Reason 10 announced!

This forum is for discussing Reason. Questions, answers, ideas, and opinions... all apply.
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esselfortium
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26 Sep 2017

EnochLight wrote:
26 Sep 2017
I'm not onboard with comparing Omnisphere to one synth in Reason. Omnisphere costs more than the entire program of Reason, and one could easily argue that Reason - taken as a whole - is far more powerful (almost laughably so) than just Omnisphere (1 or 2).
Sure, but nothing compares to Omnisphere when you've got 500 dollars burning a hole in your wallet and you really need to hear some Enya
Sarah Mancuso
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jayhosking
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26 Sep 2017

esselfortium wrote:
26 Sep 2017
Sure, but nothing compares to Omnisphere when you've got 500 dollars burning a hole in your wallet and you really need to hear some Enya

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stratatonic
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26 Sep 2017

QVprod wrote:
25 Sep 2017
TritoneAddiction wrote:
25 Sep 2017

Well GUI and workflow matter after all.

Besides it's harder to discuss the synth themselves at this point since we haven't tried them yet.

Many times the demos aren't enough to judge whether you'll like a synth or not, at least in my experience.
stp2015 wrote:
25 Sep 2017
The reason for this is that working with the outdated resolution is becoming less and less pleasant, especially on laptops with high res displays. So, while I like the Synths more than graphics, I do want to see them clearly... :D
Nick Pa wrote:
25 Sep 2017
Yes ! Who cares what they (Synths) can do if we don't even want to look at them or can't see them well enough to use them to their full potential :?:
pjeudy wrote:
25 Sep 2017

Mmm..that might not be it. This thread is 26 pages Long and counting, at this point you can look at it as a Long conversation. And we all know how that can branch off to other topics.

Now it's time to focus on the UI ..lol... since no one can yet talk at length about these devices. I'm sure this thread will branch off yet again within a few post :puf_smile:
Granted I get that we can't test the devices yet, but the level of negative critique of the look of Europa is quite in depth. Looks decent enough and easy to follow to me. As long as it's not ReStereo I don't really see the problem. Perhaps because I'm not using a high res screen it looks clear to me? Sounds counterintuitive but who knows, graphics aren't my forte. Seems to look just as good as any other Reason or RE synth.
I didn't really like the look of Europa or Grain as well on my computer monitor.
However, when I saw their pics on an iPad it looked pretty good. Guess the higher resolution, ncolors helps.

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stratatonic
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26 Sep 2017

External audio into the synths FX? Would be nice.

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EnochLight
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26 Sep 2017

esselfortium wrote:
26 Sep 2017
EnochLight wrote:
26 Sep 2017
I'm not onboard with comparing Omnisphere to one synth in Reason. Omnisphere costs more than the entire program of Reason, and one could easily argue that Reason - taken as a whole - is far more powerful (almost laughably so) than just Omnisphere (1 or 2).
Sure, but nothing compares to Omnisphere when you've got 500 dollars burning a hole in your wallet and you really need to hear some Enya
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

This reminded me of something I read on KVR about Omnisphere 2:
its large complement of new-age and cinematic presets give an impression that it's all unicorns and rainbows playing pan pipes and harps.
Win 10 | Ableton Live 11 Suite |  Reason 12 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | RME Babyface Pro | Akai MPC Live 2 & Akai Force | Roland System 8, MX1, TB3 | Dreadbox Typhon | Korg Minilogue XD

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MarkTarlton
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26 Sep 2017

EnochLight wrote:
22 Sep 2017
Some people keep mentioning "the engine". I wonder if they believe Reason runs on petrol and pistons?

:lol: :lol: :lol:

On a serious note, no really - what is this "engine" people keep talking about? :?
not sure, but this is an interesting pop up screen :)
Screen Shot 2017-09-26 at 11.15.24 AM.png
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EnochLight
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26 Sep 2017

MarkTarlton wrote:
26 Sep 2017
EnochLight wrote:
22 Sep 2017
Some people keep mentioning "the engine". I wonder if they believe Reason runs on petrol and pistons?

:lol: :lol: :lol:

On a serious note, no really - what is this "engine" people keep talking about? :?
not sure, but this is an interesting pop up screen :)Screen Shot 2017-09-26 at 11.15.24 AM.png
It is, seeing as how we're on 9.5.2 right now. :D Also, people use ReWire still?? jk :puf_bigsmile: :lol:
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davidvilla
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26 Sep 2017

EnochLight wrote:
26 Sep 2017

...one could easily argue that Reason - taken as a whole - is far more powerful (almost laughably so) than just Omnisphere (1 or 2).
See, this is the Reasonite idea of "power" that I hate. So what if you can patch this into that a million times over, and re-patch that into this, and then flip this inside out, flip that outside in, split that into 4, combine these 4 things into one, cv the shit out of this, lfo your mom's butt while syncing her to host, stack synths like pancakes, modulate that thing there with this thing here, patch and unpatch and then re-patch, put your thing down, flip it and reverse it - GAWD. It's the SOOOOOOOUND. It's all about the SOUND!

