Speculation thread - RS releasing new device

[Creativemind]

Radical Castanets.

I still live in hope of seeing Radical Kazoo

Or Radical Washboard. Now that would be radical. Lol!

[Billy+]

I still live in hope of seeing Radical Kazoo

Or Radical Washboard. Now that would be radical. Lol!

Both devices sound interesting and all that is missing is for panda to release PSQ Spoons

[Creativemind]

In the chief product officer's roadmap update from November 2021 he referred to the upcoming device as "a modern take on a classic effect".

So 'classic effect' could either mean an effect type that is considered classic (reverb, delay, filter, vocoder, chorus, fuzz etc), or a specific real FX hardware device released in the past that is lauded as a classic (Mutron Biphase, EMS vocoder 5000, Roland Space Echo RE-201 etc).

I'm going to say it's the former, and in recent years Reason has got fairly new filter/chorus/phase/flange devices, with Quartet and Sweeper. Another vocoder is a possibility i suppose given the popularity of vox FX stuff in modern productions, it seems a bit much to me though to have two dedicated vocoders in the rack, plus Neptune which does vocal FX and synth stuff.

So I'm going to guess that the device coming falls into either the delay/reverb category or distortion. The Echo, RV7000 and Scream 4 are all long in the tooth and there is likely much more that RS feel they could add in that area.

If I had to narrow down my guess, I'll say it's a new creative delay effect.

Yeah, after narrowing it down with what's been released recently, delay does seem like the last classic effect left, apart from vocoder. Something tells me it's not a vocoder though, not sure why, just a hunch.

So what could be a twist on delay, something using CV or a Matrix type thing perhaps?

[Creativemind]

My guess: a sequenced distortion/mangler. Possibly inspired/influenced by Mick Gordon's Doom instrument.

I forgot about distortion, good call with there with sequenced distortion / mangler. I'd also add Reason doesn't have a stock transient shaper (yes I know there's technically a basic one in Kong), a stock exciter, a stock de-esser or a stock waveshaper but maybe they aren't considered classic effects.

[Creativemind]

Or Radical Washboard. Now that would be radical. Lol!

Both devices sound interesting and all that is missing is for panda to release PSQ Spoons

[Loque]

In the chief product officer's roadmap update from November 2021 he referred to the upcoming device as "a modern take on a classic effect".

So 'classic effect' could either mean an effect type that is considered classic (reverb, delay, filter, vocoder, chorus, fuzz etc), or a specific real FX hardware device released in the past that is lauded as a classic (Mutron Biphase, EMS vocoder 5000, Roland Space Echo RE-201 etc).

I'm going to say it's the former, and in recent years Reason has got fairly new filter/chorus/phase/flange devices, with Quartet and Sweeper. Another vocoder is a possibility i suppose given the popularity of vox FX stuff in modern productions, it seems a bit much to me though to have two dedicated vocoders in the rack, plus Neptune which does vocal FX and synth stuff.

So I'm going to guess that the device coming falls into either the delay/reverb category or distortion. The Echo, RV7000 and Scream 4 are all long in the tooth and there is likely much more that RS feel they could add in that area.

If I had to narrow down my guess, I'll say it's a new creative delay effect.

Interesting thoughts...

Within the last weeks, more and more i think, that Reason has quite a lot of instruments and fx. And sadly, instead of improving one, they pull out another one. Its like we have 6 Delays? 3 or 4 Chorus? A trillion Distortions? 3 reverbs or more? 2 Vocoders and a tuner, which can sound like a vocal-synth? And so on and so forth...

And ofc we have a big bunch of synths, which have there uniquness and overlaps, but no synth that has it all and you are somewhat limited any time you use a synth, which might be good or bad, depending on the point of view...

Maybe we can create a table counting each fx and synth, and see which type does not have more than 3 to 5 devices and the type with the most least fx types which fits the category "modern take of a classic" is the new device.

[Hoboys]

The only thing I'm sort of missing with Reason now is a flavored mastering chain with mid-side control like the Abbey Road TG - that would've been really nice. dynamic EQ and a dynamic compressor would have also been nice. Sure, I could wire all of this up with something like Red Rock Sound 180+181+302 (which I'm doing now), but doing it every time is just meh...

