How do you use clippers

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Popey
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05 Jul 2022

As most of you know I have been busy learning how to create music over the last couple of years and am interested in how people use clippers as I have not ever done so yet.

My question is not so much how to operate a clipper but more use cases in your projects. I have read a few things online but finding some conflicting info so thought I would ask the good people here.

Why would you choose a clipper over say compression or limiting? Any comments appreciated.

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MrFigg
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05 Jul 2022

Like this…
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Popey
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05 Jul 2022

MrFigg wrote:
05 Jul 2022
Like this…
:lol: I must admit I half expected a hair clipper gag on this post. As a ex hairdresser I am OK with that type Mr Figg but it did make me chuckle.

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Djstarski
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05 Jul 2022


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Loque
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05 Jul 2022

I use it to shape the sound, rather than catching peaks. It is a good distortion-like thing (wave-shaper). I love it for 303-like sounds and sometimes for kicks too. I dont think they use transfer-functions, but more managing the peaks only and not like a limiter, which tries to beware the original characteristic.
Reason12, Win10

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deeplink
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05 Jul 2022

Here is a mixing strategy that involves clippers. And is geared towards getting your mix louder - if you do make loud edm style music.

You may not implement the mix strategy, but you can learn a lot about clippers in this series.

https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLxik ... dMxh3PXxJx
Get more Combinators at the deeplink website

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dan_g
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05 Jul 2022

i use clippers especially for my drum buss to glue the drums together and prevent clipping. this is needed because i do heavy bass music and need to manage my levels. also my bass buss gets clipping applied sometimes.
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Popey
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05 Jul 2022

Djstarski wrote:
05 Jul 2022
Thanks that video was very useful and well explained 👍

Popey
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05 Jul 2022

Loque wrote:
05 Jul 2022
I use it to shape the sound, rather than catching peaks. It is a good distortion-like thing (wave-shaper). I love it for 303-like sounds and sometimes for kicks too. I dont think they use transfer-functions, but more managing the peaks only and not like a limiter, which tries to beware the original characteristic.
Thanks Loque you backed up what I read and that they affect the sound in different ways with limiting usually more transparent. Just need to try using clippers this weekend to understand where they fit best in my own work but you have given me some good pointers, appreciate it.

Popey
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05 Jul 2022

deeplink wrote:
05 Jul 2022
Here is a mixing strategy that involves clippers. And is geared towards getting your mix louder - if you do make loud edm style music.

You may not implement the mix strategy, but you can learn a lot about clippers in this series.

https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLxik ... dMxh3PXxJx
Thanks deeplink, lots of content there for me to watch and get my head round after work.

Popey
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05 Jul 2022

dan_g wrote:
05 Jul 2022
i use clippers especially for my drum buss to glue the drums together and prevent clipping. this is needed because i do heavy bass music and need to manage my levels. also my bass buss gets clipping applied sometimes.
Thanks for informing me of your use of clippers it gives me a good place to start trying clipping and experiment with different clipping types. Appreciate you taking the time to respond and assist me.

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crimsonwarlock
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05 Jul 2022

-------
Analog tape ⇒ ESQ1 sequencer board ⇒ Atari/Steinberg Pro24 ⇒ Atari/Cubase ⇒ Cakewalk Sonar ⇒ Orion Pro/Platinum ⇒ Reaper ⇒ Reason DAW.

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DaveyG
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05 Jul 2022

MrFigg wrote:
05 Jul 2022
Like this…
Say, he's a good lookin' guy. I wonder what happened to him. Image

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MrFigg
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05 Jul 2022

DaveyG wrote:
05 Jul 2022
MrFigg wrote:
05 Jul 2022
Like this…
Say, he's a good lookin' guy. I wonder what happened to him. Image
He left the building apparently.
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selig
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05 Jul 2022

I use clippers as the most aggressive solution to adding loudness, with things like soft tape saturation or 2:1 gentle compression at the bottom of the list. Limiting and Leveller applications are generally second from the top of the list. I typically use soft clipping, and can use it quite aggressively even on acoustic instruments. It's not just for super aggressive hard hitting music, it can be quite useful for any situation where transients are so out of line with what is desired/needed.

Years ago I read about intentional clipping for samples (Keyboard Mag middle 1980s I'm thinking). I was having trouble with a percussion sample kit on my S900, and read you can get away with a few milliseconds of clipping on most transient sounds without the ear detecting it as 'clipping'. So I just clipped the sample I was struggling to get as loud as the rest (a timbale IIRC) and all of the sudden "there it was". Didn't sound clipped, actually didn't sound any different just louder. I was using Alchemy sample editor on a Mac at the time, so I could zoom in and make sure my clipping lasted less than 5 ms or so. I didn't need that much level so I believe it only clipped for 2-3 ms max.

