What is going on in the USA and stuff

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EdGrip
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10 Jun 2020

I think it's more about the fact that had it not been filmed, he would probably have got away with it. Indeed, even though it *was* filmed, he would probably got away with it had it not been for the nationwide protests.

As far as I can make out, "Antifa" is a bogeyman of conservative America. It means "anybody leftwing at a protest (or a counter protest) especially if they're doing a bit of rioting". "Antifa" paints a picture of a shady organised group that's coming to destroy MAGA America which, needless to say, suits Trump and co: Reelect me, and I'll protect you from Antifa.

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tt_lab
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10 Jun 2020

Biolumin3sc3nt wrote:
10 Jun 2020
EdGrip wrote:
10 Jun 2020
Well, it's not "Antifa", if that helps.
Who's Antifa anyways? Fair question right?
I hope that everybody that is democratic.
Image
Two very dangerous antifa terrorists here :twisted: so Adolf would think

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tt_lab
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10 Jun 2020

I don't know what Viglink is but it added a link to my post...weird!

EdGrip
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10 Jun 2020

Yeah, the forum's had a bad case of inline ad links for a few months now.

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tt_lab
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10 Jun 2020

thx for the info...

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-008'
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10 Jun 2020

Joey and guitfunky and anyone else who cares...yes i really DO believe extreme intensity of both this riot and this covid lockdown are all about politics, and especially with the vote in a few months. If anyone doesn't see at least a little bit of that by now, well..idk. I know black people who are Trump supporters. It is not some sort of made up thing. He was about to hit his highest numbers ever with black people and now we have this? I don't trust anyone. Not Trump or Republicans or Dems or Media or anyone. You shouldn't either.

As of YESTERDAY the Covid Crew changed their story yet again in the headlines "Asymptomatic spread is "very rare". Today? W.H.O. walks it back and says watch out! Really? I still don't believe anything. Better safe than sorry.

You guys dismiss conspiracy theories... but everyone decided/proved that Russians attempted to meddle with 2016 election... don't you think it's possible that all "enemy" groups would push very much for riots and civil unrest in the midst of PANDEMIC? I'm not saying it's Russia or China or what. I just mean - if its true that our enemies would do what they've done in the past... do you think that they suddenly become gentleman in a crisis? "lets' stop fucking with them for a minute, they have a pandemic." Think about it.

Black men die at the hands of police all the time and nobody ever changes or listens or anything so why are there no riots in non-election years? Remember the race riots in 1968? Martin Luther King was assassinated. A very great man. Was not an "accident" in any way! People were rightfully angry. but unfortunately what the unrest and riots did back then (same timing, summer before election) is push a great deal of votes toward the Law and Order Republican candidate of that time, Richard Nixon. Riots in the way they are going currently actually fortify racists bullshit, while it also pushes many normal people in the "center" to lean just a bit right, just out of fear. And on the flip side, at the very same time, they tell black and brown people that "all republicans are racist" or "all trump supporters are racist" or "All white people are XYX". Not only is it impossible for all those things to be true, it is very damaging to manipulate both sides with hate and fear, instead of just: vote how you want based on facts and policy.

Now we have the fringe left, fighting the fringe right. And here we all are suffering in the middle. It's pathetic.

Abolish the Police? Defund the police? ( They are literally demanding exactly that and to deny it is to lie.) This thing is evolving into something much different now. Joey if what you say about proximity is true, than abolishing the police will harm blacks the most. We have all seen the actual criminal element and what it is capable of. White, black, the race doesn't come in to it. Any sane person knows that there are bad people in every color, committing all manner of crimes. DAY AND NIGHT. While you and i work and sleep, they have no respect for: life, their fellow man, the rule of law, and the safety and priorities of the working families who everything depends on! ( for example: the taxes that would pay for police education programs would come from white and black-owned businesses - who have now been closed for 3+ months, AND are now also getting smashing up.) wtf is that??

Ok.. so im the police on my street now, right? Ok. Then all these guns ARE justified, so I guess we are 2A all the way? No one is EVER ever ever talking about abolishing or defunding criminals. EVER. Is that not impossible? Because if it isn't.... then just imagine having all the same amount of criminals, but no police AND no guns!

