Customer feedback

Have any feature requests? No promise they'll get to Reason Studios, but you can still discuss them here.

In regards to feature requests, Does RS do enough to listen to their customers?

Yes, they listen to their customers
12
25%
No, they can do much better
30
63%
I don't care
6
13%
 
Total votes: 48
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Creativemind
Posts: 3706
Joined: 17 Jan 2015
Location: Stoke-On-Trent, England, UK

Post 11 Oct 2020

MattiasHG wrote:
07 Oct 2020
We still wanna do that, of course, it just takes time. Hi-res graphics is a good examples of a can having been kicked down the road (still working on that btw, it's a huge undertaking!).
Would you be so kind as to give us an estimated time of arrival on that? ;-)

Also it would be nice if you threw scalability in with this new update, have the themes affect the mixer and / or menu's and no restart required to apply too (with possibly another theme or 2) and the browser stuff (including sync-able browsers and sync windows too) cause I think (well perhaps not the browser) but 4k resolution, scalability and themes affecting mixer are all graphics related stuff so they would tie in to be included together. That would be an amazing update.
:reason:

Propellerhead Reason 11.3 / Cockos Reaper 6.17 / Cakewalk By Bandlab / Pro Tools First / Steinberg Cubase LE 5
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kuhliloach
Posts: 757
Joined: 09 Dec 2015

Post 11 Oct 2020

A full acquisition seems to be in order hopefully by a company that has the development muscle to actually do something competitive with the software. The company we know and love as Reason Studios clearly isn't capable of software programming.

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Loque
Moderator
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Joined: 28 Dec 2015

Post 11 Oct 2020

I now would say, yes, they listen. If you asked the same question 2-3 years ago, i would have said a clearly "no".
:reason: 11, Win10 64Bit.

User avatar
guitfnky
Posts: 2697
Joined: 19 Jan 2015

Post 11 Oct 2020

kuhliloach wrote:
11 Oct 2020
A full acquisition seems to be in order hopefully by a company that has the development muscle to actually do something competitive with the software. The company we know and love as Reason Studios clearly isn't capable of software programming.
:lol:

I keep upgrading this unprogram every couple of years for some reason.

AnotherMathias
Posts: 20
Joined: 29 Sep 2020

Post 15 Oct 2020

Creativemind wrote:
07 Oct 2020
It was pointed out to me that the NN-XT Pitch Bend range cannot be altered (by a music colleague on Facebook) and he explained but I forget what exactly it was for now but he said it was crucial for a certain type of sound in Drum 'n' Bass to be able to automate the Pitch Bend range for a certain Drum 'n' Bass effect and it also crucially needs a "Follow Song" button like in Studio One's Sample One, which allows you to play a sample up and down your midi controller but doesn't change the speed of the sample. Those 2 at the very least should be added to the NN-XT along with an updated GUI I feel.

And again, looking at Studio One on Impact XT, Kong could get a few features like that. On Impact XT you can load 3 samples on one pad and play them back in a multitude of ways, they're called Velocity Layers.
This puzzles me a bit.

Why would you say that the NN-XT pitch bend range can't be altered? The setting is right there in the middle of the "pitch" area of the editor - and stubbornly defaults to "7" instead of the nearly standard "2"!
Of course, it has to be set for each individual sample (typically by grouping them, and then setting it for all samples in the group with one click). Perhaps you're talking about a global pitch bend range setting at the top of the rack?

And about Impact XT. I have Studio One, and while a lot of people like Impact XT, every time I try using it I feel like it's lacking a ton of good features that we have in Kong. (Kong notably missing filters)
It's very easy to drop 3 (or 30!) sample onto a pad in Kong. And instead of, like in Impact XT, having to choose from either unison, round-robin, or velocity switch, you can use any combination of ALL of those in Kong.

And my favorite part, that I use for building acoustic kits, is that you can overlap velocity ranges for any number of samples, and when you click the ALT box, any that fall in the overlapping range will play as a round-robin.
For acoustic kits, I typically take 16 samples of increasing intensity, and instead of hard-switching the velocity ranges, I overlap them a bit, so that any velocity hit ends up with 2 or 3 alternate round robins. If only the Reason Drum Kits RE had worked that nicely!