[Timmy Crowne]

Within the last weeks, more and more i think, that Reason has quite a lot of instruments and fx. And sadly, instead of improving one, they pull out another one.

Agree. The plug-and-play philosophy of Reason leads me to believe we’ll get another “vintage with a twist” hardware emulation that could indeed be drool-worthy, but will inevitably overlap stock devices. Maybe a multi-tap delay unit, or a reverb that uses grains to stretch a sound indefinitely, or a compressor that is pre-wired for EDM pumping effects.

I think the area that has the most room for innovation would be a CV patchbay with logic functions, the kind of stuff that exists in the modular world. Think Turing Machine or Marbles from Mutable Instruments. But that kind of stuff is hard to sell if the philosophy is “we want you to open Reason and make music immediately.”

A good compromise in my opinion would be an EQ like Unfilter or Frei-raum or Soothe . Something that uses AI to remove harshness and speed up the mixing process.

[rorystorm]

Within the last weeks, more and more i think, that Reason has quite a lot of instruments and fx. And sadly, instead of improving one, they pull out another one.

Agree. The plug-and-play philosophy of Reason leads me to believe we’ll get another “vintage with a twist” hardware emulation that could indeed be drool-worthy, but will inevitably overlap stock devices. Maybe a multi-tap delay unit, or a reverb that uses grains to stretch a sound indefinitely, or a compressor that is pre-wired for EDM pumping effects.

I think the area that has the most room for innovation would be a CV patchbay with logic functions, the kind of stuff that exists in the modular world. Think Turing Machine or Marbles from Mutable Instruments. But that kind of stuff is hard to sell if the philosophy is “we want you to open Reason and make music immediately.”

A good compromise in my opinion would be an EQ like Unfilter or Frei-raum or Soothe . Something that uses AI to remove harshness and speed up the mixing process.

I've been wanting a Turing Machine like device for ages, so that woukd be awesome. But I agree, unlikely.

[rootwheel]

Given there is perhaps no more revered FX box in history than the Eventide H3000, I wonder if it's something based on that? It's definitely a classic given it originally came out in 1986.

I know we've already got Polar, so there is some overlap in terms of pitch shifting, but there's loads more that the H3000 can do - all of which which would be really cool to have in a new multi FX device by Reason Studios.

[TritoneAddiction]

Personally I'm hoping for either a delay, reverb or distortion device.
If they made a new dedicated RE with any of those I imagine they would throw some new fun stuff in there to make things interesting.

[Mataya]

Personally, I don't understand why would you need another delay or distortion from RS? We have all kinds of reverb's, delay's and distortions from different Re developers. I simply don't understand why they don't want to improve, modernize, update existing devices? Feels like they loose a code after programming a device or they don't have the rights to use it again. Every DAW I own for years now improved on existing devices and only RS is making new ones again and again. I don't want anything new, just update the old ones and I'll pay...I'll pay again. We get updates on hardware pieces and they can't update a stupid flanger, instead they make a new one.
Ok, waiting for unaffiliated people to make excuses for the weirdest company.

Jeez

[avasopht]

Personally, I don't understand why would you need another delay or distortion from RS? We have all kinds of reverb's, delay's and distortions from different Re developers. I simply don't understand why they don't want to improve, modernize, update existing devices? Feels like they loose a code after programming a device or they don't have the rights to use it again. Every DAW I own for years now improved on existing devices and only RS is making new ones again and again. I don't want anything new, just update the old ones and I'll pay...I'll pay again. We get updates on hardware pieces and they can't update a stupid flanger, instead they make a new one.
Ok, waiting for unaffiliated people to make excuses for the weirdest company.

Jeez

What's the difference?

1. Old device + New device using new features.

vs

2. Old device updated with new features.

In both instances, you get the new features anyway. However in the second case, whatever new features you add, the device would have to support the old functions (which might be in conflict with the new features) otherwise it would mess up everyone's projects using the old device.

Just seems like complaining for the sake of complaining.

And who says they're not reusing any old code?

