Sad day - Gibson Brands Files for Bankruptcy
It's not over (yet) for Gibson. Chapter 11 in the US is a protection vehicle to enable a company to sort itself out.
But interesting and insightful article. Just shows the impact of disruptive technology. The decline in guitar sales didn't happen overnight, and obviously the execs tried to diversify and compete with DAWs and computer/electronic instrument vendors when they bought Cakewalk from Roland. It would be interesting to know why the strategy didn't work and why they shut down Cakewalk.
Maybe it was just a bridge too far away from their core competence....
- BonsaiMacKay
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Yep, I know it ain't over yet, but it is sad to see Gibson hanging by a thread.raymondh wrote: ↑01 May 2018It's not over (yet) for Gibson. Chapter 11 in the US is a protection vehicle to enable a company to sort itself out.
But interesting and insightful article. Just shows the impact of disruptive technology. The decline in guitar sales didn't happen overnight, and obviously the execs tried to diversify and compete with DAWs and computer/electronic instrument vendors when they bought Cakewalk from Roland. It would be interesting to know why the strategy didn't work and why they shut down Cakewalk.
Maybe it was just a bridge too far away from their core competence....
- kuhliloach
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This seems logical and not sad to me. Since the issue of auto-tuners as a standard feature I knew something was wrong. But the real issue is China. The fact is they create beautiful instruments and there's little to no value proposition for buying a Gibson over an Epiphone. It seems like sometimes companies get caught up in their own isolated thinking without really much care for what the consumer might desire. Sound familiar? If anything I find the Epiphones superior to the Gibsons for reasons such as two knobs vs four. Four knobs might be standard but ask most players if they ever dial any of those knobs down from the maximum value. In my opinion two knobs is better than four not only lowering the value proposition of a Gibson but also making the Gibson undesirable. With every hard lesson comes an opportunity for growth.
- BonsaiMacKay
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Well, you do know that Epiphone IS Gibson, right? Like, since 1957, when Gibson bought them out. Plus Epiphone LPs ususally come with four knobs. Anyway, I meant "sad day" in terms of their history and what they mean (or used to mean). Concerning the knobs, it all depends on what they do, don't you think? Contrary to you, everyone I know, myself included, will not dial them all to max. I mean both tone knobs on max? Not for me. Now the Min-Etune/G-Force auto-tuners did foreshadow the end... and, by the way, Gibson fit both Gibson and Epiphone guitars with those...kuhliloach wrote: ↑01 May 2018This seems logical and not sad to me. Since the issue of auto-tuners as a standard feature I knew something was wrong. But the real issue is China. The fact is they create beautiful instruments and there's little to no value proposition for buying a Gibson over an Epiphone. It seems like sometimes companies get caught up in their own isolated thinking without really much care for what the consumer might desire. Sound familiar? If anything I find the Epiphones superior to the Gibsons for reasons such as two knobs vs four. Four knobs might be standard but ask most players if they ever dial any of those knobs down from the maximum value. In my opinion two knobs is better than four not only lowering the value proposition of a Gibson but also making the Gibson undesirable. With every hard lesson comes an opportunity for growth.
http://www.epiphone.com/Products/Electr ... -Paul.aspx
http://www.epiphone.com/Min-ETune.aspx
I've been playing for about 20 years and I've never needed the tone knobs set to anything other than full on. I don't want my sound to be muffled. I like the sound of the pickups I use and the sustain of my guitar. I have two knobs on all my guitars and the only one I ever use is volume. If I need to tweak the actual EQ/sound, I do so from the amp. But I've already got the amps set up, so no need to change anything.BonsaiMacKay wrote: ↑02 May 2018Contrary to you, everyone I know, myself included, will not dial them all to max. I mean both tone knobs on max? Not for me.
- EnochLight
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Win 10 | Ableton Live 11 Suite | Reason 12 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | RME Babyface Pro | Akai MPC Live 2 & Akai Force | Roland System 8, MX1, TB3 | Dreadbox Typhon | Korg Minilogue XD
No. the name is too big for it to disappear. There will be some restructuring and gibson will focus on the main business and learn from the mistakes. I think that's the best for everyone. I am happy with it.An end to era.
- EnochLight
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My bad. I felt guitars were considered "other hardware". Didn't even think to check the Kitchen forum!
@mods: can you merge these threads?