In both the cases of NN-XT and Kong, I'd ABSOLUTELY would like to see updates. Mostly I'd like changes in the workflow making things a little less finicky and fiddly. Perhaps a knob to spread multiple samples onto a Kong pad without having to poke at tiny numbers, and certainly a good waveform display in NN-XT, with realtime crossfade loops. Hopefully all this without either dumbing them down for the use in the latest musical fad, or removing the fun by making them too feature-laden and cumbersome.

But don't underestimate the cleverness in the design of these old instruments!

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Creativemind
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Location: Stoke-On-Trent, England, UK

Post 15 Oct 2020

AnotherMathias wrote:
15 Oct 2020
Creativemind wrote:
07 Oct 2020
It was pointed out to me that the NN-XT Pitch Bend range cannot be altered (by a music colleague on Facebook) and he explained but I forget what exactly it was for now but he said it was crucial for a certain type of sound in Drum 'n' Bass to be able to automate the Pitch Bend range for a certain Drum 'n' Bass effect and it also crucially needs a "Follow Song" button like in Studio One's Sample One, which allows you to play a sample up and down your midi controller but doesn't change the speed of the sample. Those 2 at the very least should be added to the NN-XT along with an updated GUI I feel.

And again, looking at Studio One on Impact XT, Kong could get a few features like that. On Impact XT you can load 3 samples on one pad and play them back in a multitude of ways, they're called Velocity Layers.
This puzzles me a bit.

Why would you say that the NN-XT pitch bend range can't be altered? The setting is right there in the middle of the "pitch" area of the editor - and stubbornly defaults to "7" instead of the nearly standard "2"!
Of course, it has to be set for each individual sample (typically by grouping them, and then setting it for all samples in the group with one click). Perhaps you're talking about a global pitch bend range setting at the top of the rack?

And about Impact XT. I have Studio One, and while a lot of people like Impact XT, every time I try using it I feel like it's lacking a ton of good features that we have in Kong. (Kong notably missing filters)
It's very easy to drop 3 (or 30!) sample onto a pad in Kong. And instead of, like in Impact XT, having to choose from either unison, round-robin, or velocity switch, you can use any combination of ALL of those in Kong.

And my favorite part, that I use for building acoustic kits, is that you can overlap velocity ranges for any number of samples, and when you click the ALT box, any that fall in the overlapping range will play as a round-robin.
For acoustic kits, I typically take 16 samples of increasing intensity, and instead of hard-switching the velocity ranges, I overlap them a bit, so that any velocity hit ends up with 2 or 3 alternate round robins. If only the Reason Drum Kits RE had worked that nicely!

In both the cases of NN-XT and Kong, I'd ABSOLUTELY would like to see updates. Mostly I'd like changes in the workflow making things a little less finicky and fiddly. Perhaps a knob to spread multiple samples onto a Kong pad without having to poke at tiny numbers, and certainly a good waveform display in NN-XT, with realtime crossfade loops. Hopefully all this without either dumbing them down for the use in the latest musical fad, or removing the fun by making them too feature-laden and cumbersome.

But don't underestimate the cleverness in the design of these old instruments!
Sorry, typo, I meant the Pitch Bend range can't be automated.

You can put multiple samples onto 1 Kong pad then? I stand corrected if so.
:reason:

Propellerhead Reason 11.3 / Cockos Reaper 6.17 / Cakewalk By Bandlab / Pro Tools First / Steinberg Cubase LE 5
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chaosroyale
Posts: 483
Joined: 05 Sep 2017

Post 16 Oct 2020

Creativemind: you did say "automated" in your original post, I think Mathias just missed that part. Most functions of NN-XT cannot be automated, it's one of the most frustrating things about Reason. Oh, and the lack of non-destructive loop crossfading and fully modulatable/automatable start/end/loop points is embarrassing, even 90's hardware samplers could do that.

As for Kong, it can easily do layers and round-robins, which is good, BUT you cannot edit the start points, EQ and envelopes of each layer independently, which makes it pretty much useless for hybrid drum design. It's a shame because, as usual, the basic design is great, they just never bothered to update it.
Creativemind wrote:
15 Oct 2020
AnotherMathias wrote:
15 Oct 2020
stuff about Kong and NN-XT
Sorry, typo, I meant the Pitch Bend range can't be automated.

You can put multiple samples onto 1 Kong pad then? I stand corrected if so.

