Reason updates (11.3.7 / 11.3.8) and Reason+

[stp2015]

12 (or whatever) then stop for me. All good.

Same.

[DougalDarkly]

I have doubts about sales being hurt, only die hard fans check the shop for new RE regularly. They’ll continue to do so.

It seems a shame that you haven't realised the obvious blow to the third-party RE market - the devs have.

Putting an end to feature requests? One would think that a person paying a subscription would feel far more entitled to updates as they should vs people here so have payed for an as is product.

So the endless calls for RS to actually develop their product in a meaningful way will just get worse? Seems like RS have shot themselves in the foot with this then no?

Packs will not disappear if your subscription runs out. They’re patches in a folder on your hard drive. You’d only lose access to any REs you don’t own licenses to.

So again, the logic goes - you need to buy all the REs you're going to use, AS WELL AS a monthly sub?

This move is clearly - as has been stated by RS on numerous occasions - to attract new Reason users - users with a different set of priorities to the current users - why are you trying so hard to sell it to current Reason users?

[craste]

So after reading all through this, in my head I see it as:

Positives.

1. If you already own Reason and you wish to just upgrade to the latest version like you've always done, then you can - Happy Days!

2. If you'd like to try the Reason + you can do, and at the end of the trial you can continue, or go back to what you had immediately before signing up to Reason+. Happy Days! (plus keep all the sound packs you've downloaded.)

3. The new website looks great, have you clicked and listened to all the instruments in action - they sound great and if you was really new to music production it would be like Christmas everyday if you signed up to Reason+! If I was starting out today I would defo give it a shot! Happy Days!

4. We know the Core Reason DAW is being worked on and an update is due soon. Happy Days!

5. Today Reason Studios know that if they went full 'subscription only' they would lose many existing customers. So you'd like to assume they would never implement this. Happy Days!

Negatives.

1. Existing Reason DAW users feel like they are 'at the back of the queue' yet again when it comes to new features.

2. Its a missed opportunity - get the main DAW up to a little bit closer to other DAW's in terms of functionality and it would make such a massive difference to the users and the amount of people using it! Reason wipes the floor with every other daw when it comes to looks, ease of use and how it can inspire you to make music and have fun! It feels like the main decision makers there need their heads banging together and shown this.

You could so easily be the number 1, but you've put too much effort into things which don't matter half as much.

Its like a high end restaurant kitchen chef been given the best, most fresh vegetables, the juiciest tenderest cuts of meat and the nicest spices from round the world, but then has to use a manual mixing bowl to mix, use the big old fashioned AGA to cook on and the wood burning stove to heat up the liquids.

The kit looks beautiful and is easy to use, and boy, can the chef cook up some wonderful dishes! But the chef is looking enviously through the window at the restaurant kitchen next door - that chef has an electric food blender, the fan assisted oven which steams as well, and the microwave for heating things up quickly, he also has the best sharpest knives so can save so much time and make his life easier.

But our Chefs boss has just walked in and said "I've got us signed up with another 100 suppliers of different meats and veg and spices!" Our chef doesn't want another 100 spices or another bloody cabbage! He wants a way to mix his food quicker, to bake it faster so that 'banger' in the oven gets finished quicker!

He doesn't want to squint to read the shitty knob numbers on the Aga, he wants to have a high res screen to select which oven program he wants, just like the Siemens Combi Microwave and Steam oven the bastard chef opposite has!

We've got all the ingredients we need - just give us an upgrade on our kitchen tools - the Sequencer!

See you at 6pm on the livestream!

[hurricane]

12 (or whatever) then stop for me. All good.

Yup, me too. The update will probably cost more than the usual $129 though. I'm thinking it'll be the price of a one year subscription. Or $200 at the least. They have to give you an underhanded incentive to subscribe - I can already hear it "why pay $200 when for $40 more you can get R12 PLUS all these other things!"

[MrFigg]

12 (or whatever) then stop for me. All good.

Yup, me too. The update will probably cost more than the usual $129 though. I'm thinking it'll be the price of a one year subscription. Or $200 at the least. They have to give you an underhanded incentive to subscribe - I can already hear it "why pay $200 when for $40 more you can get R12 PLUS all these other things!"

Just look on it as bailing yourself out of prison. Worth every penny.

[NisseJ]

I have been a Reason user since version 1 and have since then never looked back to the old days with a lot of hardware samplers and synths. My old Kurzweil K2000 I bought brand new back in 95 did cost me like €3000 and Reasons 11 versions since then alone haven't cost me that amount of cash even though I have used it for 20 years.

