Trust - my 2nd RE is in the Shop!

This forum is for discussing Rack Extensions. Devs are all welcome to show off their goods.
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Speo
Posts: 22
Joined: 10 Feb 2015
Location: Austria

Post 06 Oct 2017

Hehehey there guys!

I feel bad for showing up only 2 times a year when a project of mine releases. You guys have been very supportive and have given me some super constructive feedback. I'll make time to be more active on Reasontalk in the future.

Anyway, Trust is out! It's a small, specialized polyphonic synth based on a single sine-wave oscillator with minimal controls. It's designed to be quick and fun, and relies on other devices in the Rack if complexity is what you're after.

If you're wondering what the "Cypher" part is all about: that should become clearer in the coming weeks, as more specialized instrument devices join Trust in the shop, which rely on the same backbone of code.

This project is a first for me in many different aspects, and has been a learning experience in many different ways. I hope you try out Trust with an open mind as I continue to learn about the many aspects of creating software instruments.

Feedback, thoughts, comments, inquiries, complaints, I'll be happy to answer all of them here :)

https://shop.propellerheads.se/product/ ... nthesizer/

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KirkMarkarian
Posts: 292
Joined: 13 Dec 2015
Location: Tucson, AZ

Post 06 Oct 2017

Just perfect. Tried it, made the sounds I wanted to with it, bought it. If you add anything, please add an attack knob. Makes perfect piano sounds, could make perfect pad sounds. Just too damn good to pass up, seriously. Thank you!

Edit: In addition to being pretty much perfect, I want to say it's begun to replace my Parsec patches for simple FM keyboard sounds, both in sound and CPU usage.

Another thing, maybe - is it possible to have a low resolution switch on the back? Give it a lo-fi sound and use up even less CPU. I mean, this synth is immediately replacing patches on my Parsec AND my RYM2612 - perfect keyboard FM.

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Speo
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Location: Austria

Post 06 Oct 2017

KirkMarkarian wrote:
06 Oct 2017
... If you add anything, please add an attack knob. Makes perfect piano sounds, could make perfect pad sounds. Just too damn good to pass up, seriously. Thank you!
Noted! In an effort for every bit of optimization I omitted an attack option, but I see the potential. Will give it another go.
KirkMarkarian wrote:
06 Oct 2017
Another thing, maybe - is it possible to have a low resolution switch on the back?
I like the creative implications of that even more than the low cpu switch. Will give it a go! Appreciate your words, super happy you're finding use for Trust!

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chimp_spanner
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Joined: 06 Mar 2015

Post 06 Oct 2017

Like it dude! Surprisingly versatile given the small feature set, and just the right price tbh (plus it has CV inputs which is super rare for cheaper racks). This approach is very much in the spirit of hardware such as the Korg Monotron and even the Volcas. I'm looking forward to seeing what the other devices in Cypher do, and what approach you take with them.

One small request; either a front panel control or a rear trim pot for the mod/vibrato speed would be nice!
Enjoy!

http://www.paulortizmusic.com

HP Envy J130ea | i7 4700MQ | 12 GB DDR | 2GB GeForce 740m | Komplete Audio 6

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KirkMarkarian
Posts: 292
Joined: 13 Dec 2015
Location: Tucson, AZ

Post 06 Oct 2017

Speo wrote:
06 Oct 2017
KirkMarkarian wrote:
06 Oct 2017
... If you add anything, please add an attack knob. Makes perfect piano sounds, could make perfect pad sounds. Just too damn good to pass up, seriously. Thank you!
Noted! In an effort for every bit of optimization I omitted an attack option, but I see the potential. Will give it another go.
KirkMarkarian wrote:
06 Oct 2017
Another thing, maybe - is it possible to have a low resolution switch on the back?
I like the creative implications of that even more than the low cpu switch. Will give it a go! Appreciate your words, super happy you're finding use for Trust!
Excellent! I only mention the low CPU versus low resolution knob to see how much more I can squeeze out of this synth - I'm running two right now on a 2012 Mac Mini. It's not pushing the CPU at all, Kong / Kratos and some other mixing stuff is doing most of the CPU push, but for certain piano sounds, I can easily do without the high-end, if a low CPU switch is available. Taking it down to 22050 or 11025 - warm, lo-fi, vaporwave-ish.

One other thing I noticed - you've nearly answered my request for an FM drum synthesizer. I mean, I can make bass drum sounds with this, AND punchy bass sounds. I don't think asking for more FM in this case would really be useful, but if you're pushing out a myriad of tiny devices...