[Mataya]

Why would I complain for the sake of complaining for god sake? Like I've said, other DAW's did that perfectly. I'm using Nuendo since ver 3 in my day job, so far, no problem with backward compatibility. Same in FL studio.
Second, RS already did exactly what I'm talking about with RV7000 and it was a delight to see and hear. No backward compatibility, just more out of the same. Excellent! Why did they stop there, I don't understand. For other devices that would possibly suffer compatibility issues, why not "legacy mode"...seen that in FL studio. Works great.
The fact that I even have to explain more about this subject shows that we are in completely different thinking zones and seems there's no point is discussing it further.
Don't know what else to say really...ok, give us a couple of more delays and flangers and please make them revolutionary once again.

I'm pretty sure they'r using the same code. Do a fresh gui, add a small extra feature here and there and make a new device with a new price. I'm not saying they should stop making new devices and only update existing ones. I'm saying, sure, make a new reverb emulation of maybe AMS machine. And next year an EMT emulation. That's what other RE developers are doing and it's amazing. Just don't understand why not upgrade a BIG collection of old devices.

tx
M

[DaveyG]

why not upgrade a BIG collection of old devices.

Because it's harder to charge money for it.

[Mataya]

Seems like that. I mean how can Re developers update their devices, without causing problems and RS can't? I bought sequences from Robotic and after that the guy updates it to an even more amazing player. Same with Step Note Recorder. ABL303...Expanse...Jiggery Pokery Chenille...Noise engineering.

Just don't say to me I'm complaining for the sake of it. Because seems you're expressing the opposite opinion just for the sake of it.

M

[tronam]

The devices list is already a mile long navigation challenge. All I want is an oversampling button in Subtractor. Is that too much to ask?

[riemac]

The devices list is already a mile long navigation challenge. All I want is an oversampling button in Subtractor. Is that too much to ask?

Yes, I've always wanted that aswell.

[Loque]

The devices list is already a mile long navigation challenge. All I want is an oversampling button in Subtractor. Is that too much to ask?

Yes it is. The last 20 years of asking proved it.

[tronam]

The devices list is already a mile long navigation challenge. All I want is an oversampling button in Subtractor. Is that too much to ask?

Yes it is. The last 20 years of asking proved it.

Even the Nord Leads were oversampling to 96KHz 20 years ago.

[thedude]

yeah, oversampled and ZDF designed subtractor would be absolutely amazing - same as thor. The bones of those synths are excellent - would be awesome to improve the audio engine to UHE/Synapse levels.

[avasopht]

Seems like that. I mean how can Re developers update their devices, without causing problems and RS can't? I bought sequences from Robotic and after that the guy updates it to an even more amazing player. Same with Step Note Recorder. ABL303...Expanse...Jiggery Pokery Chenille...Noise engineering.

Just don't say to me I'm complaining for the sake of it. Because seems you're expressing the opposite opinion just for the sake of it.

M

I never said it's not possible to update them.

You were simply unclear about what you meant, so I could only explain to what you had said so far.

It sounded like you meant that instead of creating a new device like Europa, they would instead put Europa's new features into subtractor. That's why I said it would break backwards compatibility.

But what it sounds like you mean now is just further enhancing old devices in their own way.

Well, of course they could. They've just instead chosen to create new devices.

I'd also much like to see the older ones enhanced with options like oversampling, built in unison, and more audio/CV modulation options.

But they opt for simplicity and committing to a finalised vision.

So instead of enhancing subtractor, we get Complex. Instead of enhancing the FM in Thor, we get Algoritm.

Either way, there will always be complaints. Complaints they're wasting time enhancing old devices, or wasting time developing new ones.

Complaints they're wasting their time developing rack devices and not enough UI improvements, or vice versa complaints.

[crimsonwarlock]

Synapse Junglist was a very nice synthesizer. I was always hoping they would update/expand it, but instead they decided to do stupid things like developing new instruments instead, like Dune, Antidote, Legend. Terrible developer behavior. I'm pretty sure they simply recycled their old codebase as well.

[deigm]

The Reason Studios LA2A. It's a classic, and as someone who came to the party too late to pick up this RE I'd love to see a new one.

[selig]

yeah, oversampled and ZDF designed subtractor would be absolutely amazing - same as thor. The bones of those synths are excellent - would be awesome to improve the audio engine to UHE/Synapse levels.

Obligatory comment that ZDF designs don't change the sound of the filters overall, just the response at higher resonance settings at higher frequencies or with audio rate modulation as I understand it. At lower Q settings there should be no difference in the 'sound' or 'quality' of the filter, but someone please correct me if I'm wrong on this!