Intel chip massive security flaw
Can't I just not update windows and keep the same performance? I'm not concerned with any security flaws. I'm a nobody
- Exowildebeest
- Posts: 1553
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Not really, unless you disconnect your Windows pc from the internet forever from now on. This update is going to be pushed down everyone's throat hard.
It's amusing to think about the global impact - the entire world's computing power is going to dip very slightly in the coming weeks because so many chips are affected ( yesyes of course I understand it'll be more like a reduction of the growth rate in total computing power)
My OS hard drive is full. It will have trouble updatingExowildebeest wrote: ↑04 Jan 2018Not really, unless you disconnect your Windows pc from the internet forever from now on. This update is going to be pushed down everyone's throat hard.
It's amusing to think about the global impact - the entire world's computing power is going to dip very slightly in the coming weeks because so many chips are affected ( yesyes of course I understand it'll be more like a reduction of the growth rate in total computing power)
Here's one thing I'm wondering:
So far I've avoided upgrading to High Sierra because of certain things I've heard with Reason compatibility. So far, so good. I have a very new iMac (purchased this past Summer) which came with Sierra. Using reason 10.(most recent).
Now, I see that Apple said that they had supposedly rolled out some "mitigations" in High Sierra before, and probably some more to come now. Any opinions on going to High Sierra at this point? Or maybe we will be able to load just updates related to these processor issues (I doubt it)...
So far I've avoided upgrading to High Sierra because of certain things I've heard with Reason compatibility. So far, so good. I have a very new iMac (purchased this past Summer) which came with Sierra. Using reason 10.(most recent).
Now, I see that Apple said that they had supposedly rolled out some "mitigations" in High Sierra before, and probably some more to come now. Any opinions on going to High Sierra at this point? Or maybe we will be able to load just updates related to these processor issues (I doubt it)...
Hello.
Househoppin - I suspect you're not going to get the data you crave. You can keep refreshing this and the other thread, but probably your best bet will be to start reading the less specific music production forums like Gearslutz and KVR. Try searching forums for Ableton and Pro Tools for this subject, as they have far more users than Reason.
My view is the patch will happen, whether you like it or not, both on Mac and Windows. So all this is a bit like asking on a knitting forum what effect the continued rotation of the Earth has on wool.
Househoppin - I suspect you're not going to get the data you crave. You can keep refreshing this and the other thread, but probably your best bet will be to start reading the less specific music production forums like Gearslutz and KVR. Try searching forums for Ableton and Pro Tools for this subject, as they have far more users than Reason.
My view is the patch will happen, whether you like it or not, both on Mac and Windows. So all this is a bit like asking on a knitting forum what effect the continued rotation of the Earth has on wool.
- AttenuationHz
- Posts: 2048
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Well the effect the earth has on the continued rotation of earth is it keeps it in production. If the earth was not rotating nobody would be alive. Those that would have the sun would have a hard time keeping crops!EdGrip wrote: ↑05 Jan 2018Hello.
Househoppin - I suspect you're not going to get the data you crave. You can keep refreshing this and the other thread, but probably your best bet will be to start reading the less specific music production forums like Gearslutz and KVR. Try searching forums for Ableton and Pro Tools for this subject, as they have far more users than Reason.
My view is the patch will happen, whether you like it or not, both on Mac and Windows. So all this is a bit like asking on a knitting forum what effect the continued rotation of the Earth has on wool.
It is not too much of an ask for people or things to be the best version of itself!
- esselfortium
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From what I understand, they’ve released a security update for Sierra 10.12.6 as well, and I think also for El Capitan.brand wrote: ↑05 Jan 2018Here's one thing I'm wondering:
So far I've avoided upgrading to High Sierra because of certain things I've heard with Reason compatibility. So far, so good. I have a very new iMac (purchased this past Summer) which came with Sierra. Using reason 10.(most recent).
Now, I see that Apple said that they had supposedly rolled out some "mitigations" in High Sierra before, and probably some more to come now. Any opinions on going to High Sierra at this point? Or maybe we will be able to load just updates related to these processor issues (I doubt it)...
Sarah Mancuso
My music: Future Human
My music: Future Human
That would be good. I still have a High Sierra phobia...maybe that's stupid, but anyhow...esselfortium wrote: ↑05 Jan 2018
From what I understand, they’ve released a security update for Sierra 10.12.6 as well, and I think also for El Capitan.
- Marco Raaphorst
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check this:
- AttenuationHz
- Posts: 2048
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- Location: Back of the Rack-1
It is not too much of an ask for people or things to be the best version of itself!