I don't expect Europa to sound better than 10 year old Massive. I highly doubt it'll come close to Serum's powerful and sparkly output.

Why? Because Subtractor, Malstrom, Thor, PX7, Parsec - that's why.

But we will see, won't we?

Or rather, we will HEAR..... :puf_bigsmile:

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esselfortium
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26 Sep 2017

Comparing a softsynth from 2001 to expensive modern synths is transparently disingenuous. You can judge Europa however you like when it's out, but there's no sense in acting as though Subtractor's inability to sound like Massive is indicative of anything but your own misplaced frustration.

I expect a lot of people will be very pleasantly surprised with Europa. With that said, though, I'm not going to be too bent out of shape if a synth bundled built-in with my DAW turns out to be only 98% as good as an expensive third-party synth that 1) costs more than the R10 update in its entirety and 2) you can literally use in the same DAW if it matters that much to you.

"It sounds bad and you only care about plugging stuff into other stuff" is also a pretty flaky argument, propped up only by the expectation that skilled people will be too modest to dismiss it with a "nah, my music sounds pretty great actually" :puf_wink:
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AzureEyes
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26 Sep 2017

MattiasHG wrote:
alex wrote:
26 Sep 2017
In Europa, do you think it would be possible to add a tiny little dice button (on each oscillator) to generate a new random waveform? :)
The fact you can draw your own wave, somehow makes me suddenly think about a random feature but I could be totally wrong!
Thanks for the feedback! There are already quite a few random-based modifiers and modulators, but we'll take it into consideration at least.
So excited for Europa! I noticed it had a lot of these Additive like mods going like "Octave" do you think it will compliment Serum, Expanse, all the other advanced wavetable synths?!


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MattiasHG
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26 Sep 2017

AzureEyes wrote:
26 Sep 2017
MattiasHG wrote:
Thanks for the feedback! There are already quite a few random-based modifiers and modulators, but we'll take it into consideration at least.
So excited for Europa! I noticed it had a lot of these Additive like mods going like "Octave" do you think it will compliment Serum, Expanse, all the other advanced wavetable synths?!
They all have different strengths in my opinion. Europa has quite a few uncommon/special things. Particularly in the Spectral Filter and some of the dynamic wavetables (like Karplus Strong or FM Feedback). Try it out during beta or when the release is out, there will of course be a 30-day trial of Reason 10.

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EnochLight
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26 Sep 2017

davidvilla wrote:
26 Sep 2017
See, this is the Reasonite idea of "power" that I hate. So what if you can patch this into that a million times over, and re-patch that into this, and then flip this inside out, flip that outside in, split that into 4, combine these 4 things into one, cv the shit out of this, lfo your mom's butt while syncing her to host, stack synths like pancakes, modulate that thing there with this thing here, patch and unpatch and then re-patch, put your thing down, flip it and reverse it - GAWD. It's the SOOOOOOOUND. It's all about the SOUND!

I don't expect Europa to sound better than 10 year old Massive. I highly doubt it'll come close to Serum's powerful and sparkly output.

Why? Because Subtractor, Malstrom, Thor, PX7, Parsec - that's why.

But we will see, won't we?

Or rather, we will HEAR..... :puf_bigsmile:
And this is the hater idea of "blind condescension" that everyone else abhors.

David, seriously - if you think one softsynth is more powerful than an entire DAW such as Reason, you have some serious bias going on. :roll: ;)
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davidvilla
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26 Sep 2017

EnochLight wrote:
26 Sep 2017

David, seriously - if you think one softsynth is more powerful than an entire DAW such as Reason, you have some serious bias going on. :roll: ;)

Well I never specifically said that now, did I? :question:

And EDIT: Enochlight accusing someone of having serious bias :roll: LOL
Last edited by davidvilla on 26 Sep 2017, edited 1 time in total.

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stratatonic
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26 Sep 2017

stratatonic wrote:
26 Sep 2017
External audio into the synths FX? Would be nice.

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And maybe better yet, just an All-In-One FX unit for the Rack with those effects, with the ability to swap FX modules around.

jlgrimes
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26 Sep 2017

Hopefully we don't know the full details of R10 (maybe the beta testers do). That said I'll hold my harsh criticisms until it is released. And hopefully the release changes my mind.

Sure I wanted other things but that said if the content is "really" good, that would be a good thing.

I feel one of Reason's strong point has been its Factory Soundbank. If it is really getting an update that would compete with what Logic offers, then I could dig that. And the synths probably will be great for most users and give us more sounds and Combinators. Reason's synths always have been pretty unique IMO.


The VST issues I'm assuming are bugs and will get fixed eventually (Hopefully 10.0 resolves many issues).

I can clearly see why they wouldn't state bug fixes during a 10 promotion.

