Does Reason need to join the party and get its own controller?

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avasopht
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Post 19 Feb 2021

Specialized controllers are on the rise.

Korg Akai (who manufactured the original Ableton Push) and Native Instruments now have their own dedicated controllers. Roland has hot software/hardware integration to the point you can share Zen Core patches between hardware and software and even load them on the new 606.

Rack Extensions can immediately be compiled to run on new hardware (which RS have already demoed).

Is a Reason specific controller inevitable, or a must?
Last edited by avasopht on 20 Feb 2021, edited 1 time in total.
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bxbrkrz
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Post 19 Feb 2021

With, or without more private equity injection?
757365206c6f67696320746f207365656b20616e73776572732075736520726561736f6e20746f2066696e6420776973646f6d

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Billy+
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Post 19 Feb 2021

Well I know it's not it's own controller but the P6 integration is pretty good.

Having it locked to the mixer & using it across devices is just sweet!
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Heater
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Post 19 Feb 2021

I don’t the they are interested in hardware at all.

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Billy+
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Post 19 Feb 2021

I think they should stick with getting the software up to spec
Image

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Loque
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Post 19 Feb 2021

No. But somehow Arturia seem to make some good deals.
:reason: 11, Win10 64Bit.

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dioxide
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Post 19 Feb 2021

All they have to do is employ someone to make high quality maps for third party controllers. That's much cheaper and less risky than designing and manufacturing your own hardware.

Also make them easier to share. A repository of maps with an easy installation system. That way you could try several different mapping options and users could create and share their own. DJ Techtools used to have a repository for DJ controllers but it looks like it is down now.

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Aosta
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Post 19 Feb 2021

As was said I don't think that is the direction the company is heading at all.
Tend the flame

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challism
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Post 19 Feb 2021

I would vote NO on this. There are plenty of good controllers on the market already. And... let's not forget.... what happened with Balance.

I'd much rather see them devote their efforts to developing the actual DAW (looking at you sequencer and audio editor).
Heater wrote:
19 Feb 2021
I don’t the they are interested in hardware at all.

eh hem.... Balance
And we see how that ended.
Too bad, because that was a great product.
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Billy+
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Post 19 Feb 2021

challism wrote:
19 Feb 2021
I would vote NO on this. There are plenty of good controllers on the market already. And... let's not forget.... what happened with Balance.

I'd much rather see them devote their efforts to developing the actual DAW (looking at you sequencer and audio editor).
Heater wrote:
19 Feb 2021
I don’t the they are interested in hardware at all.

eh hem.... Balance
And we see how that ended.
Too bad, because that was a great product.

It might be nice to see a balance V2 that offers massive dsp offloading like aud offers for use with there plugin ;)
But it would have to be really good


Actually scrap that, stick with DAW improvements only and stay away from hardware.
Last edited by Billy+ on 19 Feb 2021, edited 1 time in total.

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challism
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Post 19 Feb 2021

Balance was bad ass. Too bad it got discontinued. But I understand why. It really shouldn't be the direction of the company to be making hardware. Although, I'm sure it was just licensed by Props and manufactured elsewhere... I'm mean, I'm 99% certain of that.
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jam-s
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Location: Aachen, Germany

Post 19 Feb 2021

NI (or Arturia or Behringer) should just buy Reason Studios and make Reason a proper, modern DAW and tightly integrate it with their line of hardware products.
If you're in Aachen, come and visit us at the Voidspace. ... Pool's closed due to corona.

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Billy+
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Post 19 Feb 2021

jam-s wrote:
19 Feb 2021
NI (or Arturia or Behringer) should just buy Reason Studios and make Reason a proper, modern DAW and tightly integrate it with their line of hardware products.
I'm guessing that's what the current investors are hoping will happen with the inflated subscription user base :thumbup:

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Billy+
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Post 19 Feb 2021

I say start little, maybe something that would let you take the licensing anywhere....
work offline.....

Oh Oh :lightbulb:

I can see it now

you could call it something like an ignition key?
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:o
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guitfnky
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Post 19 Feb 2021

please god, no...every piece of hardware they've created has been abandoned (including the Ignition Key). another hardware device is the last thing we need from them.

Sterioevo
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Joined: 02 Apr 2015

Post 19 Feb 2021

IMO there is definitely an opportunity to improve hardware control/integration.

Ableton push has the best DAW integration that I have have experienced. This is not only in relation to how parameters are mapped, but even more useful for my purposes is the variety and integration of keyboard modes that are available, e.g. Isomorphic (selectable scales), step sequencer, velocities mode, fixed length recording etc, as well as the layout/access to other functions like the mixer, pans, sends, browsing etc.

With the introduction of per note probabilities in Live 11 the push will essentially allow for comprehensive per step/note programming (this has been possible for automation only to this point) - similar to elektron equipment and some of the arturia gear.

So definitely scope for development in my view, not only in the DAW but also the RRP.

In my view the level of deep integration achieved by push would require Reason Studios to play a major role.

Just a query on the accuracy of the first post - it is my understanding Push 1 was developed in collaboration with Akai, not Korg?

MuttReason
Posts: 9
Joined: 28 Jan 2021

Post 19 Feb 2021

Sterioevo wrote:
19 Feb 2021
IMO there is definitely an opportunity to improve hardware control/integration.

