Ballad of the Soldier's Wife (Weill/Brecht) - Piano/Vocal

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mbfrancis
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22 Apr 2015

Recording an EP of Weill songs with my friend, an opera singer.  I'd recorded all my parts in advance, but she wanted to record live, so this is two mics on the piano and a crude vocal booth set up, mostly to control the room.  This is the first rough mix - piano is a little low, but let me know what you think of the recording and mix quality, specifically the piano and vocal EQ and reverb levels.  Recorded and edited (multiple takes spliced) in Reason.
http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=13106873
DB Download Link (better quality)

EDIT: New mix with better levels 
http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=13106994
DB Download
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Benedict
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22 Apr 2015

To me it seems the piano is in a fair sized room but the singer is not in the same space. I think the piano could use more clarity than volume (maybe an EQ boost in the mids-highs).

:)
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mbfrancis
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22 Apr 2015

Thanks...yeah currently there is zero reverb on the piano mics, only a room (Easy Room combi preset) on the vocal mic.  But since there is bleed into the vocal mic it makes the piano wetter than it would otherwise be.
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Benedict
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22 Apr 2015

So you set up the vocal and the piano turns to mush. Bugger.

:)
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mbfrancis
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22 Apr 2015

Benedict wrote:So you set up the vocal and the piano turns to mush. Bugger.

:)
Yeah, and if I hadn't set up the booth, at least the room would be similar...now the vox is pretty dry! 

Well, a few things I can do:  1) bring up (dry) piano mics, 2) back off vocal verb a bit, 3) expand or ride vocal mic so piano is cleaner when vocal goes out....dunno.  I'll post another mix tonight.
Producer, songwriter, multi-instrumentalist. I make indie pop as Port Streets, 90s/shoegaze as Swooner, and Electro as Yours Mine.

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Benedict
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22 Apr 2015

I read something recently about a similar situation, just can't remember where. Sorry not to be more useful there.

Are you able to re-record as I'm sure the singer was delighted with being jammed in a box? That way you go in knowing every mic will have every sound you can position piano and singer + mics so that they work off each other and as you re-balance in the mix no damage is done. It may also help her give a better performance too.

:)
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mbfrancis
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23 Apr 2015

OK, this should be better.  Pulled up the piano and then rode the levels down on the loud bits.  Also rode the room verb send on the vocal.   For fun ran the vox through the Fet compressor and it fattened it a bit.  Also ran the whole mix through a faint hall, not sure it works.

http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=13106994
DB Download

(Added to original post as well)
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eusti
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23 Apr 2015

I like this better. (But what do I know!?? ;) )

D.

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Benedict
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23 Apr 2015

Sounds nice and clear now.

Matter of interest: what are you planning with these?

:)
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mbfrancis
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23 Apr 2015

Benedict wrote:Sounds nice and clear now.

Matter of interest: what are you planning with these?
Oh good, thanks for checking back and listening!  

Not sure what we'll do with these, I love the songs, and when I played a concert with her last year (great rehearsal recording) I figured her voice was perfect.  Doing this one, Youkali, Pirate Jenny, Surabaya Johnny, Nanas Leid, and Complainte de la Seine.  I'd like to put out an EP I guess.
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Benedict
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23 Apr 2015

Thanks

That would have been hard to market a few years ago but now with the internet you can gather Brecht fans much easier.

Part of the reason I asked is that mix was nice and clear but didn't seem to have any sense of place in the mix. That is great if you are showing off the performer but may make it harder to pitch as a record as maybe people will want to see in their heads where the performances are taking place. Is it a smokey cabaret, an orchestral stage or is it even in the street? Of course the latter is interesting as it leads you into Les Mis/War of The Worlds territory which gives you a new angle.