AnotherMathias
Posts: 20
Joined: 29 Sep 2020

Post 17 Oct 2020

chaosroyale wrote:
16 Oct 2020
Creativemind: you did say "automated" in your original post, I think Mathias just missed that part. Most functions of NN-XT cannot be automated, it's one of the most frustrating things about Reason. Oh, and the lack of non-destructive loop crossfading and fully modulatable/automatable start/end/loop points is embarrassing, even 90's hardware samplers could do that.

As for Kong, it can easily do layers and round-robins, which is good, BUT you cannot edit the start points, EQ and envelopes of each layer independently, which makes it pretty much useless for hybrid drum design. It's a shame because, as usual, the basic design is great, they just never bothered to update it.
Creativemind wrote:
15 Oct 2020


Sorry, typo, I meant the Pitch Bend range can't be automated.

You can put multiple samples onto 1 Kong pad then? I stand corrected if so.
Ah, I see it now. It said “altered” the first time, then “automated” the second time.

Automating pitch bend range seems to me like a very rare thing to need, right? If you set it for, say, an octave, you can automate the pitch bend amount to anything within two octaves. What would be the scenario where you would use this?

I can understand why all the parameters that are specific to each wave sample aren’t automatable. In a situation with 50-100 separate samples, that would be a huge amount of parameters to wade through.
Imagine if you have a 10 sample multi sampled patch, then to automate any parameter, you’d have to separately automate each one for all 10 samples. Or accept that the automation only has an effect on a few notes. (I realize that not everyone cares about multi sampling, but many of us do)
I think this is what they were hoping to solve with the global basic controls on top.
But perhaps we could get to automate a global offset for most parameters for all the samples at once?

Crossfade looping and modulated start, loop, and end points, yes please!

As for Kong, I think they made those decisions to try to reign in the sheer volume of parameters to keep track of.
In general I think the early designs are very well thought out, but I agree that in Kong each wave should at least have start point and a basic envelope.
If they can do an update without bogging everything down with TOO much parameter and feature creep, I’m all for it!

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Creativemind
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Location: Stoke-On-Trent, England, UK

Post 17 Oct 2020

AnotherMathias wrote:
17 Oct 2020
chaosroyale wrote:
16 Oct 2020
Creativemind: you did say "automated" in your original post, I think Mathias just missed that part. Most functions of NN-XT cannot be automated, it's one of the most frustrating things about Reason. Oh, and the lack of non-destructive loop crossfading and fully modulatable/automatable start/end/loop points is embarrassing, even 90's hardware samplers could do that.

As for Kong, it can easily do layers and round-robins, which is good, BUT you cannot edit the start points, EQ and envelopes of each layer independently, which makes it pretty much useless for hybrid drum design. It's a shame because, as usual, the basic design is great, they just never bothered to update it.

Ah, I see it now. It said “altered” the first time, then “automated” the second time.

Automating pitch bend range seems to me like a very rare thing to need, right? If you set it for, say, an octave, you can automate the pitch bend amount to anything within two octaves. What would be the scenario where you would use this?

I can understand why all the parameters that are specific to each wave sample aren’t automatable. In a situation with 50-100 separate samples, that would be a huge amount of parameters to wade through.
Imagine if you have a 10 sample multi sampled patch, then to automate any parameter, you’d have to separately automate each one for all 10 samples. Or accept that the automation only has an effect on a few notes. (I realize that not everyone cares about multi sampling, but many of us do)
I think this is what they were hoping to solve with the global basic controls on top.
But perhaps we could get to automate a global offset for most parameters for all the samples at once?

Crossfade looping and modulated start, loop, and end points, yes please!

As for Kong, I think they made those decisions to try to reign in the sheer volume of parameters to keep track of.
In general I think the early designs are very well thought out, but I agree that in Kong each wave should at least have start point and a basic envelope.
If they can do an update without bogging everything down with TOO much parameter and feature creep, I’m all for it!
The pitch bend range automation is needed (not me but was I was told by someone else) for a Reese Bass or Reese Bass effect. You automate the pitch wheel and set the pitch bend range to 13 but halfway through a bar, you have to drop the pitch bend range to achieve the sound. It can be done on the NN-19 but the NN-XT pitch bend range isn't automatable. It doesn't matter if it's rare 'cause if you need it to achieve something, it's needed.