Win 10 | Ableton Live 11 Suite | Reason 12 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | RME Babyface Pro | Akai MPC Live 2 & Akai Force | Roland System 8, MX1, TB3 | Dreadbox Typhon | Korg Minilogue XD
Yeah, not very aptly titled either ^^ Just didn‘t want you to wonder why theres no resonance or the others to wonder if they would have to repeat themselvesEnochLight wrote: ↑02 May 2018My bad. I felt guitars were considered "other hardware". Didn't even think to check the Kitchen forum!
@mods: can you merge these threads?
Topics merged and moved to Hardware and Other Software.
Original title fixed to be more descriptive.
Original title fixed to be more descriptive.
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This is hardly surprising to me. Their quality standards have gone to garbage a long time ago (look on youtube for those people who dumpster-dive for unsellable but brand new Gibsons). Their ridiculous model releases made no sense commercially (Modern Flying V, please spare me!), the overall build quality is ridiculed by many, their stupid gimmicks that nobody ever thought they might want (robotuners!)
But mostly, and a lot of businesses are on the edge of failure because of this, they attempted to diversify into markets they should not be entering in.
The wiseass CEO who though Gibson would sell simply as a 'brand' rather than a 'guitar brand' was sorely mistaken. Sunburst painted studio monitors ? Uh, no thank you. Cakewalk ?
They can't even stay on the right side of the law with endangered timber sourcing. So their demise is of their own making, and I doubt the iconic status that the name 'Gibson' once held will ever have value to consumers again.
But mostly, and a lot of businesses are on the edge of failure because of this, they attempted to diversify into markets they should not be entering in.
The wiseass CEO who though Gibson would sell simply as a 'brand' rather than a 'guitar brand' was sorely mistaken. Sunburst painted studio monitors ? Uh, no thank you. Cakewalk ?
They can't even stay on the right side of the law with endangered timber sourcing. So their demise is of their own making, and I doubt the iconic status that the name 'Gibson' once held will ever have value to consumers again.
Gibson have been in the news for quite a while now regarding this and related issues. No surprise there. I think the brand is iconic enough that it will live on in some fashion - either it gets its act together and refocuses on making quality guitars, or the brand gets sold to another company (hopefully one that can do the former, in this case).
- jayhosking
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Sometimes this forum leaves me wondering if I live in bizarroland. Epiphones better than Gibsons—are we playing the same guitars? Quality gone downhill—did everyone forget the garbage they put out in the 80s before course-correcting in the mid 90s? As a company, they're in some dire need of adjustment, but an SG Standard is arguably as good as it's ever been, and maybe even better considering some of the small additions (e.g. way way way better tuning pegs).
And this is coming from someone who doesn't have any particular loyalty to the brand (I own Fenders and Larrivees, mostly).
And this is coming from someone who doesn't have any particular loyalty to the brand (I own Fenders and Larrivees, mostly).
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who the hell bought guitars in (and from) the '80's, dude? That was like the biggest slump ever in worldwide sales in guitars, thanks to Roland, who almost killed rock music.
- adfielding
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Maybe I'm being dense, but this does make their acquisition of Cakewalk seem pretty odd. I can understand them wanting to diversify, but it's not like they would have acquired Cakewalk and then suddenly realised "oh crap, it turns out we don't have any money after all!".
- kuhliloach
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Yes I realize they are the same company but the profit margin must be higher on the Gibsons, and if the (new) Epiphones are so great then fewer Gibson sales = less profit. Regarding knobs thanks for the feedback. I guess it really depends on what's needed. The idea of fewer knobs, and less internal wiring, seems desirable to me. I'd even go for a one knobber - volume.
- BonsaiMacKay
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I totally get you, but tone knobs can help a lot in improv music, for example, when a little cut here and there can help, depending on where you are going with the music, and you don't want to stand up, go to the amp and stop playing. Later, you can bring back the freq that was cut as needed without getting up again. A pinky can be uber useful in situations like that.kuhliloach wrote: ↑03 May 2018Yes I realize they are the same company but the profit margin must be higher on the Gibsons, and if the (new) Epiphones are so great then fewer Gibson sales = less profit. Regarding knobs thanks for the feedback. I guess it really depends on what's needed. The idea of fewer knobs, and less internal wiring, seems desirable to me. I'd even go for a one knobber - volume.
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