It's all about perspective. €20 a month can for some people be a lot of money but the same people often buys the newest phone every year without a reflection.

I have subscribed to software since 2005 when I started playing World of Warcraft. There has been times when I pause my subscription like during vacation etc and the same will probably happen with R+ also but the ease and flexibility to get the latest and the greatest version of Reason + the ReasonStudios Rackextensions is worth it for me anyway. My songs I made back in 2000 with Reason 1.0 will still open.

That I can't say about my songs from Cubase I ran on the old Atari and the floppys from the K2000 and S1000 etc. Not even the DAT-tapes or the CD-R works these days even though one blank high quality Kodak Gold CD-R costed more than one month of the full R+ experience do today.

The future looks bright and I look forward to use R+ and ReasonStudio for the next 20 years! <3

[hurricane]

Yup, me too. The update will probably cost more than the usual $129 though. I'm thinking it'll be the price of a one year subscription. Or $200 at the least. They have to give you an underhanded incentive to subscribe - I can already hear it "why pay $200 when for $40 more you can get R12 PLUS all these other things!"

Just look on it as bailing yourself out of prison. Worth every penny.

Exactly.

[aeox]

This could've been one of those things that they just came out with a few weeks after version 12 or something. No teaser or excitement/build up.

Seems like they are just trying to entice people to mess around with all there is to offer but without the huge investment. Which is a really good thing, because as they said, they are trying to gain new users.

The approach was wrong though in my opinion. This is one of those things that everyone knows is very polarizing, and should be just spontaneously released without any excitement or build up for it. ideally, after a very fruitful major upgrade! To lessen impact on opposition.

[BRIGGS]

[Chi-Individual]

I think I'm more disappointed that the companion app is not a full mobile version of Reason. Figure, Take and Compact are cool apps but nothing I can build a full song with on the go. And I don't always want to have to carry a laptop with me. I don't mind the sub service since I'm mostly a hobbyist and know it wouldn't benefit me. But it damn sure would be nice to use my iPad or phone to track out a song at the beach or on a plane(when we can all fly safely again) without needing as entire mobile set up based on a laptop. Reason is my primary DAW and I'm trying to hold out for a mobile option but it looks like I'll have to move on.

[Aosta]

I also don't like being strong armed into subbing for future version updates.

You’re not. It’s completely optional. They’ve already said they don’t intend to kill perpetual licenses.

Yet...if it's anything like Adobe we will see support for previous versions of Reason phased out and a new 'Reason Classic' version being rolled out for purchase for those not on the sub train.

[nscerri]

So after reading all through this, in my head I see it as:

Positives.

1. If you already own Reason and you wish to just upgrade to the latest version like you've always done, then you can - Happy Days!

2. If you'd like to try the Reason + you can do, and at the end of the trial you can continue, or go back to what you had immediately before signing up to Reason+. Happy Days! (plus keep all the sound packs you've downloaded.)

3. The new website looks great, have you clicked and listened to all the instruments in action - they sound great and if you was really new to music production it would be like Christmas everyday if you signed up to Reason+! If I was starting out today I would defo give it a shot! Happy Days!

4. We know the Core Reason DAW is being worked on and an update is due soon. Happy Days!

5. Today Reason Studios know that if they went full 'subscription only' they would lose many existing customers. So you'd like to assume they would never implement this. Happy Days!

Negatives.

1. Existing Reason DAW users feel like they are 'at the back of the queue' yet again when it comes to new features.

2. Its a missed opportunity - get the main DAW up to a little bit closer to other DAW's in terms of functionality and it would make such a massive difference to the users and the amount of people using it! Reason wipes the floor with every other daw when it comes to looks, ease of use and how it can inspire you to make music and have fun! It feels like the main decision makers there need their heads banging together and shown this.

You could so easily be the number 1, but you've put too much effort into things which don't matter half as much.

Its like a high end restaurant kitchen chef been given the best, most fresh vegetables, the juiciest tenderest cuts of meat and the nicest spices from round the world, but then has to use a manual mixing bowl to mix, use the big old fashioned AGA to cook on and the wood burning stove to heat up the liquids.

The kit looks beautiful and is easy to use, and boy, can the chef cook up some wonderful dishes! But the chef is looking enviously through the window at the restaurant kitchen next door - that chef has an electric food blender, the fan assisted oven which steams as well, and the microwave for heating things up quickly, he also has the best sharpest knives so can save so much time and make his life easier.

But our Chefs boss has just walked in and said "I've got us signed up with another 100 suppliers of different meats and veg and spices!" Our chef doesn't want another 100 spices or another bloody cabbage! He wants a way to mix his food quicker, to bake it faster so that 'banger' in the oven gets finished quicker!