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AzureEyes
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26 Sep 2017

MattiasHG wrote:
AzureEyes wrote:
26 Sep 2017
So excited for Europa! I noticed it had a lot of these Additive like mods going like "Octave" do you think it will compliment Serum, Expanse, all the other advanced wavetable synths?!
They all have different strengths in my opinion. Europa has quite a few uncommon/special things. Particularly in the Spectral Filter and some of the dynamic wavetables (like Karplus Strong or FM Feedback). Try it out during beta or when the release is out, there will of course be a 30-day trial of Reason 10.
I was hoping we get some videos before release on both Europa and Grain. Maybe even a livestream on Facebook with you and Ryan walking us through the new instruments and sounds!


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EnochLight
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26 Sep 2017

davidvilla wrote:
26 Sep 2017
Well I never specifically said that now, did I? :question:
True, it was not specifically said by you. Mine was more a general observation that Omnisphere cost more than Reason by itself, so comparing Omnisphere to just Europa, or Grain, or 1 synth inside Reason in general was a ridiculous comparison. I've seen people go on about how awesome Omnisphere is, that's all. Whether or not Europa is as impressive as (say for instance) Serum, remains to be seen.
davidvilla wrote:
26 Sep 2017
And EDIT: Enochlight accusing someone of having serious bias :roll: LOL
Meh, don't be sore you're called out on it. ;) Your "unique perspective" in every positive Reason thread is pretty indicative of said bias, wouldn't you agree? :lol: :lol: :lol:
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davidvilla
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26 Sep 2017

My perspective is as unique as yours. :thumbs_up:

This is a positive Reason thread?? mmm-kaaaaaaay... :roll:

I merely asked Mattias what synths they were comparing Europa to, and I mentioned Omnisphere as an example.
But after Mattias mentioned something about how Europa will stack up favorably to the top wavetable synths out there, I then set up the Europa vs Serum and Massive matchup. CHECK MY ORIGINAL POST, lol.

And FYI - ED is the one comparing Europa to Omnisphere, not MOI, lol. See what you did, Ed?

Geezus, you people like to put words in my mouth, dontcha? :cool:

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26 Sep 2017

davidvilla wrote:
26 Sep 2017
My perspective is as unique as yours. :thumbs_up:

This is a positive Reason thread?? mmm-kaaaaaaay... :roll:

I merely asked Mattias what synths they were comparing Europa to, and I mentioned Omnisphere as an example.
But after Mattias mentioned something about how Europa will stack up favorably to the top wavetable synths out there, I then set up the Europa vs Serum and Massive matchup. CHECK MY ORIGINAL POST, lol.

And FYI - ED is the one comparing Europa to Omnisphere, not MOI, lol. See what you did, Ed?

Geezus, you people like to put words in my mouth, dontcha? :cool:
Don't take it that way David...Enoch has "a genuine desire to help, as well as a genuine desire to learn with the issue is..." :lol: :roll: :lol: :roll: :lol: :roll: :lol:

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EnochLight
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26 Sep 2017

davidvilla wrote:
26 Sep 2017
Geezus, you people like to put words in my mouth, dontcha? :cool:
No need to "play the victim".. :roll: :lol: :lol: :lol: I just clarified in my response to you. ;)
Nick Pa wrote:
26 Sep 2017
Don't take it that way David...Enoch has "a genuine desire to help, as well as a genuine desire to learn [what] the issue is..." :lol: :roll: :lol: :roll: :lol: :roll: :lol:
Yes, I do actually. ;)
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AzureEyes
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26 Sep 2017

Comparing Omnisphere to Europa is like comparing a Taylor Acoustic guitar to a Gibson or Gretchen arch top. It just doesn't work. Omnisphere has wavetables. Like 500 of them but you can do much with them besides FM, Unison, Granular, RM, Sync. While I seen in the R10 video that Europa does a lot more to the wavetables it has and has a dynamic wavetables set which can change depending on the way you process it from my understanding. Omnisphere is amazing but it's totally a different instrument compared to Europa!

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EdGrip
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26 Sep 2017

(nah)
Last edited by EdGrip on 27 Sep 2017, edited 3 times in total.

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tiker01
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26 Sep 2017

Topic locked till you cool down!

BTW could you and everybody please try to be more humble when expressing yourself about someone else`s opinion or the update itself?
    
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tiker01
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27 Sep 2017

Topic is unlocked.

After talking about all the things that you don't like about Reason 10, I am interested in the opinion of those who wanted new synths and plan to upgrade!

BTW the beta has not even started so we don't know if there is anything else coming with Reason 10.0!
    
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avasopht
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27 Sep 2017

I'm uber looking forward to playing around with some new stock synths.

There's been some innovative rack extensions released in the last year, and these devices look like they could be a bit of a challenge for them.

I've not yet loaded a single VST into reason and I have Synthmaster. It looks like I've even less reason to now.

It's an instabuy for me.

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