I hope this means sandy bridge xeons tank in price so I can get my upgrade for really cheap
Thanks Marco, that was informative, something even I could wrap my head around.
- fieldframe
- RE Developer
- Posts: 1037
- Joined: 19 Apr 2016
That's correct, the mitigations extend to El Capitan: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208331esselfortium wrote: ↑05 Jan 2018From what I understand, they’ve released a security update for Sierra 10.12.6 as well, and I think also for El Capitan.brand wrote: ↑05 Jan 2018Here's one thing I'm wondering:
So far I've avoided upgrading to High Sierra because of certain things I've heard with Reason compatibility. So far, so good. I have a very new iMac (purchased this past Summer) which came with Sierra. Using reason 10.(most recent).
Now, I see that Apple said that they had supposedly rolled out some "mitigations" in High Sierra before, and probably some more to come now. Any opinions on going to High Sierra at this point? Or maybe we will be able to load just updates related to these processor issues (I doubt it)...
If you updated MacOS in December, you already have the mitigations.
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Thanks, but of course I'm already following the other forums. They have relatively few Reason users compared to ReasonTalk, though, so I'd think it would be easier to get Reason-specific reports here. I'd rather not rely on an assumption that every DAW will be affected the same as every other. All Win10 users should have the patch imminently if they don't already, so I really can't see why it should be so difficult to get a few quick check-ins from people who have the patch?EdGrip wrote: ↑05 Jan 2018Hello.
Househoppin - I suspect you're not going to get the data you crave. You can keep refreshing this and the other thread, but probably your best bet will be to start reading the less specific music production forums like Gearslutz and KVR. Try searching forums for Ableton and Pro Tools for this subject, as they have far more users than Reason.
My view is the patch will happen, whether you like it or not, both on Mac and Windows. So all this is a bit like asking on a knitting forum what effect the continued rotation of the Earth has on wool.
As far as King Canute and the futility of tilting at windmills--while I appreciate your eloquence, I don't really get your point. Yes, sooner or later I'll have to apply the patch, but I can (and certainly will!) put it off until I'm done with my current round of projects if I hear reports that performance is impacted. If there's a negligible performance hit, on the other hand, then I'd much rather apply the patch right away and get it over with.
[/quote]
From what I understand, they’ve released a security update for Sierra 10.12.6 as well, and I think also for El Capitan.
[/quote]
I wonder if this caused my computer to slow down... too slow messages that didn'y happen with racks before
timing is about right... and support appears to have no answers presently
From what I understand, they’ve released a security update for Sierra 10.12.6 as well, and I think also for El Capitan.
[/quote]
I wonder if this caused my computer to slow down... too slow messages that didn'y happen with racks before
timing is about right... and support appears to have no answers presently
https://soundcloud.com/moneykube-qube/s ... d-playlist
Proud Member Of The Awesome League Of Perpetuals
Proud Member Of The Awesome League Of Perpetuals
- AttenuationHz
- Posts: 2048
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What I found interesting is that the bug only happens for AMD on a specially configured version of Linux that allows the bug to occur. How many users would be on Linux though and that configured version.
It is not too much of an ask for people or things to be the best version of itself!
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Would you be willing to do a quick test in Reason, but both with HT off and ON ? I suspect with HT on the perf.loss will be more noticable.Exowildebeest wrote: ↑04 Jan 2018Here's my Geekbench benchmarks for 8700k on Win10:
Before patch:
Single-core - 6092
Multi-core - 27336
After patch:
Single-core - 6057
Multi-core - 27120
There seems to be some loss of performance in this benchmark test, but not much. It remains unclear how audio workloads/Reason are affected. Audio workloads are woefully underrepresented in benchmark tests - it's all video, games, physics, cryptography and whatnot. And I did not have time yesterday to figure out some pre-patch Reason benchmark.
Let's hope the difference won't be noticable in everyday audio use.
Edit: don't read too much into these scores, as it's unclear which tasks in the benchmark cause the lower score. For all I know, on task may be massively slower while the others are faster. I'll have to look at the entire table of results and see if I can find any differences that stand out.
Edit2: most significant slowdowns I can find are in JPEG and PDF rendering and HTML5 parse, -3 to -5 % give or take. I think this relates to accessing my nvme SSD. I don't think that'll be the bottleneck for audio rendering.
I haven't installed the update yet, otherwise I'd do it myself. I have a first gen i7 which doesn't yet have the nopcid instructions so it will be affected worse if I install it. If you're having a 3-5% loss, than probably for me that would be at least double...