He doesn't want to squint to read the shitty knob numbers on the Aga, he wants to have a high res screen to select which oven program he wants, just like the Siemens Combi Microwave and Steam oven the bastard chef opposite has!

We've got all the ingredients we need - just give us an upgrade on our kitchen tools - the Sequencer!

See you at 6pm on the livestream!

Well said

[MaMue]

A short conclusion of the trouble here (horrible marketing by RS, really):

two options that are unclear for most of loyal users:

a) If the subscription is EXTRA, NEXT TO the regular owning modell, it is a good and interesting move by reason studios - why not?

b) If the subscription REPLACES our old posibility to buy and own reason - offline on you computer forever - without beeing subscribed, it sucks totally and is a horrible move, absolutely.

[Djstarski]

So after reading all through this, in my head I see it as:

Positives.

1. If you already own Reason and you wish to just upgrade to the latest version like you've always done, then you can - Happy Days!

2. If you'd like to try the Reason + you can do, and at the end of the trial you can continue, or go back to what you had immediately before signing up to Reason+. Happy Days! (plus keep all the sound packs you've downloaded.)

3. The new website looks great, have you clicked and listened to all the instruments in action - they sound great and if you was really new to music production it would be like Christmas everyday if you signed up to Reason+! If I was starting out today I would defo give it a shot! Happy Days!

4. We know the Core Reason DAW is being worked on and an update is due soon. Happy Days!

5. Today Reason Studios know that if they went full 'subscription only' they would lose many existing customers. So you'd like to assume they would never implement this. Happy Days!

Negatives.

1. Existing Reason DAW users feel like they are 'at the back of the queue' yet again when it comes to new features.

2. Its a missed opportunity - get the main DAW up to a little bit closer to other DAW's in terms of functionality and it would make such a massive difference to the users and the amount of people using it! Reason wipes the floor with every other daw when it comes to looks, ease of use and how it can inspire you to make music and have fun! It feels like the main decision makers there need their heads banging together and shown this.

You could so easily be the number 1, but you've put too much effort into things which don't matter half as much.

Its like a high end restaurant kitchen chef been given the best, most fresh vegetables, the juiciest tenderest cuts of meat and the nicest spices from round the world, but then has to use a manual mixing bowl to mix, use the big old fashioned AGA to cook on and the wood burning stove to heat up the liquids.

The kit looks beautiful and is easy to use, and boy, can the chef cook up some wonderful dishes! But the chef is looking enviously through the window at the restaurant kitchen next door - that chef has an electric food blender, the fan assisted oven which steams as well, and the microwave for heating things up quickly, he also has the best sharpest knives so can save so much time and make his life easier.

But our Chefs boss has just walked in and said "I've got us signed up with another 100 suppliers of different meats and veg and spices!" Our chef doesn't want another 100 spices or another bloody cabbage! He wants a way to mix his food quicker, to bake it faster so that 'banger' in the oven gets finished quicker!

He doesn't want to squint to read the shitty knob numbers on the Aga, he wants to have a high res screen to select which oven program he wants, just like the Siemens Combi Microwave and Steam oven the bastard chef opposite has!

We've got all the ingredients we need - just give us an upgrade on our kitchen tools - the Sequencer!

See you at 6pm on the livestream!

Well said

Yes , I agree

[earwig83]

You guys are talking about easy to get started, hassle free always up to date, like we are morons looking for quick fixes. It’s a race to the bottom. It really represents everything wrong with the audio tech scene. Your turning it into an entertainment service just like Netflix etc. Why would I want new instruments etc all the time? You are pushing a horrible model that most regular users are against.

No ones mentioned the fact that you literally built a marketing charade into your update too. You knew it would stir commotion, then the live webcast “oh you guys found us out, we better do a live stream!”, like the head guys didn’t have to block out that time in there Callander. Just shit patter in general.

I feel like I have some support from other people when I read these kind of comments. The other, "glass half full" types scare me. This is not at all want loyal multi-decade users asked for. Hopefully the positive people are right that by bringing in more newcomers, they can legitimize updates to the DAW itself.

Because right now, I agree that the marketing angle they took here stinks bad. Hiding the shop is definitely mean-spirited.

[Tiny Montgomery]

@craste a "well said" from me too!

Just occurred to me that our 50% off for the first year is approx the same price as buying Friktion which Ive held off getting (dont need but would like)......

I just wish I was productive enough right now to enjoy the free sound pack a week! That actually sounds like quite a good deal given they're patches - definitely more enticing than more sample packs. And as it wasn't that long since I came back to Reason my interest is quite piqued in that - one a week seems quite the commitment from them, really tempted to treat myself to a year, looking forward to the livestream.