Not many people might use a feature I specifically needed ages ago, auditioning audio clips in the sequencer with the speaker tool or I key. You can use that speaker tool in all 3 edit modes, Slice Edit, Pitch Edit and Comp Mode to play slices, pitch notes and comp parts but i was looping a section in the sequencer (this was 2 years ago now) and I had that section looped (so that section is where the song position pointer was - looping between the L/R locators) and then I was auditioning an acapella part on a different track to take bits of a vocal out that I was then positioning together to make a new vocal take between the locators which I was then going to join together as one and bounce as new sample to play in the NN-XT. It was annoying I had to keep moving the song position pointer further up the timeline to play the main (2 minute acapella of a song) and then keep moving it back, thus losing position on the new comped clip. I added this feature to the recent poll on here, the consolidated one but yeah, It would have been good to have been able to click the main acapella and just hit the I key (as I key is speaker tool when in the 3 edit modes and I think should be available in the sequencer) and then I could've cut it with the razor and dragged it in. Maybe one day lol! the thing is though, if that's something you use and it seems like things only get implemented when enough people demand it so if it's something YOU need and it's rare like that who knows when or if it will get implemented.
:reason:

Propellerhead Reason 11.3 / Cockos Reaper 6.17 / Cakewalk By Bandlab / Pro Tools First / Steinberg Cubase LE 5
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chaosroyale
Posts: 483
Joined: 05 Sep 2017

Post 17 Oct 2020

Yes, I agree they always should balance the feel and usability of a device with "features". And avoid bloat on the main GUI, for sure. However, we have combinators with mod matrices, right? It's not like they are going to run out of numbers! If you open a Kontakt patch in a combinator, damn right there are hundreds of parameters, but so what? If someone doesn't need them, they don't have to look at them. As long as the main parameters such as the master filter, volume, etc are at the top of the list, who cares if "sample start for sample #ID250" is waaaay down the list.

When you need extremely detailed automation and modulation, you can limit yourself to just a few samples, and then your parameter list suddenly gets much more manageable, because everything will be near the top. When you want a deeply multisampled instrument with 200 samples (I think I've gone up beyond that in some hybrid style instruments!) then of course it would be hard work to automate every single sample, but at least you would have the option, which we don't have now. Right now NN-XT is good for massively multisampled but very "static" basic sampler applications, but there is no modern-featured sampler in Reason. Grain doesn't count, different kind of animal. I'm not expecting they could include something as powerful as Kontakt as a native device, but the NN-neXT as people are calling it would have the potential to be a really good all-round sampler.
AnotherMathias wrote:
17 Oct 2020
If they can do an update without bogging everything down with TOO much parameter and feature creep, I’m all for it!

AnotherMathias
Posts: 20
Joined: 29 Sep 2020

Post 18 Oct 2020

chaosroyale wrote:
17 Oct 2020
Yes, I agree they always should balance the feel and usability of a device with "features". And avoid bloat on the main GUI, for sure. However, we have combinators with mod matrices, right? It's not like they are going to run out of numbers! If you open a Kontakt patch in a combinator, damn right there are hundreds of parameters, but so what? If someone doesn't need them, they don't have to look at them. As long as the main parameters such as the master filter, volume, etc are at the top of the list, who cares if "sample start for sample #ID250" is waaaay down the list.

When you need extremely detailed automation and modulation, you can limit yourself to just a few samples, and then your parameter list suddenly gets much more manageable, because everything will be near the top. When you want a deeply multisampled instrument with 200 samples (I think I've gone up beyond that in some hybrid style instruments!) then of course it would be hard work to automate every single sample, but at least you would have the option, which we don't have now. Right now NN-XT is good for massively multisampled but very "static" basic sampler applications, but there is no modern-featured sampler in Reason. Grain doesn't count, different kind of animal. I'm not expecting they could include something as powerful as Kontakt as a native device, but the NN-neXT as people are calling it would have the potential to be a really good all-round sampler.
The "Reason Way", which I hope they don't stray too far away from, is generally not about long lists of complex data. A lot of people say "if you don't want complexity, just don't use it", but the economy of design ideals Reason seem to aspire to (perhaps a Scandinavian thing?) don't always agree. Admirable to some, irritating to others. I'm guessing that Kontakt might just be the polar opposite of what the Reason folks strive for.
A good recent example is the modulation matrix in Friktion, with only four slots available. They claimed that more slots would just not be in the spirit and intention of the instrument, even though many other people might insist that "more is always better". I agree with Reason Studios decision on this.

This is not to say that Reason Studios aren't always successful at this. Occasionally they end up tying themselves up in knots trying to be clever, other times they just appear plain stubborn. And there is no doubt that they are understaffed to achieve all the updating that must happen, and quickly.