For those who don't realise, including those saying "Chill, relax" do not include the fact that many of us still have 'pre' Haswell chips that are affected worse because they lack the nopcid instruction, which is used to mitigate the issue.
https://www.extremetech.com/computing/2 ... =Computing
RandyEspoda wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018Would you be willing to do a quick test in Reason, but both with HT off and ON ? I suspect with HT on the perf.loss will be more noticable.Exowildebeest wrote: ↑04 Jan 2018Here's my Geekbench benchmarks for 8700k on Win10:
Before patch:
Single-core - 6092
Multi-core - 27336
After patch:
Single-core - 6057
Multi-core - 27120
There seems to be some loss of performance in this benchmark test, but not much. It remains unclear how audio workloads/Reason are affected. Audio workloads are woefully underrepresented in benchmark tests - it's all video, games, physics, cryptography and whatnot. And I did not have time yesterday to figure out some pre-patch Reason benchmark.
Let's hope the difference won't be noticable in everyday audio use.
Edit: don't read too much into these scores, as it's unclear which tasks in the benchmark cause the lower score. For all I know, on task may be massively slower while the others are faster. I'll have to look at the entire table of results and see if I can find any differences that stand out.
Edit2: most significant slowdowns I can find are in JPEG and PDF rendering and HTML5 parse, -3 to -5 % give or take. I think this relates to accessing my nvme SSD. I don't think that'll be the bottleneck for audio rendering.
I haven't installed the update yet, otherwise I'd do it myself. I have a first gen i7 which doesn't yet have the nopcid instructions so it will be affected worse if I install it. If you're having a 3-5% loss, than probably for me that would be at least double...
For those who don't realise, including those saying "Chill, relax" do not include the fact that many of us still have 'pre' Haswell chips that are affected worse because they lack the nopcid instruction, which is used to mitigate the issue.
https://www.extremetech.com/computing/2 ... =Computing
I too would be curious if anyone else has done a before and after test. I’m assuming the older the chip the worse the performance, but is it noticeable in the newer chips? Or nothing to worry about?
If true, anyone know why this wouldn't be considered insider trading?splangie wrote: ↑04 Jan 2018ugg -
"Intel's stock took a small hit this week, but making matters even more uncomfortable, Intel CEO Brian Krzanich sold off $24 million worth of stock and options in the company in late November. Intel was already aware of the chip vulnerability then."
https://www.techspot.com/news/72576-mas ... -what.html
--illone
His argument is, that he sold after a selling plan.illone wrote: ↑07 Jan 2018If true, anyone know why this wouldn't be considered insider trading?splangie wrote: ↑04 Jan 2018ugg -
"Intel's stock took a small hit this week, but making matters even more uncomfortable, Intel CEO Brian Krzanich sold off $24 million worth of stock and options in the company in late November. Intel was already aware of the chip vulnerability then."
https://www.techspot.com/news/72576-mas ... -what.html
--illone
Hmm right in the middle of doubling the power of my computer.
Explained if asked.mind over matter and science combined.,I surprise what I'm trying to say is it's sutch a minimal hit to performance compared to this double your power trick.
Explained if asked.mind over matter and science combined.,I surprise what I'm trying to say is it's sutch a minimal hit to performance compared to this double your power trick.
Reason 12 ,gear4 music sdp3 stage piano .nektar gxp 88,behringer umc1800 .line6 spider4 30
hear scince reason 2.5
hear scince reason 2.5
- AttenuationHz
- Posts: 2048
- Joined: 20 Mar 2015
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This is an interesting video completely unrelated to the bug.
It is not too much of an ask for people or things to be the best version of itself!
- AttenuationHz
- Posts: 2048
- Joined: 20 Mar 2015
- Location: Back of the Rack-1
It is not too much of an ask for people or things to be the best version of itself!
Agreed with this sentiment. I have an old i5 760, just bought an i7 (860?) that can fit in its motherboard socket... and ... I don't even know if hyperthreading helps with that cpu. Does turning it on actually improve performance?RandyEspoda wrote: ↑06 Jan 2018Would you be willing to do a quick test in Reason, but both with HT off and ON ? I suspect with HT on the perf.loss will be more noticable.
I haven't installed the update yet, otherwise I'd do it myself. I have a first gen i7 which doesn't yet have the nopcid instructions so it will be affected worse if I install it. If you're having a 3-5% loss, than probably for me that would be at least double...
For those who don't realise, including those saying "Chill, relax" do not include the fact that many of us still have 'pre' Haswell chips that are affected worse because they lack the nopcid instruction, which is used to mitigate the issue.
https://www.extremetech.com/computing/2 ... =Computing
In the category of dumb impulse ebay purchases... especially in light of this new bug and/or I didn't even check to see if HT worked with that chip. lol
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