The reason this shit all seems like a psyop or conspiracy theory to me is... I don't believe violent riots and looting and stuff during a PANDEMIC is doing any good at all for any cause. The majority are the good people who want to be heard and they should be! but the fringes are drowning out their voices. Maybe its the agitators and infiltrators, maybe it's rebellious young people that just don't care ..and its like a "yay free shit fuck the system" party. Probably a mixture of both? Either way it is not helping the real people with their real grievances.

JUNETEENTH coming up people!! We should be celebrating black lives in a positive way!! Great Black People and why we love them - Arts and music, business, humor - no one argues against the contributions black people make to every aspect of life. We should be celebrating the kind of stuff that will change a racist's mind at the source .....not having him see these riots and say "told ya so!"

Racism is a sin. it is a crime by the racist. but it is also an evil seed in the mind of the victim. That is a key word here - "victim". If we are constantly told things like "follow our dreams" or "if you can believe you can achieve" or that "you are what you think", etc ...is that stuff even true? Because if it is, and there is that victim mentality present.. always being watered and out in the sun...then that little evil seed (that the racist planted!) grows. And eventually that seed of racism grows up as tree. And you are merely a stone under it's shade. Racism is all you see. And you are reduced to : victim.

Black children everywhere should wake up every day and feel like VICTORS not victims. It changes your mindset, your outlook and your drive to conquer life. So how can we make this happen?

Maybe the REAL "institutionalized systemic racism" are things like institutionalized, systemic welfare? "Here is this free money just remember always Vote Democrat ™" A lot of the stuff the people are rioting against all goes down all during these democrats terms, in the democrat cities they run. So let's hold them accountable. Let's vote straight blue in a Red state, because they're all racist. And let's vote Red in every city that is a blue metropolis for 50+ years and still has a suffering black population. Let's try it! Try actual CHANGE for once instead of just platitudes, or fighting.

Are you aware that all BLM donations go through A c t b l u e? They are 100% an arm of the DNC. Their expenditures consist solely of - pumping money to DNC candidates. REALLY? BLM is taking donations worldwide... It is against the law to move international money into US elections.. Am i the only one who thinks that is getting really fuckin fishy?

Shouldn't we all be donating directly to AFRICA? The majority is black, impoverished, currently facing widespread famine due to a Locust plague, and also just happen to be one of the last few places on earth where slavery still exists. Blacks in USA have an enormous advantage over Africans. American privilege. Let's TRULY help those in REAL need first and work our way up.

I know that i ask very weird and uncomfortable questions. And yes, I do ramble and I DO like Trump more than Hillary (we had no choice, fuck the Oligarchy!) ... But remember for me it was only the phrase : "Term Limits". Ever since i heard those words I saw the KNIVES came out. You'd have to be not paying attention to not see this.

You dont have to resort to any conspiracies at all to observe simple facts like :
-a troubling number of senior cabinet for Obama all had a counterpart of spouse/sibling/etc embedded in the media.
-Operation Mockingbird was an actual thing. (notice how Clapper, Brennan , Lisa Page and many more get MSM jobs after they leave govt job? )
-Using Govt-funded propaganda against American citizens though our media is "legal" again. (and why tf hasnt trump cancelled that one!?!)
-our enemies absolutely 100% want us to fight amongst ourselves.

I still choose to believe 80% of the world is GOOD PEOPLE. (maybe just 60%? lol) But i reject this black -vs- white fight stuff. All of my heroes growing up were black, all of my black friends are the best friends that ive kept the longest, and they all know what's in my heart. We all already agree that NO ONE should die at the hands of the law. (beyond some life-threatening self defense scenario) So what is the real fight about?

Prepare yourselves! It is going to get super duper ugly before/after November. DEFUND THE THOUGHT POLICE! lol

p.s. if you're wondering WHY some weirdo would ever spend such time typing all that stuff out on an obscure forum... It is because i really do care. And im scared for all of us right now. If anybody actually reads i would love to hear your thoughts.
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EdGrip
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10 Jun 2020

I think what I struggle to understand the most is, however establishment Hillary was, why was it *better* to elevate a nakedly racist, sexist, solely-self-interested TV personality into the white house? Who then surrounded himself with his own inept family in positions of power? Why was Trump *better*? In what possible way?