At the risk of sounding greedy, perhaps we really need TWO updated samplers. One for old fashioned instrument multisampling, with articulations and the like, and another one for modern creative sampling, with a focus on chopping, automation, or whatever else the young whippersnappers are into.
Even though both things fall under the category of sampling, the needs for the two are vastly different.

As far as automation goes, I'm old enough to have gotten trained on 2-inch 24 track tape and analog mixers, where the only automation you could expect to see was basic mutes, or if you were extra fancy, fader automation. I find myself finishing entire songs in Reason without using any automation at all!

chaosroyale
Posts: 483
Joined: 05 Sep 2017

Post 18 Oct 2020

Hey that's a good idea. If they updated the NN-19 to be "plays only one layer of samples, but with timestretch, crossfades, etc, and you can automate/modulate EVERYTHING" and NN-XT to be the multisampler with a more polished up workflow, they would have real winners! That would help to bring Reason back to the top as a choice for sound design.
AnotherMathias wrote:
18 Oct 2020

At the risk of sounding greedy, perhaps we really need TWO updated samplers. One for old fashioned instrument multisampling, with articulations and the like, and another one for modern creative sampling, with a focus on chopping, automation, or whatever else the young whippersnappers are into.

AnotherMathias
Posts: 20
Joined: 29 Sep 2020

Post 18 Oct 2020

chaosroyale wrote:
18 Oct 2020
Hey that's a good idea. If they updated the NN-19 to be "plays only one layer of samples, but with timestretch, crossfades, etc, and you can automate/modulate EVERYTHING" and NN-XT to be the multisampler with a more polished up workflow, they would have real winners! That would help to bring Reason back to the top as a choice for sound design.
AnotherMathias wrote:
18 Oct 2020

At the risk of sounding greedy, perhaps we really need TWO updated samplers. One for old fashioned instrument multisampling, with articulations and the like, and another one for modern creative sampling, with a focus on chopping, automation, or whatever else the young whippersnappers are into.
Perfect! We have a deal.

Now, Props, er, I mean Reasonfolks, get to work on that!

AnotherMathias
Posts: 20
Joined: 29 Sep 2020

Post 19 Oct 2020

Creativemind wrote:
17 Oct 2020

The pitch bend range automation is needed (not me but was I was told by someone else) for a Reese Bass or Reese Bass effect. You automate the pitch wheel and set the pitch bend range to 13 but halfway through a bar, you have to drop the pitch bend range to achieve the sound. It can be done on the NN-19 but the NN-XT pitch bend range isn't automatable. It doesn't matter if it's rare 'cause if you need it to achieve something, it's needed.
I looked in to the Reese bass phenomenon a little. I'm not sure I get why it's any special, or why a pitch bend range of 13 (odd choice!) would be needed, but that's neither here nor there. The original song is from 1988, so clearly there was no advanced automation used for that back then.

But if the goal is to have the pitch bend range change on the fly from 13 to something else, you can do that without any automation. In NNXT, just set up two (or more) identical layers, where the pitch bend range differs. Then just switch between the two layers as needed, using something like key splits, velocity splits, assigning volume (inversely on one layer) to the mod wheel, etc. If you want to go crazy, by enabling ALT you could have it switch between pitch bend ranges with each new note!

While waiting for two updated samplers to appear, if you have Suite, there's a fourth option to explore, other than NN19, NN-XT, and Grain:
Scenic Hybrid, in addition to it's multisampled rompler selection of waveforms, can play two layers of non-multisampled user samples. Over the other three, I can think of a few advantages:

Vs NN19: Can play two layers dynamically. More modern filter algorithms. A basic granular engine. An extensive mod matrix. Two LFOs and a pulse engine.
Vs NNXT: Much more automatable (still not pitch bend range, though). More modern filter algorithms. A basic granular engine. An extensive mod matrix.
Vs Grain: Two layers, supports sample loop point even in granular mode (for some weird reason Grain can only loop the entire sample from the start). Easier interface. Nicer reverb (three of them!).

Benefits over all three: Mostly the nice effects. Pretty nice, straightforward interface (ignoring the rather silly main screen). The ability to blend in sounds from the pretty nice rompler selection on the second layer.
There's still no real-time crossfade looping, and nothing in it for the sample chopping crowd.

But if you have Scenic, don't overlook using it for making the most from single-samples. It can get pretty huge.

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