I am uncomfortable with the locking of the thread by Jagwah (COVID-19 track)

[Auryn]

Sorry in advance for rocking the boat here, but I more or less feel obliged to.

Am I the only one who feels uncomfortable with the locking of Jagwah's thread? I mean, I can understand that political commentary is not allowed in off-topic because it would cause a ton of moderation headaches, but the music subforum is another beast entirely. In the hypothetical case that, say, Rage Against The Machine's 'Bullet in the Head' or Damian Marley's "Welcome to Jamrock" were posted here, would you be so quick to just lock the respective thread outright? Music is not just escapism or distraction, and it's kind of a crime to reduce it as such. I mean, you'd basically be banning 60% (conservative estimate) of hiphop music.

So ehm yeah, I would appreciate some kind of comment on the reasoning (no pun intended) here

[Billy+]

I'm uncomfortable with anti vaccination messages and totally agree with removing such material from Reason Talk anywhere it's found,


Keep it on Facebook

[guitfnky]

I’m with Billy+ on this. political music is fair game as far as I’m concerned, and should absolutely be allowed, as long as they’re focused on the music, and not asking for comments on the lyrical content (as they were, in this case, in all fairness). but when it crosses the line into dangerous misinformation, that shit doesn’t belong here. to me, that’s not even political—it’s just that if an impressionable person saw it and acted on it, it puts people in danger.

[Auryn]

I'm uncomfortable with anti vaccination messages and totally agree with removing such material from Reason Talk anywhere it's found,


Keep it on Facebook

I don't really care that much about the message (I'm getting vaccinated hopefully within the next month or two if the Dutch government can get their act together, LOL) and I certainly didn't care much for the song (it's... not good. sorry Jagwah) but I strongly feel people should be allowed to kick against the establishment all they want in their music. I mean, that's punk for crying out loud, that's rock 'n roll.

I’m with Billy+ on this. political music is fair game as far as I’m concerned, and should absolutely be allowed, as long as they’re focused on the music, and not asking for comments on the lyrical content (as they were, in this case, in all fairness). but when it crosses the line into dangerous misinformation, that shit doesn’t belong here. to me, that’s not even political—it’s just that if an impressionable person saw it and acted on it, it puts people in danger.

I can emphathize but I don't really know where the line of 'dangerous disinformation' is drawn. I heard mostly a bunch of not-very-thought provoking generic slogans in a german accent about how the government and Bill Gates (I think...?) are not to be trusted. I mean, that's just basically Atari Teenage Riot but without the volume

I didn't note he was asking for comments on the lyrics... that does pose a further problem... Maybe the rule should be you can post this but not discuss the politics in the lyrics, just the music?

[MrFigg]

Atari Teenage Riot

This was the only part of this thread I thought worth commenting on. A name I had forgotten.
Atari Teenage Riot do it but ec8or do it better.

[Billy+]

I've said all I'm going to

[orthodox]

I think that's a hilarious thing they made and it does not deserve to be banned. There already are many things in this world being freely promoted, that may put people at danger or be considered as misinformation by someone. It's up to everyone to decide for themselves.

Just for the record, I am pro-vaccine and already vaccinated.

[Auryn]

Atari Teenage Riot

This was the only part of this thread I thought worth commenting on. A name I had forgotten.
Atari Teenage Riot do it but ec8or do it better.

LOL I saw them (ATR) live once sometime in '99 and my ears are still ringing

Shame you won't comment on the issue though. If you think I'm a moron you're welcome to say so. I live and I learn (hopefully)

[MrFigg]

It's up to everyone to decide for themselves.

Unfortunately not everyone has the capacity to filter information.

[bxbrkrz]

I'm uncomfortable with anti vaccination messages and totally agree with removing such material from Reason Talk anywhere it's found,


Keep it on Facebook

I don't really care that much about the message (I'm getting vaccinated hopefully within the next month or two if the Dutch government can get their act together, LOL) and I certainly didn't care much for the song (it's... not good. sorry Jagwah) but I strongly feel people should be allowed to kick against the establishment all they want in their music. I mean, that's punk for crying out loud, that's rock 'n roll.

I’m with Billy+ on this. political music is fair game as far as I’m concerned, and should absolutely be allowed, as long as they’re focused on the music, and not asking for comments on the lyrical content (as they were, in this case, in all fairness). but when it crosses the line into dangerous misinformation, that shit doesn’t belong here. to me, that’s not even political—it’s just that if an impressionable person saw it and acted on it, it puts people in danger.

I can emphathize but I don't really know where the line of 'dangerous disinformation' is drawn. I heard mostly a bunch of not-very-thought provoking generic slogans in a german accent about how the government and Bill Gates (I think...?) are not to be trusted. I mean, that's just basically Atari Teenage Riot but without the volume

I didn't note he was asking for comments on the lyrics... that does pose a further problem... Maybe the rule should be you can post this but not discuss the politics in the lyrics, just the music?

"Reality" is a complex thing

[Auryn]

"Reality" is a complex thing

Oh, so he didn't actually say that? Hmmm, the plot thickens...

[MrFigg]

This was the only part of this thread I thought worth commenting on. A name I had forgotten.
Atari Teenage Riot do it but ec8or do it better.

LOL I saw them (ATR) live once sometime in '99 and my ears are still ringing

Shame you won't comment on the issue though. If you think I'm a moron you're welcome to say so. I live and I learn (hopefully)

I scrolled through the song and just read a whole load of what I deemed to be misinformation and teen "anarcho discontent". Dreadlocked 15 year olds in torn jerseys and moleskin combat trousers going around with dogs on a string pertaining to be fighting the establishment whilst at the same time going skiing with their parents in Switzerland twice a year.
Further to that...I'd never judge you as a moron. I mean Atari Teenage Riot? How could I?

