Budget sound card advice wanted.

[bant]

Longer story : Back in the day it was creative labs for everything and the processor could do some impressive things. Nowadays they reckon I guess all onboard soundcards have new millenia nasa cia technology stolen from the equivalent of the big bang theory cast.

I came back after a good few years away as a novice, still a novice but having made a few things I am really proud of, with artists happy to place vocals on. Those later projects were using a delta 1010 which of course did the job. Can't use it now, no slot for it. Not even sure if it still works.

So I bought a Creative Labs (see previous posts) and I couldn't get it to work with asio and have expected latency, properly and it seemed I was quite unique with that setup but then I have no idea what to buy for a sound card. I keep seeing the Asus Xonar but have no idea.

Shorter story : What budget sound card should I get ?
Should it be PCI e or USB ? I have more faith in PCI e but no real idea.

I just want to hook up a keyboard, have good latency and go back to messing about.

[tomusurp]

Back in the day when I started making music with a cheap used desktop, my first soundcard/audio interface of some sort was an EMU 1212m PCI soundcard. I'll never forget the amazing sound quality of that card

These days I'm a big fan of Audient interfaces (usb). I've tested many interfaces both cheaper and more expensive and they are absolutely best bang for the buck in terms of converters, preamp quality and sound quality in general, and longevity. My first Audient the ID14 first generation still works perfectly since 2019 but recently I upgraded to their ID24 which is just as superb. With these type of interfaces you can use all kinds of analog gear like mics, speakers and some models have an FX insert so you can use effects like compressors and it routes it internally so it goes through their preamp first, then the external effect and back into the interface.

If you just need a basic model with speaker outputs, mic preamps and headphone jack, the ID14 MK2 is perfect

[Benedict]

I thought soundcards were pretty over. The Realtek is actually pretty decent these days for audio alone.

Most people use USB Interfaces and I second Audient altho I have their cheapie-line EVO 4 which is physically a bit kooky but has been a joy to use for about 4 years now.

[bant]

While having a look around today, I saw somethhing about the Behringer UMC stuff. I really know nothing about these USB audio boxes so I would like to know a couple of the most basic things.

While I realise these things can hook up mics and instruments, can they hook up midi keyboards or is there a new way of doing those things too ? At the moment I am guessing the keyboard just connects to USB and somehow these audio interfaces connect to them in the software/reason. And my sound system has two amps, one for subs and one for mids/tops. Both are phono on the back, sony and a cambridge.

Having gone thru the mistake of buying a soundblaster card and not being able to configure the asio, i'd like to get it right this time and end up with a working midi keyboard with tiny latency and a nice clean sound from reason.

I would also like to be able to use this is as a general sound card alternative for my pc. LIstening to youtube, gaming movies etc.

[tomusurp]

While having a look around today, I saw somethhing about the Behringer UMC stuff. I really know nothing about these USB audio boxes so I would like to know a couple of the most basic things.

While I realise these things can hook up mics and instruments, can they hook up midi keyboards or is there a new way of doing those things too ? At the moment I am guessing the keyboard just connects to USB and somehow these audio interfaces connect to them in the software/reason. And my sound system has two amps, one for subs and one for mids/tops. Both are phono on the back, sony and a cambridge.

Having gone thru the mistake of buying a soundblaster card and not being able to configure the asio, i'd like to get it right this time and end up with a working midi keyboard with tiny latency and a nice clean sound from reason.

I would also like to be able to use this is as a general sound card alternative for my pc. LIstening to youtube, gaming movies etc.

depends what computer you have. usb-c is standard today, especially for audio interfaces or midi keyboards. any DAW detects it.