Heck, you could pop 4 of these synths into one rack, same height same, width. Take out the ability to play chromatically, and ramp up the modulation levels. The reason I suggest this is because of the punchiness of this synth in particular - I've never had this level of snap right off the bat. Yes, I can create those sounds in other FM synths, but if you're using a single sine osc. with modulation options - this is the Max/MSP "sound" territory I keep pushing for. It's an FM dream.

In any case, I'm so damn happy with this synth - Parsec has literally been my go-to for the FM sounds I want to make, because it's EASY. This is EASIER!!! And, it sounds great.

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KirkMarkarian
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Location: Tucson, AZ

Post 06 Oct 2017

chimp_spanner wrote:
06 Oct 2017
Like it dude! Surprisingly versatile given the small feature set, and just the right price tbh (plus it has CV inputs which is super rare for cheaper racks). This approach is very much in the spirit of hardware such as the Korg Monotron and even the Volcas. I'm looking forward to seeing what the other devices in Cypher do, and what approach you take with them.

One small request; either a front panel control or a rear trim pot for the mod/vibrato speed would be nice!
Yeah, that'd be super - I wasn't going to push this point, because I'm just seeing it as a characteristic, but if'n you're going to modify it :D

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Speo
Posts: 22
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Location: Austria

Post 06 Oct 2017

chimp_spanner wrote:
06 Oct 2017
Like it dude! Surprisingly versatile given the small feature set, and just the right price tbh (plus it has CV inputs which is super rare for cheaper racks). This approach is very much in the spirit of hardware such as the Korg Monotron and even the Volcas. I'm looking forward to seeing what the other devices in Cypher do, and what approach you take with them.

One small request; either a front panel control or a rear trim pot for the mod/vibrato speed would be nice!
Thanks man! Rear trim pot for vibrato speed would be neat, I agree!
KirkMarkarian wrote:
06 Oct 2017
...
Heck, you could pop 4 of these synths into one rack, same height same, width. Take out the ability to play chromatically, and ramp up the modulation levels. The reason I suggest this is because of the punchiness of this synth in particular - I've never had this level of snap right off the bat. Yes, I can create those sounds in other FM synths, but if you're using a single sine osc. with modulation options - this is the Max/MSP "sound" territory I keep pushing for. It's an FM dream.

In any case, I'm so damn happy with this synth - Parsec has literally been my go-to for the FM sounds I want to make, because it's EASY. This is EASIER!!! And, it sounds great.
I like this idea, but it blows the scope of Trust. This modular FM synth approach is definitely exciting though! I'm super happy the easy nature of Trust connected with you!

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joeyluck
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Post 06 Oct 2017

Congrats on the release! I really like this one :D

Pairs very nicely with Frame CV I might add.

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Speo
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Location: Austria

Post 06 Oct 2017

joeyluck wrote:
06 Oct 2017
Congrats on the release! I really like this one :D

Pairs very nicely with Frame CV I might add.
Thank you! Also, thanks again for your invaluable feedback during development!

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joeyluck
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Post 06 Oct 2017

Speo wrote:
06 Oct 2017
joeyluck wrote:
06 Oct 2017
Congrats on the release! I really like this one :D

Pairs very nicely with Frame CV I might add.
Thank you! Also, thanks again for your invaluable feedback during development!
Always happy to help :puf_smile:

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KirkMarkarian
Posts: 292
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Location: Tucson, AZ

Post 06 Oct 2017

Trust in action - all melodic portions with Trust, drums with Kong synthesis only:

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Bumbum
Posts: 169
Joined: 14 Jan 2017

Post 06 Oct 2017

Really nice UI, very "outrun".
Have to agree about the Lofi knob ,it would be nice

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MirEko
Posts: 273
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

Post 07 Oct 2017

KirkMarkarian wrote:
06 Oct 2017
Trust in action - all melodic portions with Trust, drums with Kong synthesis only:
Very nice work ! really like this
:reason: :record: :re: :ignition: :refill: :PUF_take: :PUF_figure:

TritoneAddiction
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Joined: 29 Aug 2015
Location: Sweden

Post 07 Oct 2017

I love the concept and the simplicity of this device.
Though after tweaking it for a while I simply didn't get a tone/character that inspired me that much. Adding effects to enhance an instrument is fine but in general I need to get into the original sound first for me to pull the trigger on a synth.
If I need to add too many additional effects to a synth then the point of simplicity gets lost a bit. But maybe I'm misunderstanding the product.