[Loud_Silence]

What does that mean for Reason Intro, now that it's discontinued? Is it possible that after a future update of Windows I won't be able to use it anymore? Should I start saving money to purchase a full Reason license?

Your license won't disappear, so you'll still be able to use it. There just won't be a new version of Intro. Which is unfortunate, because not everyone wants to upgrade to the full version. The full version doesn't offer me enough to justify the upgrade price. I just would like Intro to have a larger GUI.

I love Reason Intro, it has everything I need in a very affordable price. I'm sad to see it discontinued.

[DougalDarkly]

Hiding the shop is definitely mean-spirited.

I don't think they intend to be mean here - it's just that the shop has no relevance to a new user - and this whole thing is for new users, not the old ones.

I think they looked at their existing customer base and decided they're just not getting enough money out of us - either in RE purchases, or in updates.

This is their way of ensuring that updates and new third-party RE are taken completely out of the equation - the part of the equation that's been dragging them down since the VCs came in...

[aeox]

You guys are talking about easy to get started, hassle free always up to date, like we are morons looking for quick fixes. It’s a race to the bottom. It really represents everything wrong with the audio tech scene. Your turning it into an entertainment service just like Netflix etc. Why would I want new instruments etc all the time? You are pushing a horrible model that most regular users are against.

No ones mentioned the fact that you literally built a marketing charade into your update too. You knew it would stir commotion, then the live webcast “oh you guys found us out, we better do a live stream!”, like the head guys didn’t have to block out that time in there Callander. Just shit patter in general.

I feel like I have some support from other people when I read these kind of comments. The other, "glass half full" types scare me. This is not at all want loyal multi-decade users asked for. Hopefully the positive people are right that by bringing in more newcomers, they can legitimize updates to the DAW itself.

Because right now, I agree that the marketing angle they took here stinks bad. Hiding the shop is definitely mean-spirited.

I think the reason I'm optimistic is because I love the software as it is so much, that it would take something very drastic to change my "overall" feelings for the software. Remember, the glass is only half full, not full

[EnochLight]

...just because R+ subscribers get all RS RE's doesn't devalue the RE's that third party devs offer...

This is starting to get annoying now - you cannot be naive enough to believe what you just wrote?

If I subscribe to Reason+, why would I buy a third-party RE?

Why would I buy an instrument/tool that stops working when the sub runs out?

Your existing argument seems to be that I should buy a regular Reason licence, and third-party REs IN ADDITION to the sub?

Not sure how my statement is difficult to understand - there are a plethora of 3rd party RE's that offer things NONE of the RS RE's offer. My point was to assure Buddard that his RE's will still have value - to both R+ subscribers and traditional "forever" license subscribers. My argument is that RE devs have both traditional forever license customers to sell to AS WELL AS R+ subscribers.

[EnochLight]

Are you kidding me or yourself?

Don't you have an "upgrade" to buy?

[hurricane]

Sorry I just had to.

rs.jpg (633.47 KiB) Viewed 22456 times

[MaMue]

@ Reasonstudios

Please make it clear to us what it will be look like in the future - two options that are unclear for most of the users and make them scared that they loose their baby :

a) Is the subscription EXTRA, NEXT TO the regular owning modell?

OR

b) Does the subscription REPLACES the old possibility, to buy and own reason offline on your computer forever, without beeing subscribed?

[Mataya]

2. Its a missed opportunity - get the main DAW up to a little bit closer to other DAW's in terms of functionality and it would make such a massive difference to the users and the amount of people using it! Reason wipes the floor with every other daw when it comes to looks, ease of use and how it can inspire you to make music and have fun! It feels like the main decision makers there need their heads banging together and shown this.

Why do I always see people saying that the new usability features would benefit only people that use or already own Reason? I know a couple of people that don't care about Reason just because it feels like they'r evolving so slow and especially slow in fixing bugs. People will buy Reason for features. I think FL studio became a beast just because they add so much useful stuff with each and frequent update. And Reason studios is fighting that with sample packs? C'mon man.

M

[DougalDarkly]

Not sure how my statement is difficult to understand - there are a plethora of 3rd party RE's that offer things NONE of the RS RE's offer. My point was to assure Buddard that his RE's will still have value - to both R+ subscribers and traditional "forever" license subscribers. My argument is that RE devs have both traditional forever license customers to sell to AS WELL AS R+ subscribers.

There's definitely a misunderstanding here, but I don't think it's me.

Please explain again: What value there is in buying a third-party RE when you don't own Reason?