sidechaining pumping bass stock reason 2020

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howtobecalm
Posts: 78
Joined: 03 Feb 2020

Post 06 Feb 2020

is there ways with the master bus compressor new rack compressors or stock devices i dont want to buy pump or any Re ive decided i wont be buying any Res at all ( maybe download a free one ) so are there good ways to side chain bass in reason with stock devices an easy way ? maybe the new ones thanks so munch in advance for any help 🙂

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orthodox
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Post 06 Feb 2020

There are lots of methods to sidechain anything with stock devices. If you just want to duck your bass with the kick drum, that might not even require sidechaining, you can use a gate instead. That can be done by a plenty of methods as well. You can use Thor mod matrix, Alligator, Mix Channel volume CV.
Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise. -- L.Carroll

howtobecalm
Posts: 78
Joined: 03 Feb 2020

Post 06 Feb 2020

orthodox wrote: ↑
06 Feb 2020
There are lots of methods to sidechain anything with stock devices. If you just want to duck your bass with the kick drum, that might not even require sidechaining, you can use a gate instead. That can be done by a plenty of methods as well. You can use Thor mod matrix, Alligator, Mix Channel volume CV.
do you have a really easy way like a template for me id really appreciate it
can i use aligator ?

howtobecalm
Posts: 78
Joined: 03 Feb 2020

Post 06 Feb 2020

i just want to duck bass with kick a really easy way with stock devices thanks

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BRIGGS
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Location: Orange County California

Post 06 Feb 2020

Synchronous is a stock device now. :puf_smile:

It's dead easy, to drag a preset to your bass.
buy BTC

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orthodox
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Post 06 Feb 2020

You can duck the bass by passing its signal though Thor triggered by the kick drum gate CV. Something like this:

Image
Never imagine yourself not to be otherwise than what it might appear to others that what you were or might have been was not otherwise than what you had been would have appeared to them to be otherwise. -- L.Carroll

aeox
Posts: 2644
Joined: 23 Feb 2017

Post 06 Feb 2020

howtobecalm wrote: ↑
06 Feb 2020
i just want to duck bass with kick a really easy way with stock devices thanks
Sidechain.zip
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aeox
Posts: 2644
Joined: 23 Feb 2017

Post 06 Feb 2020

orthodox wrote: ↑
06 Feb 2020
You can duck the bass by passing its signal though Thor triggered by the kick drum gate CV. Something like this:

Image
Good solution as well, looks more simple which is good
Last edited by aeox on 06 Feb 2020, edited 1 time in total.

howtobecalm
Posts: 78
Joined: 03 Feb 2020

Post 06 Feb 2020

BRIGGS wrote: ↑
06 Feb 2020
Synchronous is a stock device now. :puf_smile:

It's dead easy, to drag a preset to your bass.
thats a good idea u still have to edit it a bit though but nice thanks

aeox
Posts: 2644
Joined: 23 Feb 2017

Post 06 Feb 2020

howtobecalm wrote: ↑
06 Feb 2020
BRIGGS wrote: ↑
06 Feb 2020
Synchronous is a stock device now. :puf_smile:

It's dead easy, to drag a preset to your bass.
thats a good idea u still have to edit it a bit though but nice thanks
You've got two good solutions a few posts up. In case you missed .

the zip i uploaded is a project file with everything setup already. just run your sounds through the sidechain channel and use redrum midi to trigger the kicks. Or use gate out of your kick device if that works for you. I like having more control so I separate that part. To change ducking, it's the envelope in Sweeper

EdGrip
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Joined: 03 Jun 2016

Post 07 Feb 2020

Or if you want to do it the old fashioned way, you can use an MClass compressor device.
You'll need to split your kick audio - you could do that by sending it into a Spider Audio Splitter device.

Then drop the MClass Compressor after your bass instrument, and connect one of the Spider outputs (playing your kick audio) into the "sidechain" input on the back of the MClass compressor. Old skool!