[bant]

I have a recently built 14th gen intel system. 64GB ram and so on. 5 onboard usb sockets.
PCIe 5.0, three PCIe 4.0 M.2, USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 Type-C®, front USB 3.2 Gen 1 Type-C® and Thunderbolt™ (USB4®) header support

I was looking at the behringer deeper and still have questions.

aside from connectability, ie type of wiring/plugs.. can one of these audio interfaces be everything a pc needs in that aside from being good for reason and latency, can it also deal with normal computer audio, browsing, gaming etc ?

the behringer I see has its own 5pin din midi in and out on the back, I wasn't expecting that.
(Behringer U-PHORIA UMC404HD)

of course my m-audio keyboard is usb. Do I just plug it into pc with the audio interface also plugged into usb on the pc too ?

[Arpeg]

Yes, bant. The UMC404 usb goes to PC and your m-audio keyboard goes to PC also. I have the UMC404. If you have any MIDI on your keyboard you most likely will have to connect that to the IN/OUT MIDI slots. My old M-Audio Code25 keyboard needed the MIDI IN/OUT when I had it but I have changed keyboards so all are USB at the moment.

[Tiny Montgomery]

Have look at Arturia Minifuse 1, 2 or 4

2 & 4 have midi connections as well as USB.

The 4, which I have, has a USB hub with two connections (the device needs to be plugged in for this) where I plugin my midi keyboard and Push controller so I dont need to plug them into the laptop. Has been rock solid and you will get a nice selection of software (which I already had but bought it anyway). I also like the fact the 4 has two headphone outs which is great if you're recording with a friend.

Also has a very useful selection of free software, you will love Analog Lab.

Not sure they are "budget" but they are not particularly expensive either.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Arturia-MiniFu ... d_source=1

I used to have a PC and a delta soundcard back in the day. Best not to think in terms of internal soundcards now as others have mentioned. When your USB soundcard is plugged in and you have your speakers connected to it you will be able to do all tasks with sound you did before except now you have nice big volume knob in front of you when that video or music is too loud or quiet. Output windows audio at 100% volume to the soundcard and use the volume control on the box.

[bant]

Yea, they are going beyond my budget sadly. I dont mind paying around £60 but I dont want to then have to buy leads and such. But with that said, I am currently using phono to 3.5mm for both amps. As for the midi, I have the usb to keyboard lead, not the old midi leads.

[Tiny Montgomery]

Yea, they are going beyond my budget sadly. I dont mind paying around £60 but I dont want to then have to buy leads and such. But with that said, I am currently using phono to 3.5mm for both amps. As for the midi, I have the usb to keyboard lead, not the old midi leads.

The basic model is 78 quid on Amazon and they all have USB in so you're covered there for your keyboard. I think what I'm trying to get at is you may get a nice little batch of software and instruments for one card but pay a similar amount for something else and not get anything. It sounds like you're coming back from a long hiatus so always useful to get some good software bundled. You'll see similar bundles with midi keyboards but as you say you already have that.

So how will you be taking the sound from the external soundcard to the speakers and what will you be using? Sounds to me like you may be better off just using ASIO4ALL drivers on your current soundcard and setup if you're just taking a single phono out into some general PC speaker set up and see how you get on.

[bant]

My setup currently

14700k in an asus prime b760 board - reason 11 and windows 11
Sound Blaster Z - I couldn't get the asio4 all working properly. I came here for help but no joy at getting low latency. viewtopic.php?f=12&t=7535030&p=668450#p668450
3.5mm jack outs to :
Sony Amp (phono) powering 2x "12 pioneer subs in ported Qubes
Cambridge amp (phono) powering 4 mid/top pioneers 5.1/4 & 6.5" in 3d printed Qubes

M-audio 49 with usb lead.

[Tiny Montgomery]

Is this any help?

http://forum.cakewalk.com/ASIO-and-Soun ... 90457.aspx

[Tiny Montgomery]

My advice to you is find the cheapest decent external sound card (50 - 70) and then get some speakers (£116) eg:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/PreSonus-Eris- ... d_source=1

Ditch that cinema speaker system for doing tunes and having a jam. Spend a small amount to get the two cables you need between the sound card and the new speakers and you're golden. We're talking considerably less than 200 notes to make this happen.