:)
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mbfrancis
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23 Apr 2015

Benedict wrote:Part of the reason I asked is that mix was nice and clear but didn't seem to have any sense of place in the mix. That is great if you are showing off the performer but may make it harder to pitch as a record as maybe people will want to see in their heads where the performances are taking place. Is it a smokey cabaret, an orchestral stage or is it even in the street? Of course the latter is interesting as it leads you into Les Mis/War of The Worlds territory which gives you a new angle.
Oh wow, I'm not sure where it is - right now my mixing MO is just "don't suck."   :)  You're right though, the next step is to better define the soundstage.  I tried the global reverb, but I will likely pull this into Studio One to try some of the convolution plugins there.  

I've never got my piano recordings sounding this good, so this is kind of a new place for me, ha...any ideas?   
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Benedict
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23 Apr 2015

Hi

Well congrats as this is sounding good - but bare.

I would use the RV-7000 and play with spaces there, I'm assuming you have used the same Send for both instruments. Bright-dark, long-short, the world is your stage. Try some presets for starters and get a sense of where these songs age being performed. Or simply what sounds good if you aren't going to play to a theme. If you do the "whatever sounds good" thing I would be sure to use the same space for every performance or the album could sound very uneven.

:)
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Soft Enerji
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23 Apr 2015

Never having any experience in recording or producing what you are doing I'm firstly quite envious then secondly very impressed. Your lady is has a wonderful voice. I'm very keen to see how you progress with this.

Cheers

Mark

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mbfrancis
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23 Apr 2015

Thanks...in the cold light of day it needs some reverb love, but also I think her performance could be a bit more dynamic...not sure she ever goes below mezzo forte, ha.  A good first stab, though.
Producer, songwriter, multi-instrumentalist. I make indie pop as Port Streets, 90s/shoegaze as Swooner, and Electro as Yours Mine.

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submonsterz
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26 Apr 2015

I actually quite liked this.
I in my mind was hearing you put an old street market scene as a back ground ambience in it and picturing the scene of the singer standing at the corner of the market scene blasting her lungs out as people walked by tipping hats and giving smiles .
Lol am I just going mad in my old age :) .

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JNeffLind
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27 Apr 2015

Your singer has a great voice and the piano playing is solid. I'm a bit nutty with this type of thing, but what if half way through you dropped a beat and a little synth lead and this made a turn from classical and dated (though well done) to modern and grooving? I tend to enjoy mixing genres and surprising people so I might be the only one that likes this idea, but maybe it's something to think about. Bring in an electronic beat, a fat bass synth, maybe even towards the end slap some autotuning on her voice for some completely artificial sounding runs (obviously would be going for the electronic sound, not trying to sound natural). Possible remix or something maybe. Or maybe it's a terrible idea. Either way thanks for sharing. 

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mbfrancis
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27 Apr 2015

JNeffLind wrote:Your singer has a great voice and the piano playing is solid. I'm a bit nutty with this type of thing, but what if half way through you dropped a beat and a little synth lead and this made a turn from classical and dated (though well done) to modern and grooving? I tend to enjoy mixing genres and surprising people so I might be the only one that likes this idea, but maybe it's something to think about. Bring in an electronic beat, a fat bass synth, maybe even towards the end slap some autotuning on her voice for some completely artificial sounding runs (obviously would be going for the electronic sound, not trying to sound natural). Possible remix or something maybe. Or maybe it's a terrible idea. Either way thanks for sharing. 
Actually that's not crazy.  Here's the next song, it came out insanely good, I'm thinking of totally punking it out.

Youkali: http://soundclick.com/share.cfm?id=13108555

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mcatalao
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27 Apr 2015

Hey,
i really like your playing and the singer is great. 

The second song the piano is a bit lower than the first. I'd look into making the songs glue together between them.


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mbfrancis
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27 Apr 2015

mcatalao wrote:Hey,
i really like your playing and the singer is great. 

The second song the piano is a bit lower than the first. I'd look into make the songs glue together between them.
Thanks, you're right...actually I like the mix on the second one a lot, so I will probably remix the first to match it.  She stumbles over some of the French, though, so we'll probably re-record it.
Producer, songwriter, multi-instrumentalist. I make indie pop as Port Streets, 90s/shoegaze as Swooner, and Electro as Yours Mine.

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