[orthodox]

Unfortunately not everyone has the capacity to filter information.

No one really does, it's always been this way and we're still alive.

[MrFigg]

Unfortunately not everyone has the capacity to filter information.

No one really does, it's always been this way and we're still alive.

Yeah we are. Then again, I'd never inject bleach.

[PhillipOrdonez]

No one really does, it's always been this way and we're still alive.

Yeah we are. Then again, I'd never inject bleach.

You don't inject it, you are supposed to drink it, jeez, the disinformation

[bxbrkrz]

"Reality" is a complex thing

Oh, so he didn't actually say that? Hmmm, the plot thickens...

All criticisms were welcomed he said. I guess banning is a form of criticism

Just human nature. I understand it is frustrating, but for some, forums are ways to avoid paying for therapy.
Just enjoy the ride. Don't worry too much about it.

To be fair I played the track for 5 seconds before I stopped the player. But now, with that Streisand effect ban drama I want to play it in full

[Auryn]

It's up to everyone to decide for themselves.

Unfortunately not everyone has the capacity to filter information.

Yeah, about this 'misinformation' thing... I mean, in one sense putting hot chicks in an ad for a soft drink that will just make you fat and mess up your teeth is already 'misinformation' so I'm just not really clear on where the line is here

All criticisms were welcomed he said. I guess banning is a form of criticism

Just human nature. I understand it is frustrating, but for some, forums are ways to avoid paying for therapy.
Just enjoy the ride. Don't worry too much about it.

To be fair I played the track for 5 seconds before I stopped the player. But now, with that Streisand effect ban drama I want to play it in full

Yeah I mean, music is basically just a way to avoid paying for therapy right? Sure is for me, lol.

[TritoneAddiction]

Yeah I don't think the thread should've been locked. I didn't like the song, but who cares? It's art. Art is not about facts anyway. Music should be able to express whatever it wants. It doesn't mean you have to like it or agree with it.
I mean who takes their "information" from a song anyway? Imo the "disinformation" argument doesn't really work here.

[guitfnky]

I'm uncomfortable with anti vaccination messages and totally agree with removing such material from Reason Talk anywhere it's found,


Keep it on Facebook

I don't really care that much about the message (I'm getting vaccinated hopefully within the next month or two if the Dutch government can get their act together, LOL) and I certainly didn't care much for the song (it's... not good. sorry Jagwah) but I strongly feel people should be allowed to kick against the establishment all they want in their music. I mean, that's punk for crying out loud, that's rock 'n roll.

I’m with Billy+ on this. political music is fair game as far as I’m concerned, and should absolutely be allowed, as long as they’re focused on the music, and not asking for comments on the lyrical content (as they were, in this case, in all fairness). but when it crosses the line into dangerous misinformation, that shit doesn’t belong here. to me, that’s not even political—it’s just that if an impressionable person saw it and acted on it, it puts people in danger.

I can emphathize but I don't really know where the line of 'dangerous disinformation' is drawn. I heard mostly a bunch of not-very-thought provoking generic slogans in a german accent about how the government and Bill Gates (I think...?) are not to be trusted. I mean, that's just basically Atari Teenage Riot but without the volume

I didn't note he was asking for comments on the lyrics... that does pose a further problem... Maybe the rule should be you can post this but not discuss the politics in the lyrics, just the music?

no, that’s what I’m saying—he explicitly said not to discuss the politics. but again, it’s not a political sentiment—it’s a conspiracy theory with real world consequences.

not discussing the politics is the bar, but that’s not where he failed. regardless what you’re asking for comment on, you still shouldn’t be allowed to post stuff that has the potential to lead to dangerous behavior.

you mentioned RATM, and I’d apply the same standard to them (even though, I personally agree with their politics in some ways)—certain songs don’t belong on a site like this.

as for the non-specificity of the lyrics, that’s hardly a good defense, IMO.

[bxbrkrz]

Unfortunately not everyone has the capacity to filter information.

Yeah, about this 'misinformation' thing... I mean, in one sense putting hot chicks in an ad for a soft drink that will just make you fat and mess up your teeth is already 'misinformation' so I'm just not really clear on where the line is here

All criticisms were welcomed he said. I guess banning is a form of criticism

Just human nature. I understand it is frustrating, but for some, forums are ways to avoid paying for therapy.
Just enjoy the ride. Don't worry too much about it.

To be fair I played the track for 5 seconds before I stopped the player. But now, with that Streisand effect ban drama I want to play it in full

Yeah I mean, music is basically just a way to avoid paying for therapy right? Sure is for me, lol.

Atari Teenage Riot Safe Art & Therapy+

[MrFigg]

Yeah, about this 'misinformation' thing... I mean, in one sense putting hot chicks in an ad for a soft drink that will just make you fat and mess up your teeth is already 'misinformation' so I'm just not really clear on where the line is here

I wouldn’t say that’s misinformation. I mean they’re not saying if you drink this sugary drink you’ll turn into a hot chick. It’s just hot chicks drinking sugary drinks .

[orthodox]

Yeah, about this 'misinformation' thing... I mean, in one sense putting hot chicks in an ad for a soft drink that will just make you fat and mess up your teeth is already 'misinformation' so I'm just not really clear on where the line is here

The line here is drawn from considerations of avoiding any possible conflict. In this particular case, we change 'fat' and 'toothless' into metabolically and dentally challenged and make that a new normalcy. In case a conflict is inevitable, the challenging concept or idea is banned.

[bxbrkrz]

Teeth should be banned anyway.

[taddx]

banning is a form of criticism

That deserves to be carved in stone!

[bxbrkrz]

banning is a form of criticism

That deserves to be carved in stone!

Stone carving should be banned. Uncomfortable hieroglyphs could hurt people's feeling for 1000s of years.