I expect the new SSL rack compressors have sidechain inputs too, if you'd prefer to use those rather than the MClass.

I prefer to use an envelope generator to do this kind of job, like the Thor solution above - Europa and Grain both have excellent graphical envelope generators. I might throw together a combinator later.

howtobecalm
Posts: 78
Joined: 03 Feb 2020

Post 07 Feb 2020

EdGrip wrote: ↑
07 Feb 2020
Or if you want to do it the old fashioned way, you can use an MClass compressor device.
You'll need to split your kick audio - you could do that by sending it into a Spider Audio Splitter device.

Then drop the MClass Compressor after your bass instrument, and connect one of the Spider outputs (playing your kick audio) into the "sidechain" input on the back of the MClass compressor. Old skool!

I expect the new SSL rack compressors have sidechain inputs too, if you'd prefer to use those rather than the MClass.

I prefer to use an envelope generator to do this kind of job, like the Thor solution above - Europa and Grain both have excellent graphical envelope generators. I might throw together a combinator later.
thanks man some
good ideas for me to try

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selig
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Post 07 Feb 2020

Simplest is to take the parallel out from the kick and plug it into the Key input on the SSL/Rack of the bass - done!
Selig Audio, LLC

howtobecalm
Posts: 78
Joined: 03 Feb 2020

Post 07 Feb 2020

selig wrote: ↑
07 Feb 2020
Simplest is to take the parallel out from the kick and plug it into the Key input on the SSL/Rack of the bass - done!
cheers selig i have figured out that way also with the ssl rack compresser lol , now just to get the settings right,

EdGrip
Posts: 1689
Joined: 03 Jun 2016

Post 10 Feb 2020

Here's a little Reason project demonstrating the use of Europa as a ducking envelope generator.

If you flip the rack around, you'll see the Gate output from the kick Redrum is triggering the envelope in the Europa via one of the CV inputs.

Here I've used a 14:2 Mixer as a gain device to demonstrate the CV envelope signal from Europa ducking (or "sidechaining") the bass volume - because Europa's CV signal is positive, I've had to set the channel fader on the 14:2 mixer to zero - the envelope signal modulates it UP from zero!
You can grab the graphical envelope in Europa and move it around, and you'll hear the shape of the "sidechain" change.

Really you can use any device that accepts a CV signal as a means of modulating gain or volume - a combinator, for instance.


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TheDragonborg
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Joined: 10 Feb 2020

Post 11 Feb 2020

EdGrip wrote: ↑
07 Feb 2020
Or if you want to do it the old fashioned way, you can use an MClass compressor device.
You'll need to split your kick audio - you could do that by sending it into a Spider Audio Splitter device.

Then drop the MClass Compressor after your bass instrument, and connect one of the Spider outputs (playing your kick audio) into the "sidechain" input on the back of the MClass compressor. Old skool!

I expect the new SSL rack compressors have sidechain inputs too, if you'd prefer to use those rather than the MClass.

I prefer to use an envelope generator to do this kind of job, like the Thor solution above - Europa and Grain both have excellent graphical envelope generators. I might throw together a combinator later.
I've been a Reason user since version 4...

I mostly do drum & bass so sidechaining is a bit different in my application. Anyway, what I do is use a send on a mixer (the large mixer device, not the main mixer) Route the send (from the kick {I also use the snare but I produce a different genre} to a spider audio splitter (in case you want to sidechain anything else as well) and then send one of the outputs to the sidechain input on the Mclass compressor. Play around with the input level, ratio, threshold, and attack and release controls until it sounds the way you want. If you want to trigger the sidechain even when there is no kick (or whatever sound you are using to trigger) playing then just use a dedicated output from whatever drum device you are using (be it Redrum, Kong etc) and make sure it plays for the entire time you want to sidechain.

EdGrip
Posts: 1689
Joined: 03 Jun 2016

Post 12 Feb 2020

You mentioned using a dedicated kick sound, that's not audible, purely for triggering the sidechain - good shout! That's called a ghost kick if the OP wants to Google it. Because you can't hear the sound, it doesn't have to be a kick sample - it can be literally any noise that gives you the ducking shape/envelope/sound you're looking for.