Donald actual Trump! The cartoon character. The Captain Birdseye of business.

We had it similar in the UK in that Boris is effectively a TV personality and certainly has no political vision beyond being Prime Minister for the sake of it. (He thought it would be fun. He certainly got very unlucky on that front.)

You mention term limits - Trump keeps half-joking about doing away with them. Do you really put it past him?

Here in the UK, the government commissioned a report into Russian interference in Brexit and the election. They have not released that report - presumably because it concludes that there *was* non-negligible interference in both those votes. Considering how close the Brexit result was (48.2% - 51.8%) it could cause a big outcry. I don't think Russia would stop Russia-ing because there's a pandemic on. But I don't think Bristol finally chucking that statue they've hated for years into the sea is the result of a "psyops" (lol). I think people are actually angry.

EdGrip
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10 Jun 2020

Another factor in the UK is that our government couldn't really have handled the pandemic more badly if they'd tried. So the protests here, while they were catalysed by George Floyd, I think are also a result of anger at a government that caused tens of thousands of avoidable deaths and then, with the Dominic Cummings scandal, showed that they really weren't interested in accountability or putting public safety first. The social contract was very tangibly broken that weekend. And when that happens, you get anger, and protests.

Now, the UK only enjoys the title of having fucked up the handling of the pandemic 2nd worst in the world; the American government made the #1 spot. So it's not much of a leap to say that the same anger I described in the UK is also feeding into the demonstrations in America.

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selig
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10 Jun 2020

-008' wrote:
10 Jun 2020
I don't trust anyone. Not Trump or Republicans or Dems or Media or anyone. You shouldn't either.
I agree, I don't trust ANYONE - so probably better to not spread "facts" because they cannot be trusted. And yet here we are, spreading "facts" (myself included) when we should really just be doing our own private research and coming to our own private conclusions - right?
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-008'
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10 Jun 2020

EdGrip wrote:
10 Jun 2020
I think what I struggle to understand the most is, however establishment Hillary was, why was it *better* to elevate a nakedly racist, sexist, solely-self-interested TV personality into the white house? Who then surrounded himself with his own inept family in positions of power? Why was Trump *better*? In what possible way?

Donald actual Trump! The cartoon character. The Captain Birdseye of business.

We had it similar in the UK in that Boris is effectively a TV personality and certainly has no political vision beyond being Prime Minister for the sake of it. (He thought it would be fun. He certainly got very unlucky on that front.)

You mention term limits - Trump keeps half-joking about doing away with them. Do you really put it past him?

Here in the UK, the government commissioned a report into Russian interference in Brexit and the election. They have not released that report - presumably because it concludes that there *was* non-negligible interference in both those votes. I don't think Russia would stop Russia-ing because there's a pandemic on. But I don't think Bristol finally chucking that statue they've hated for years into the sea is the result of a "psyops" (lol). I think people are actually angry.
It's so easy to say "nakedly racist". But what an absolutely weak argument. Truly.
Trump had a black girlfriend, that Im sure he got naked with. Is that what you mean? What do you say to that?

Has the UK ever had a Black Prime Minister yet, as we have had a Black President? No Black Royalty either? Yikes. Very problematic. The UK should focus then on their (imperialistic, oppressive, colonizing, racist) island's own issues for now, yeah? No?

People are rightfully angry. I make absolutely no case or issue against protest. They are mad for a reason, clearly!
But during a pandemic, aren't the Black Lives out in the street right now UNNECESSARILY at risk? Why put them at risk?
Why did we not riot for Eric Gardner? (that case seemed so much worse to me) Could it be because Obama was still in office?

I will spell it out for you EXACTLY why Trump was and still is the better choice. It's because EVERYONE hates him. The right, the left, the media.... i and many others were already sick of all of those guys before he showed up. That is why he won, and probably why he will win again.
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NDKay
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10 Jun 2020

selig wrote:
10 Jun 2020
-008' wrote:
10 Jun 2020
I don't trust anyone. Not Trump or Republicans or Dems or Media or anyone. You shouldn't either.
I agree, I don't trust ANYONE - ......
.... yeah, what a great world we live in ! :puf_unhappy:
This is a SmartAss. Really nothing more than that !