Having said that I'll definitely see what those upcoming REs is about that you mentioned, because I do like simple devices that gets to the point quickly. Maybe the next one is for me.

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Speo
Posts: 22
Joined: 10 Feb 2015
Location: Austria

Post 07 Oct 2017

TritoneAddiction wrote:
07 Oct 2017
I love the concept and the simplicity of this device.
Though after tweaking it for a while I simply didn't get a tone/character that inspired me that much. Adding effects to enhance an instrument is fine but in general I need to get into the original sound first for me to pull the trigger on a synth.
If I need to add too many additional effects to a synth then the point of simplicity gets lost a bit. But maybe I'm misunderstanding the product.

Having said that I'll definitely see what those upcoming REs is about that you mentioned, because I do like simple devices that gets to the point quickly. Maybe the next one is for me.
I appreciate this feedback a lot! I try to make these Cypher devices good at getting you a particular sound quickly, so it's less about how you use the instrument than about which instrument you use. I considered bundling up the release of the first couple of devices to emphasize this, but I really dislike sitting on finished projects ;)

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KirkMarkarian
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Location: Tucson, AZ

Post 07 Oct 2017

MirEko wrote:
07 Oct 2017
KirkMarkarian wrote:
06 Oct 2017
Trust in action - all melodic portions with Trust, drums with Kong synthesis only:
Very nice work ! really like this
Thank you very much!

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MirEko
Posts: 273
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

Post 10 Oct 2017

Why does this RE need 9 or higher??
:( :cry:

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:reason: :record: :re: :ignition: :refill: :PUF_take: :PUF_figure:

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Speo
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Location: Austria

Post 10 Oct 2017

MirEko wrote:
10 Oct 2017
Why does this RE need 9 or higher??
:( :cry:
During the development of the backbone of code that Trust runs on, I wanted to keep sample integration as a possibility. Trust itself does not make use of any new SDK functionality, but I lost sight of the fact that I should have switched SDK for Trust. I'm really sorry you can't use it.

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MirEko
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Joined: 16 Jan 2015

Post 10 Oct 2017

Speo wrote:
10 Oct 2017
MirEko wrote:
10 Oct 2017
Why does this RE need 9 or higher??
:( :cry:
During the development of the backbone of code that Trust runs on, I wanted to keep sample integration as a possibility. Trust itself does not make use of any new SDK functionality, but I lost sight of the fact that I should have switched SDK for Trust. I'm really sorry you can't use it.
That's a pity for 7 users, luckily I just upgraded for 10 so can now use all the RE's :mrgreen:
:reason: :record: :re: :ignition: :refill: :PUF_take: :PUF_figure:

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Goan
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Post 16 Oct 2017

KirkMarkarian wrote:
06 Oct 2017
Trust in action - all melodic portions with Trust, drums with Kong synthesis only:
Loving this! Would you mind sharing how you processed Trusts output?
Goan doesn't do Goa, he likes samples, weirdness, beats
Tools of choice: Reason, iPad, MicroBrute
Listen: http://adamagon.bandcamp.com/album/the- ... e-remix-ep



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KirkMarkarian
Posts: 292
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Location: Tucson, AZ

Post 16 Oct 2017

Goan wrote:
16 Oct 2017
KirkMarkarian wrote:
06 Oct 2017
Trust in action - all melodic portions with Trust, drums with Kong synthesis only:
Loving this! Would you mind sharing how you processed Trusts output?
Sure! Glad you like the sound -

On the outputs of the Cypher, there are no effects units. On the entire mix, there are several.

The track starts off by being processed by the Audiomatic, and ends with the Kuassa Kratos 2

I wanted a specific, lower fidelity sound, so I use the Lab-One Executioner mixer to give an initial mid-90's "Roland SP-303" sampler sound. Then I run that through a Scream distortion with a tape setting. I also have the FutzBox adding some additional 22k, 12-bit characteristics, along with some noise. For reverb, I'm using the kHs reverb, and for delay, I'm using Reason's "The Echo".

For an immediate lower-fidelity character, I'd just slap a Scream on the synth to give it a tapey sound.

The Cypher's settings are:

Excite: 42
FM: 18
Zap: 0
Snap: 62
Release: 40

Adjust volume to taste

The way I process my mix is unorthodox. I was specifically modeling my sound after various cassette tape recorders that I've used in the past, as I was aiming for that ultra-saturated, low-quality sound.

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MirEko
Posts: 273
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

Post 17 Oct 2017

KirkMarkarian wrote:
16 Oct 2017
Goan wrote:
16 Oct 2017


Loving this! Would you mind sharing how you processed Trusts output?
Sure! Glad you like the sound -

On the outputs of the Cypher, there are no effects units. On the entire mix, there are several.

