't agree with you over a small point.

my perspective is that a CEO talking down half their user base is a bad look. your perspective is that I’m overreacting.

which of those perspectives is more valid? perspective is personal. there’s your sense of perspective.

[guitfnky]

It's not about dismissing concerns out of hand or being an apologist.

It's about having a sense of perspective. It's about raising concerns in a manner that's appropriate to the situation. Like not calling people juvenile when they don't agree with you over a small point.

Meh, don't mind guitfnky. Categorizing people as "dismissive apologists" when they don't agree with him is sort of his thing.

when the shoe fits…

[EnochLight]

when the shoe fits…

..it doesn't?

viewtopic.php?p=589867#p589867

[adfielding]

I'm too sensitive here, or does this part of his post is a bit harsh with perpetual license owners (like me)?

I’ll wait right here while you perpetual owners thank your Reason+ subscriber friends, who made it possible for us to have a business model which allows us to continuously release improvements.

I think in the context of the post it fits the tone - I read it more as a playful jibe, but I can see why people would be upset over it. That said, an end of year message to users after a (seemingly) particularly fractious update and controversial introduction of a subscription platform is perhaps not the best time to be poking fun at long-term users!

That said - up until recently I'd wouldn't have said that Reason had a real need for "continuously release[d] improvements". I was generally fine with the old release model of putting out more spaced out, fully-cooked updates.

However folks are enjoying Reason, I'm glad they're enjoying it.

[guitfnky]

when the shoe fits…

..it doesn't?

viewtopic.php?p=589867#p589867

come on man, follow along… my comment about being dismissive and apologists here wasn’t directed at you. you inserted yourself into the convo.

[plaamook]

I for one welcome our Reason+ tourist friends. We perpetuals have built a lovely place over the last 20 years. I think you're going to enjoy your stay even though it might only be for a month or two. Welcome!

[BRIGGS]

Isn't R+ just an extended trial, anyway?

[dakta]

I'm a subscriber but just because its a much lower monthly fee than the outright purchase price (I'm a Yorkshire man) and I like the idea of free updates for life....ultimately I think the choice will be made for us in the end because I suspect not many software companies do have a business model with perpetual ownership.

That said I'd rather own it than rent it (as I tend to be more motivated in learning things when I'm invested). Whilst propellerhead/RS(?) have always been 'there' all they have to do is shut down a server and that's many years of personal projects gone. We have a lot of sentiment and things of personal value in their trust.

Taking the comment as it was quoted in the opening post, whilst the comment probably has an air of reality to it, I don't think there's anything professional about putting that sort of message out, everyone has paid their money under terms propellerhead/RS was happy with at the time and whilst customers support a business, it is the businesses own responsibility to produce goods people want, price it appropriately and balance the books.

[alipi]

CEO posted https://www.reasonstudios.com/blog/2021-review

I'm too sensitive here, or does this part of his post is a bit harsh with perpetual license owners (like me)?

I’ll wait right here while you perpetual owners thank your Reason+ subscriber friends, who made it possible for us to have a business model which allows us to continuously release improvements.

I don't mind a proper roast and jokes in bad taste. This one just felt flat, almost pathetic. Maybe dear CEO can ask for a calculator for Christmas from Santa? The 400 beans I paid to dear CEO this year is at least twice as many as a year's subscription.

Maybe in next year's HD Turbo Gfx update financed by subscriptions the icons and font rendering will be updated?

[StephenHutchinson]

Benefits would be to have the base model plus sound packs and all the subscription model hast to offers.

Reason elements (No RE’s and only four players) $129.00
Reason 12.5 base model includes RE’s $199.00
Reason 12.5 + $20.00 monthly
Reason Suite ++ $149.00 + $7.99 monthly

That way we all are happy. They get a study stream of money and we get ownership if we like.

If they really want to sweeten the pot then allow us to choose one Reason product if we subscribe for 12 consecutive months.

Do you work for Microsoft? Please do not give us 10 versions of Reason with handicaps. The problem which any type of scaling feature shutting down version is that it is pretty much useless, unless you just want it for a scratchboard. A Reason that shut's off REs if you aren't subscribing won't be able to play or work with your creations because you won't have those REs available.

The model is okay as it is now (except the upgrade price increase for perpetuals.. that was mean). It allows for different types of users to work with Reason. The perpetual for all the old timers who have significant investments in REs etc, the subscription makes no sense, unless you let them trade in all their purchased Reason Studios REs for cash, or credit to the subscription.

The subscription model I think is good for the casual user who would need like to have a good play with all tools. And fine for a professional or business user (you know you can write off your subscription as a business expense), it also allows you to collaborate by allowing your collaborator quick short-term access to Reason for a minimal expense.

As long as they leave the option and choice between the perpetual and subscription (and maybe bring that perpetual upgrade price down...

Cheers.

If the subscription price was $9.99 USD per month, I would say that this would attract far more people. I think Native Instruments is coming in with that price point in it's new subscription model. If you think of all you get with the Adobe Creative Cloud for $9.99 a month (Lightroom/Photoshop/Fonts, etc.) that's a bargain. The $20 USD (which for some reason translates into a way higher amount for non-US reason users - i.e. the amount charged is no way in line with normal exchange rates) it begins to look a bit overpriced for what you are getting.

$20/month, and you lose everything if you cancel your subscription. $9.99/a month would have me staying with Reason+. But as it is now, sound packs and the occasional new Reason Studios RE just isn't going to cut it for me when it's time for renewal... the cost being upwards of $245 CAD for the year.

Thankfully I was able to buy Reason upgrade to 12 perpetual from the JRR shop before the $129 offer expired. I've bought Algoritm and Bassline Generator outright. The REs that I won't have, I don't need. These include Reason Drum Kits, Layers, Layers WAVEs, Complex1, Radical Keys, Processed Pianos, and Rotar. All of these I have more or less supplanted with VSTs. Also, I bought the original Reason Drum Kits years ago, (still have the original CD and booklet it came with) and to me they're way better than the current offering.