[bant]

sigh

[tomusurp]

I have a recently built 14th gen intel system. 64GB ram and so on. 5 onboard usb sockets.
PCIe 5.0, three PCIe 4.0 M.2, USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 Type-C®, front USB 3.2 Gen 1 Type-C® and Thunderbolt™ (USB4®) header support

I was looking at the behringer deeper and still have questions.

aside from connectability, ie type of wiring/plugs.. can one of these audio interfaces be everything a pc needs in that aside from being good for reason and latency, can it also deal with normal computer audio, browsing, gaming etc ?

the behringer I see has its own 5pin din midi in and out on the back, I wasn't expecting that.
(Behringer U-PHORIA UMC404HD)

of course my m-audio keyboard is usb. Do I just plug it into pc with the audio interface also plugged into usb on the pc too ?

I haven't tested this interface but I'm sure it will still be an upgrade for you. All these USB interfaces can be selected as the sound output for everything. I would still recommend the Audient simply off sound quality and you can get the iD14 mk2 model for much cheaper on Thomann. If you can wait a bit and save up somehow it would be worth it. If you can't the cheaper options would still be good upgrades

[Tiny Montgomery]

sigh

Bit of a dismissive reply from someone on their 2nd thread of trying to get their soundblaster and 2005 consumer cinema speaker system up and running with a modern DAW. Only trying to help mate. Starting to think this is "a bit" Very niche and clever if so.

If you wanted to do something about it we all know there is a wealth of info out there, its really not rocket science, bye.

[bant]

sigh

Bit of a dismissive reply from someone on their 2nd thread of trying to get their soundblaster and 2005 consumer cinema speaker system up and running with a modern DAW. Only trying to help mate. Starting to think this is "a bit" Very niche and clever if so.

If you wanted to do something about it we all know there is a wealth of info out there, its really not rocket science, bye.

TM I am looking for a sound card solution that I can afford. I'd be interested in the solution given what I have to work with, not advised to spend 3x as much on stuff I don't need or want. I bet those monitors are nice but they aren't a solution I can go for or need. I appreciate the time and effort but I have been trying to get this done for some months now and not finding much in the way of a solution that ticks boxes, without me needing to spend money i don't have.

"Ditch that cinema speaker system" didn't go down too well. I'm not here for any advice on it either.

[bant]

I have a recently built 14th gen intel system. 64GB ram and so on. 5 onboard usb sockets.
PCIe 5.0, three PCIe 4.0 M.2, USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 Type-C®, front USB 3.2 Gen 1 Type-C® and Thunderbolt™ (USB4®) header support

I was looking at the behringer deeper and still have questions.

aside from connectability, ie type of wiring/plugs.. can one of these audio interfaces be everything a pc needs in that aside from being good for reason and latency, can it also deal with normal computer audio, browsing, gaming etc ?

the behringer I see has its own 5pin din midi in and out on the back, I wasn't expecting that.
(Behringer U-PHORIA UMC404HD)

of course my m-audio keyboard is usb. Do I just plug it into pc with the audio interface also plugged into usb on the pc too ?

I haven't tested this interface but I'm sure it will still be an upgrade for you. All these USB interfaces can be selected as the sound output for everything. I would still recommend the Audient simply off sound quality and you can get the iD14 mk2 model for much cheaper on Thomann. If you can wait a bit and save up somehow it would be worth it. If you can't the cheaper options would still be good upgrades

Yea, $169 is too much for me. I would need leads and stuff on top. I read the behringer UMC range is a much better solution for my budget but I just wanted to know if it will tick all the boxes. I know it is has a quality sound. But I would like to figure out the wiring solution too.

=======

Honestly guys, I appreciate the help. I truly do. I just want to play about and have a bit of fun. I've done the dream and released with artists which was my life goal but had to pack up for a good few years. Tech has changed and left me behind a bit.