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-008'
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10 Jun 2020

selig wrote:
10 Jun 2020
-008' wrote:
10 Jun 2020
I don't trust anyone. Not Trump or Republicans or Dems or Media or anyone. You shouldn't either.
I agree, I don't trust ANYONE - so probably better to not spread "facts" because they cannot be trusted. And yet here we are, spreading "facts" (myself included) when we should really just be doing our own private research and coming to our own private conclusions - right?
Wrong! (respectfully)

We must share facts and dissect them and argue points together to win!
we do it on our own already, to no avail.
:reason: "Reason is not measured by size or height, but by principle.” -Epictetus

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EdGrip
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10 Jun 2020

Trump was the better choice because everyone hates him.

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guitfnky
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10 Jun 2020

selig wrote:
10 Jun 2020
-008' wrote:
10 Jun 2020
I don't trust anyone. Not Trump or Republicans or Dems or Media or anyone. You shouldn't either.
I agree, I don't trust ANYONE - so probably better to not spread "facts" because they cannot be trusted. And yet here we are, spreading "facts" (myself included) when we should really just be doing our own private research and coming to our own private conclusions - right?
as long as, here, you mean “facts” (in quotes) to mean facts—in quotes. there’s nothing wrong with sharing facts (not in quotes), and sharing your views based on those facts. but sharing falsehoods, or other unproven information (“facts”) should of course not be taken seriously. unfortunately there are many posts here sharing opinions based on “facts”, and not on facts.
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guitfnky
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10 Jun 2020

and people can certainly trusted. even their opinions. if they have shown their opinions worthy of trust.

there are good and bad ways to analyze facts that inform opinions. but too many people have never learned critical thinking skills, sadly.
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NDKay
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10 Jun 2020

what is a fact ?

eg, climate change - is it a fact ? For most it is !
Is it a fact that we humans promote it ? for many people (already seeing the change as a fact) THIS is dissectable !


edit : adding the idea of looking a documentary about the "anthropocene" ;-)
(and sorry for getting offtopic for the matter of "explanation" . )
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NDKay
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10 Jun 2020

Or take another example, maybe a bit tooooo offtopic :

Are religions "real" or a hoax ? Depending on where you are in the world you would here something like "my religion is the only one".

Point is, different humans, different facts ! Depends from which perspective you look on it !


I would love if we would get more facts down ! But look at the "Flat-Earthler" :lol: :lol: :lol:
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guitfnky
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10 Jun 2020

NDKay wrote:
10 Jun 2020
what is a fact ?

eg, climate change - is it a fact ? For most it is !
Is it a fact that we humans promote it ? for many people (already seeing the change as a fact) THIS is dissectable !
climate change is undoubtedly a fact, but I assume what you’re suggesting is in dispute is human-made climate change. that’s not really in dispute either, considering the views of the scientific community, but it can’t be called a fact.

facts are data points that cannot be disputed by a rational person. what they tell us (i.e. how we analyze and present them) can be disputed, and manipulated.

so the climate changes, that’s a fact. humans likely contribute to the rapidity and depth of recent climate change, but that’s not 100% provable—you have to make educated guesses based on the facts that support or contradict the assertion (e.g. average global temperature, sea level, extreme weather events, etc.).
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guitfnky
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10 Jun 2020

NDKay wrote:
10 Jun 2020
Or take another example, maybe a bit tooooo offtopic :

Are religions "real" or a hoax ? Depending on where you are in the world you would here something like "my religion is the only one".

Point is, different humans, different facts ! Depends from which perspective you look on it !


I would love if we would get more facts down ! But look at the "Flat-Earthler" :lol: :lol: :lol:
religions exist; fact. deities may or may not exist; not a fact.
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NDKay
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10 Jun 2020

guitfnky wrote:
10 Jun 2020
NDKay wrote:
10 Jun 2020
Or take another example, maybe a bit tooooo offtopic :

Are religions "real" or a hoax ? Depending on where you are in the world you would here something like "my religion is the only one".