That was all it took to show me the power and simplicity of creative clipping, and I use it still to this day - just had a mix where there were tons of guitar hammer-ons and cello plucking and slapping (for percussion). Despite the acoustic quality of the mix, soft clipping was the only way I was able to get the average level up to where they wanted to hear it, and IMO it sounded fantastic (will post a link when it is released).
Selig Audio, LLC

Popey
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05 Jul 2022

selig wrote:
05 Jul 2022
I use clippers as the most aggressive solution to adding loudness, with things like soft tape saturation or 2:1 gentle compression at the bottom of the list. Limiting and Leveller applications are generally second from the top of the list. I typically use soft clipping, and can use it quite aggressively even on acoustic instruments. It's not just for super aggressive hard hitting music, it can be quite useful for any situation where transients are so out of line with what is desired/needed.

Years ago I read about intentional clipping for samples (Keyboard Mag middle 1980s I'm thinking). I was having trouble with a percussion sample kit on my S900, and read you can get away with a few milliseconds of clipping on most transient sounds without the ear detecting it as 'clipping'. So I just clipped the sample I was struggling to get as loud as the rest (a timbale IIRC) and all of the sudden "there it was". Didn't sound clipped, actually didn't sound any different just louder. I was using Alchemy sample editor on a Mac at the time, so I could zoom in and make sure my clipping lasted less than 5 ms or so. I didn't need that much level so I believe it only clipped for 2-3 ms max.

That was all it took to show me the power and simplicity of creative clipping, and I use it still to this day - just had a mix where there were tons of guitar hammer-ons and cello plucking and slapping (for percussion). Despite the acoustic quality of the mix, soft clipping was the only way I was able to get the average level up to where they wanted to hear it, and IMO it sounded fantastic (will post a link when it is released).
Thanks selig appreciate the info. I am now watching the videos people linked and am starting to understand their use a bit better. Tried a few rudimentary tests and surprised how much you can clip without audible differences.

I think this will help me once I finish learning/understanding as although I am not overly concerned with any loudness wars I would prefer my music to be in the same ballpark as references. At the moment when mastering I obviously have too many peaks so sacrifice volume to maintain the mix as intended instead of destroying it by pushing too far.

Popey
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06 Jul 2022

crimsonwarlock wrote:
05 Jul 2022
Thanks for the link. Interesting that a couple of posters linked the same you tuber but I can see why as I am finding this easy to understand and learning loads. Appreciate the help 👍

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selig
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06 Jul 2022

Popey wrote:
05 Jul 2022

Thanks selig appreciate the info. I am now watching the videos people linked and am starting to understand their use a bit better. Tried a few rudimentary tests and surprised how much you can clip without audible differences.

I think this will help me once I finish learning/understanding as although I am not overly concerned with any loudness wars I would prefer my music to be in the same ballpark as references. At the moment when mastering I obviously have too many peaks so sacrifice volume to maintain the mix as intended instead of destroying it by pushing too far.
For me it is not about loudness wars, or even overall loudness 90% of the time - it is about all tracks working together in a mix, which in this context means all tracks with similar crest factor (loudness, peak to average level, etc.). You can’t really mix a high crest factor with a low crest factor track, they need to be more similar to ‘gel’. This is because a track with heavy transients can only be pushed so far in a mix before it clips the output, while a track without transients can be pushed much higher.
Bottom line, it IS possible, especially for modern genres, for individual tracks to have too much transient energy especially when compared to other tracks in the same mix.
Selig Audio, LLC

Popey
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Posts: 2062
Joined: 04 Jul 2018

06 Jul 2022

selig wrote:
06 Jul 2022
Popey wrote:
05 Jul 2022

Thanks selig appreciate the info. I am now watching the videos people linked and am starting to understand their use a bit better. Tried a few rudimentary tests and surprised how much you can clip without audible differences.

I think this will help me once I finish learning/understanding as although I am not overly concerned with any loudness wars I would prefer my music to be in the same ballpark as references. At the moment when mastering I obviously have too many peaks so sacrifice volume to maintain the mix as intended instead of destroying it by pushing too far.
For me it is not about loudness wars, or even overall loudness 90% of the time - it is about all tracks working together in a mix, which in this context means all tracks with similar crest factor (loudness, peak to average level, etc.). You can’t really mix a high crest factor with a low crest factor track, they need to be more similar to ‘gel’. This is because a track with heavy transients can only be pushed so far in a mix before it clips the output, while a track without transients can be pushed much higher.
Bottom line, it IS possible, especially for modern genres, for individual tracks to have too much transient energy especially when compared to other tracks in the same mix.
I get what you mean (had to Google crest factor) and I think I am slowly understanding how important this is on a mix. My tracks so far have had these issues hence why I cannot get to the same levels without the mix collapsing when comparing with commercial reference songs.

Really appreciate the assistance with this as hungry to learn and understand the tools so I can make informed decisions. Looking forward to trying to apply all the info kindly given.

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