[bant]

Is this any help?

http://forum.cakewalk.com/ASIO-and-Soun ... 90457.aspx

Yea, I saw that info out there when i was first here. It didnt help me as i was already on the right setting.

I could press keys and see reaction on reason but was getting no audio at all.

[esme]

anything with an asio driver is good

[PhillipOrdonez]

I think I read you’re using a mini jack plug for your speakers, and I’m guessing you got two of those, you will need to get new plugs cause all interfaces have 1/4 inch jack or xlr outs for the most part. Some might have a single mini jack output for headphones (stereo) but that output might or might not drive your speakers (I presume they don’t need amplification?)

These interfaces of course work with everything not only daw so you can use them to output audio to your speakers from YouTube etc.

Given your MIDI keyboard connects via usb, you don’t need to worry about finding one with 5pin MIDI outs. The MIDI won’t talk to the interface, the software does the talking directly with the MIDI.

Good luck with your ghetto project. Best wishes and hope you get it sorted pronto. Cheerios

[Tiny Montgomery]

Any usb soundcard you buy will be a waste of money with the speaker set up you wish to use. You asked for advice and that's it. Even if you got ASIO working on your current set up making music with that speaker set up will be a shit show. You say you have previous experience but it's not evident in your responses. Money is tight for everybody. I've maintained my hobby on some right shonky setups as I tried to help raise two step kids. I'm lucky enough to have a few quid now but I'll never own a house and I'm still using the Yamaha MSP monitors I bought in 2001.You would rather waste people's time than do 20 mins research and save up for a few months to achieve a small thing you desire. Won't be engaging further.

[bant]

I think I read you’re using a mini jack plug for your speakers, and I’m guessing you got two of those, you will need to get new plugs cause all interfaces have 1/4 inch jack or xlr outs for the most part. Some might have a single mini jack output for headphones (stereo) but that output might or might not drive your speakers (I presume they don’t need amplification?)

These interfaces of course work with everything not only daw so you can use them to output audio to your speakers from YouTube etc.

Given your MIDI keyboard connects via usb, you don’t need to worry about finding one with 5pin MIDI outs. The MIDI won’t talk to the interface, the software does the talking directly with the MIDI.

Good luck with your ghetto project. Best wishes and hope you get it sorted pronto. Cheerios

Thanks Phillip. I think I will go for the UMC because its in budget and high ranking with solutions 10x the price. Looks like I need 2x mono jack to split phono for the output to two amps and I am good.


As long as the midi side then works with reason and low latency, its a solution I can live with. I'm not looking for anything magical to happen again but who knows. I can face that if it were to happen but I am fully humble and thankful for the time and energy. Thank you.

[PhillipOrdonez]

Be mindful that the latency is a function of your cpu and your project (how cpu intensive the project is) so do not expect magic there

[selig]

While I realise these things can hook up mics and instruments, can they hook up midi keyboards or is there a new way of doing those things too ? At the moment I am guessing the keyboard just connects to USB and somehow these audio interfaces connect to them in the software/reason. And my sound system has two amps, one for subs and one for mids/tops. Both are phono on the back, sony and a cambridge.

Does the sub woofer not have a pass through to go on to the main speakers? Almost every sub I’ve ever seen (consumer or pro) has this feature unless it is super high end.
The usual setup is out of the line outs of your interface, into the sub, out of the sub into the left and right monitor. It is HIGHLY suggested to connect this way if possible so your system is properly crossed over.
I have an old NHT “home theater” sub that’s over 20 years old and still works, has RCA inputs and outputs and I have it on my “B” system for hardware synths. I connect out of my synth mixer 1/4” to RCA cables, then RCA to 1/4” back up to the main speakers.
One issue with using multiple outputs to feed the sub and mains separately is how to control the overall volume, which will typically only affect one set of outputs.

That cable you posted is not going to work unless I missed something…