Point is, different humans, different facts ! Depends from which perspective you look on it !


I would love if we would get more facts down ! But look at the "Flat-Earthler" :lol: :lol: :lol:
religions exist; fact. deities may or may not exist; not a fact.
Yeah, my point was the one the the deities ;-) ( the whole point of indulge in religion)

btw, i am on "your" side with the climate change ! ( pun intended :lol: )
This is a SmartAss. Really nothing more than that !

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selig
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10 Jun 2020

-008' wrote:
10 Jun 2020
selig wrote:
10 Jun 2020


I agree, I don't trust ANYONE - so probably better to not spread "facts" because they cannot be trusted. And yet here we are, spreading "facts" (myself included) when we should really just be doing our own private research and coming to our own private conclusions - right?
Wrong! (respectfully)

We must share facts and dissect them and argue points together to win!
we do it on our own already, to no avail.
I disagree - I do it quite successfully on my own! ;)

But again, if the sources cannot be trusted, then the facts cannot be trusted - why argue facts we cannot trust?
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MannequinRaces
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10 Jun 2020

EdGrip wrote:
10 Jun 2020
Trump was the better choice because everyone hates him.
Trump won because voters are lazy and thought Hilary had it in the bag. Trump will lose this Nov. if people actually turn out to vote him out.

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-008'
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10 Jun 2020

EdGrip wrote:
10 Jun 2020
Trump was the better choice because everyone hates him.
Pretty dishonest of you there innit?
I clearly said that Trump was better choice because everyone (that the voting majority already "hated") hates him.
I dont like Bush, or Obama or Clinton or the MSM. A vast amount of people felt/feel the same way.
selig wrote:
10 Jun 2020

I disagree - I do it quite successfully on my own! ;)

But again, if the sources cannot be trusted, then the facts cannot be trusted - why argue facts we cannot trust?
why not point out or refute these incorrect "facts" then? If no one here directly argues the facts i present, and provides proof for me, i guess i should continue to hold them as factual until proven wrong. Im not afraid to learn new things.

maybe you meant other posts?

I'm done here i think. I poured my heart out about the subject. It was honest. Some is fact, some is feelings, most of it is just questions.
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guitfnky
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10 Jun 2020

selig wrote:
10 Jun 2020
-008' wrote:
10 Jun 2020


Wrong! (respectfully)

We must share facts and dissect them and argue points together to win!
we do it on our own already, to no avail.
I disagree - I do it quite successfully on my own! ;)

But again, if the sources cannot be trusted, then the facts cannot be trusted - why argue facts we cannot trust?
that’s the nut of the issue. when one person argues their opinion based on actual facts (lets say a Wall Street Journal article), and the other discounts it and argues based on information they got from another source (the National Enquirer), what do you do?

if those two people can’t even agree on what is a fact, then there’s no point in them continuing the conversation.

but a third party watching the exchange is still free to trust either one—we know which they SHOULD trust, but it will always be up to the individual to do their homework, to your point, to figure out which is trustworthy.

then, if similar exchanges happen again, the third person can begin to form an opinion about whether that person truly is trustworthy, and can gradually start to take them at their word—though they should still verify as often as they can.

it’s sort of like you on these forums. when a new user shows up, they don’t know Selig knows his stuff, so they’re right to take any information provided with a grain of salt, at first. but after a few months or years of seeing the kind of insight and expertise you bring to the site, many of us simply take your words as being true, because we know you are trustworthy.
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-008'
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10 Jun 2020

MannequinRaces wrote:
10 Jun 2020
EdGrip wrote:
10 Jun 2020
Trump was the better choice because everyone hates him.
Trump won because voters are lazy and thought Hilary had it in the bag. Trump will lose this Nov. if people actually turn out to vote him out.
thats an interesting take, because if you're right....

They only thought she had it in the bag because the LEFT'S own MSM and their own polls said it every single day.
""Hiilary has 98% to win etc etc ""

Why did they lie continually to their own base/people?
Very interesting
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