Ableton push has the best DAW integration that I have have experienced. This is not only in relation to how parameters are mapped, but even more useful for my purposes is the variety and integration of keyboard modes that are available, e.g. Isomorphic (selectable scales), step sequencer, velocities mode, fixed length recording etc, as well as the layout/access to other functions like the mixer, pans, sends, browsing etc.

With the introduction of per note probabilities in Live 11 the push will essentially allow for comprehensive per step/note programming (this has been possible for automation only to this point) - similar to elektron equipment and some of the arturia gear.

So definitely scope for development in my view, not only in the DAW but also the RRP.

In my view the level of deep integration achieved by push would require Reason Studios to play a major role.

Just a query on the accuracy of the first post - it is my understanding Push 1 was developed in collaboration with Akai, not Korg?
Yes, correct. Akai not Korg.

Ableton have the scale to build relationships with firms like Novation and Akai, and they have a big enough user base to provide Novation and Akai with the confidence that dedicated hardware will sell in reasonable volumes and meet internal return on investment criteria.

RS don’t seem to have the scale or the user base (if any user poll I’ve ever seen of top DAWs used is any guide) so they need to take a crafty and nimble approach and piggy back on others. That means taking the whole remote codec thing and shaking it all up. Wouldn’t be a huge investment to get some bright coders on board to write a bunch of new scripts for the new generation of controllers out there...

Sterioevo
Posts: 334
Joined: 02 Apr 2015

Post 19 Feb 2021

I agree with the points made @Muttreason

Providing updated remote maps (including more functional generic maps) would go a long way to bridging the gap. The current remote offering requires that this would need to be ongoing as new controllers and new devices come to the market - so it would need an ongoing investment.

Perhaps a more clever development would be to improve the Remote process to include some level of auto-updating of new devices.

There is also a bit of a void in relation to control/limitation of players and some of the new custom displays that are not capable of being midi controlled (takes me back to some of the shortcomings of kong), requiring interaction with a mouse. This last detail has led me to look into solutions such as bomes and nob as a workaround. I have often wondered if it would be within the realms of possibility to develop a solution that allows you to grab some of the controls that are not in the remote script (starting with for e.g. The NNXT, but also things like Europas envelope shape, and the record button on players) and then modulate them.

In relation to partnerships I think there would be lots of opportunities to engage in partnerships to explore innovative solutions. If you look at Sweden alone there are some amazing companies with experience in hardware like elektron and teenage engineering. There are also products already in the Reason shop from companies with plenty of experience in the hardware world. And there is companies like Nektar and some of the IOS developers. There are heaps Kickstarter projects out there exploring interesting solutions to midi control.

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antic604
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Post 19 Feb 2021

avasopht wrote:
19 Feb 2021
Korg (who manufactured the original Ableton Push)...
You mean Akai :)
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PhillipOrdonez
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Location: Colombia

Post 20 Feb 2021

antic604 wrote:
19 Feb 2021
avasopht wrote:
19 Feb 2021
Korg (who manufactured the original Ableton Push)...
You mean Akai :)
If you'd only bothered to read the thread before commenting 🙄
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antic604
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Post 20 Feb 2021

PhillipOrdonez wrote:
20 Feb 2021
If you'd only bothered to read the thread before commenting 🙄
I did.

I'm just correcting a factual mistake.

Or is that not allowed anymore, since truth and facts became subjective and personal now?

Oh, and no - Reason doesn't need a dedicated controller, it's not inevitable and it's not a must. Happy now? :D
Music tech enthusiast.
DAW, VST & hardware hoarder.
My "music": https://soundcloud.com/antic604

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Jagwah
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Post 20 Feb 2021

Hardware, freeware, sportswear, anything that is not core Reason upgrades are very likely from Props.

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guitfnky
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Post 20 Feb 2021

antic604 wrote:
20 Feb 2021
PhillipOrdonez wrote:
20 Feb 2021
If you'd only bothered to read the thread before commenting 🙄
I did.

I'm just correcting a factual mistake.

Or is that not allowed anymore, since truth and facts became subjective and personal now?

Oh, and no - Reason doesn't need a dedicated controller, it's not inevitable and it's not a must. Happy now? :D
I suppose the point is, the factual mistake had already been corrected, before your comment.

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friday
Posts: 309
Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 20 Feb 2021

dioxide wrote:
19 Feb 2021
All they have to do is employ someone to make high quality maps for third party controllers. That's much cheaper and less risky than designing and manufacturing your own hardware.

Also make them easier to share. A repository of maps with an easy installation system. That way you could try several different mapping options and users could create and share their own. DJ Techtools used to have a repository for DJ controllers but it looks like it is down now.
+1

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antic604
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Joined: 02 Apr 2020

Post 20 Feb 2021

guitfnky wrote:
20 Feb 2021
I suppose the point is, the factual mistake had already been corrected, before your comment.
Well, ok. That's a good point, then. I did go through the thread before posting but - indeed - failed to Ctrl+F for "Akai".
Music tech enthusiast.
DAW, VST & hardware hoarder.
My "music": https://soundcloud.com/antic604

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