EdGrip
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Joined: 03 Jun 2016

Post 12 Feb 2020

Just a quick point about my Europa project in case it's not clear to anyone - it's not the kick sound that's ducking the bass, or even triggering the Europa. I just put a kick sample in that slot for familiarity.

The ducking is all happening via CV signals - not audio. When the Redrum sequencer plays a drum, it sends a Gate CV signal - a little "on" pulse. It's that gate signal from the Redrum sequencer that's connected to the Europa's gate input. Europa triggers its envelope when it receives that gate signal.

The envelope generates a CV signal that varies (modulates) the fader level on the 14:2 mixer channel that the bass is running through.

All of this would happen exactly the same if the audio involved was completely different, or indeed if there was no audio at all.

aeox
Posts: 2644
Joined: 23 Feb 2017

Post 12 Feb 2020

EdGrip wrote: ↑
12 Feb 2020
Just a quick point about my Europa project in case it's not clear to anyone - it's not the kick sound that's ducking the bass, or even triggering the Europa. I just put a kick sample in that slot for familiarity.

The ducking is all happening via CV signals - not audio. When the Redrum sequencer plays a drum, it sends a Gate CV signal - a little "on" pulse. It's that gate signal from the Redrum sequencer that's connected to the Europa's gate input. Europa triggers its envelope when it receives that gate signal.

The envelope generates a CV signal that varies (modulates) the fader level on the 14:2 mixer channel that the bass is running through.

All of this would happen exactly the same if the audio involved was completely different, or indeed if there was no audio at all.
Exactly how mine is working as well, I prefer this much more over using audio

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eXode
Posts: 726
Joined: 11 Feb 2015

Post 13 Feb 2020

I like to create a dedicated sidechain bus if I do styles that require sidechain for both pads and bass. Like previously mentioned, I also use the parallel output from the kick (and sometimes snare). In Reason 11 I find that using the master bus compressor (the new R11 device version) on the sidechain bus makes for a very musical result, in my humble opinion.

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eXode
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Post 13 Feb 2020

Here are two other approaches, one is using two Sweepers, one for audio trigger, when you want to use i.e. a kick in your song as trigger, and the other is using the master bus compressor, again with the kick as source.
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selig
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Post 13 Feb 2020

eXode wrote: ↑
13 Feb 2020
Here are two other approaches, one is using two Sweepers, one for audio trigger, when you want to use i.e. a kick in your song as trigger, and the other is using the master bus compressor, again with the kick as source.
Sweeper is great for creating more controllable "side chain" (ducking) effects because you can draw the curve to any shape you want (or use the envelope follower instead). Surprised it's not the "go-to" device for customizable ducking curves? (also makes an interesting compressor…) ;)
Selig Audio, LLC

EdGrip
Posts: 1689
Joined: 03 Jun 2016

Post 13 Feb 2020

selig wrote: ↑
13 Feb 2020
eXode wrote: ↑
13 Feb 2020
Here are two other approaches, one is using two Sweepers, one for audio trigger, when you want to use i.e. a kick in your song as trigger, and the other is using the master bus compressor, again with the kick as source.
Sweeper is great for creating more controllable "side chain" (ducking) effects because you can draw the curve to any shape you want (or use the envelope follower instead). Surprised it's not the "go-to" device for customizable ducking curves? (also makes an interesting compressor…) ;)
Agreed - this Sweeper version is super neat! (Neater than my Europa business!)
It works just as well with other gain devices or mixers, if you want to have one Sweeper control multiple sounds - but again, the CV is the wrong polarity so you have to turn the gain device to zero and have the CV modulate it up from there (AND set the CV input trim to 64). I wish RS' own envelope generating devices would allow more control of polarity and uni/bi.

Sweeper looks like a great "Swiss army knife" device in the best Reason tradition.

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