The track starts off by being processed by the Audiomatic, and ends with the Kuassa Kratos 2

I wanted a specific, lower fidelity sound, so I use the Lab-One Executioner mixer to give an initial mid-90's "Roland SP-303" sampler sound. Then I run that through a Scream distortion with a tape setting. I also have the FutzBox adding some additional 22k, 12-bit characteristics, along with some noise. For reverb, I'm using the kHs reverb, and for delay, I'm using Reason's "The Echo".

For an immediate lower-fidelity character, I'd just slap a Scream on the synth to give it a tapey sound.

The Cypher's settings are:

Excite: 42
FM: 18
Zap: 0
Snap: 62
Release: 40

Adjust volume to taste

The way I process my mix is unorthodox. I was specifically modeling my sound after various cassette tape recorders that I've used in the past, as I was aiming for that ultra-saturated, low-quality sound.
Thanks! Im missing the lab one mixer, but will try a trident or at3 in its place.
Also missing the futzbox but have the decimort to replace that.
Thanks for sharing your settings!
:reason: :record: :re: :ignition: :refill: :PUF_take: :PUF_figure:

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EnochLight
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Location: your mom

Post 21 Oct 2017

KirkMarkarian wrote:
16 Oct 2017
The way I process my mix is unorthodox. I was specifically modeling my sound after various cassette tape recorders that I've used in the past, as I was aiming for that ultra-saturated, low-quality sound.
Well, you did a fantastic job accomplishing that - seriously - it sounds fantastically retro tapey! I thought you were using CRAPRE2 at first, but man - I dunno', it just sounds awesome. Well done, man!

*EDIT - seriously, this track is like Boards of Canada and Portishead had a bastard love child back in '96. LOVE IT!
Windows 10 64-bit | Reason 10.4 |  Studio One 4.5 | Asus Sabertooth Z77 | Intel i7 3770k Quad-Core @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | Mushkin Reactor 1TB SSD | RME Babyface Pro| Nektar Panorama P-4 | Akai MPC Live

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KirkMarkarian
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Location: Tucson, AZ

Post 21 Oct 2017

EnochLight wrote:
21 Oct 2017
KirkMarkarian wrote:
16 Oct 2017
The way I process my mix is unorthodox. I was specifically modeling my sound after various cassette tape recorders that I've used in the past, as I was aiming for that ultra-saturated, low-quality sound.
Well, you did a fantastic job accomplishing that - seriously - it sounds fantastically retro tapey! I thought you were using CRAPRE2 at first, but man - I dunno', it just sounds awesome. Well done, man!

*EDIT - seriously, this track is like Boards of Canada and Portishead had a bastard love child back in '96. LOVE IT!
Thank you very much for the kind words! I do have Crapre, and I've used it on other tracks, but it is not always an easy-to-to mix effect. I found another trick to get a super lo-fi sound is to use 2 Scream effects, both set to tape, in-line. Set the first one to low speed, set the second to regular, both with full compression. For their EQ, both would need higher bass (not full on, but enough to boost), and then the mid/high can cascade down to taste. Slam it into a limiter, just like a cassette recorder and you will have a very lo-fi sound. Oh, and most importantly, each should only be between 9 o'clock and 12 o'clock. Not too high, or they over-saturate!

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EnochLight
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Location: your mom

Post 21 Oct 2017

KirkMarkarian wrote:
21 Oct 2017
Thank you very much for the kind words! I do have Crapre, and I've used it on other tracks, but it is not always an easy-to-to mix effect. I found another trick to get a super lo-fi sound is to use 2 Scream effects, both set to tape, in-line. Set the first one to low speed, set the second to regular, both with full compression. For their EQ, both would need higher bass (not full on, but enough to boost), and then the mid/high can cascade down to taste. Slam it into a limiter, just like a cassette recorder and you will have a very lo-fi sound. Oh, and most importantly, each should only be between 9 o'clock and 12 o'clock. Not too high, or they over-saturate!
Great tips. Would you be averse to sharing a song file example with this setup? I don't mean to digress from Speo's thread, so please PM me if you're open to that.
Windows 10 64-bit | Reason 10.4 |  Studio One 4.5 | Asus Sabertooth Z77 | Intel i7 3770k Quad-Core @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | Mushkin Reactor 1TB SSD | RME Babyface Pro| Nektar Panorama P-4 | Akai MPC Live

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