PinkNoise removing their Refills from the shop in 2 weeks

Need some fresh sounds? Want to show off your sound design skills? Here's the place!
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Jagwah
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Post 16 Apr 2021

They will still have their Rack Extensions in the shop but they will host their Refills themselves.

Makes me wonder what impact the Reason+ sound packs have had on Refill devs. Props already take a decent cut of Refill sales, perhaps all up it is just too much and not worth it anymore.

Announcement here: https://reasonbanks.com/news.html?fbcli ... PjgJUSCrOk

DaveyG
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Post 16 Apr 2021

Interesting and, yes, I agree that it is probably to do with keeping a bigger slice of the profits.

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MrFigg
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Post 16 Apr 2021

Just need to make sure that quality refill designers like Pink Noise aren’t forgotten. Keep the name alive on RT.
丰2ॐ

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challism
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Post 16 Apr 2021

I think the refill market has been struggling since REs were introduced.
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Loque
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Post 16 Apr 2021

MrFigg wrote:
16 Apr 2021
Just need to make sure that quality refill designers like Pink Noise aren’t forgotten. Keep the name alive on RT.
They just released an update to Maia:
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=7522734
:reason: 11, Win10 64Bit.

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MrFigg
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Post 16 Apr 2021

Loque wrote:
16 Apr 2021
MrFigg wrote:
16 Apr 2021
Just need to make sure that quality refill designers like Pink Noise aren’t forgotten. Keep the name alive on RT.
They just released an update to Maia:
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=7522734
Yeah. I know. I’ve got it. This thread is about their refills being taken out the RS shop and only being available in their website.
丰2ॐ

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Billy+
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Post 16 Apr 2021

I've not brought any refills in awhile now unless they are device patches, but if I'm after wav files I stay away from refills as you can't use the sounds without a lot of work in devices like XO.

It would be really handy if reasonstudios released an official refill unpacker or at least had an option on the site or in Reason to batch extract the wav's.

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hurricane
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Post 16 Apr 2021

I prefer their refills to their rack extensions. Analogue Monsters is still my favorite refill ever.
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raymondh
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Post 16 Apr 2021

hurricane wrote:
16 Apr 2021
I prefer their refills to their rack extensions.
I concur.
Win 10 64-bit | :reason: 11 | Reaper | Scarlet 18i8 | M-Audio Code 61 | KRK VXT-6 | JX-8P | System-8 | D-05 | JP-08 | Sirin

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arnigretar
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Post 18 Apr 2021

Yeah agree, their refills are up there with the best. Top quality stuff :refill:

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moneykube
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Post 19 Apr 2021

this makes me sad... but does make a statement
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plaingraywall
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Post 19 Apr 2021

raymondh wrote:
16 Apr 2021
hurricane wrote:
16 Apr 2021
I prefer their refills to their rack extensions.
I concur.
Maia V2 is phenomenal...

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QVprod
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Post 19 Apr 2021

More than likely just profit share based. Refills have been a slowly dying breed since REs came out. It was different when it was the sole source of getting new sounds into Reason.

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nickb523
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Post 19 Apr 2021

I love this Reasontalk myth that ReFills are slowly dying since the introduction of RE's (9 years ago BTW!). Do you really think DNA Labs, Unrgrnd Sounds, New Loops etc are regularly releasing ReFill products just for fun? ​

Anyway, I'd guess PinkNoise have removed them as RS have done nothing to promote the shop and third party products since the release of R+. Why give away 50% when they aren't doing anything to earn it? - Seems like it's a bit of a protest going on. They would probably have removed the RE's as well if that was possible.

The whole third party eco system is in a state of flux at the moment and none of us really know when/if it's going to be resolved. As far as I can see the product most likely to survive this is good old ReFills as even in a R+ world they still have a place. If people are downloading lots of sound packs from a particular developer then it makes sense that they would be interested in bigger curated packs from that developer, however for RE's that picture isn't as clear.

Time will tell I suppose!

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Auryn
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Post 20 Apr 2021

nickb523 wrote:
19 Apr 2021
I love this Reasontalk myth that ReFills are slowly dying since the introduction of RE's (9 years ago BTW!). Do you really think DNA Labs, Unrgrnd Sounds, New Loops etc are regularly releasing ReFill products just for fun? ​

Anyway, I'd guess PinkNoise have removed them as RS have done nothing to promote the shop and third party products since the release of R+. Why give away 50% when they aren't doing anything to earn it? - Seems like it's a bit of a protest going on. They would probably have removed the RE's as well if that was possible.

The whole third party eco system is in a state of flux at the moment and none of us really know when/if it's going to be resolved. As far as I can see the product most likely to survive this is good old ReFills as even in a R+ world they still have a place. If people are downloading lots of sound packs from a particular developer then it makes sense that they would be interested in bigger curated packs from that developer, however for RE's that picture isn't as clear.

Time will tell I suppose!
Well to be honest I've been thinking about pulling my refills too. I haven't had much luck interacting with reason studios. Both James Pember and Joachim Ekermann simply don't respond to me and clearly have very little interest in trying to get me on the sound pack train. At the same time they keep swamping people with packs which leaves little room for independently produced refills outside of their curated little world.
~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-
Quixotic Sound Design: http://www.quixoticsounddesign.com
Europandemonium Refill: https://gumroad.com/l/YxIGB

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nickb523
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Post 20 Apr 2021

Auryn wrote:
20 Apr 2021

Well to be honest I've been thinking about pulling my refills too. I haven't had much luck interacting with reason studios. Both James Pember and Joachim Ekermann simply don't respond to me and clearly have very little interest in trying to get me on the sound pack train. At the same time they keep swamping people with packs which leaves little room for independently produced refills outside of their curated little world.
AFAIK they have large backlog of packs that is consuming a lot of time and they are also tweaking the format, so that may be the reason. Have you tried contacting James via forum PM? (just to rule out your mails being flagged as spam)

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Auryn
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Post 20 Apr 2021

nickb523 wrote:
20 Apr 2021
Auryn wrote:
20 Apr 2021

Well to be honest I've been thinking about pulling my refills too. I haven't had much luck interacting with reason studios. Both James Pember and Joachim Ekermann simply don't respond to me and clearly have very little interest in trying to get me on the sound pack train. At the same time they keep swamping people with packs which leaves little room for independently produced refills outside of their curated little world.
AFAIK they have large backlog of packs that is consuming a lot of time and they are also tweaking the format, so that may be the reason. Have you tried contacting James via forum PM? (just to rule out your mails being flagged as spam)
I tried several times to get some kind of communication going about packs going forward. I also submitted a test pack. Long silence. Mailed James again. Was referred to Joachim, who was "looking forward" to working with me. Resubmitted sound pack. Response was "I'm busy but I'll get back in a week". Since then silence, for about 5 weeks now.
~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-
Quixotic Sound Design: http://www.quixoticsounddesign.com
Europandemonium Refill: https://gumroad.com/l/YxIGB

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nickb523
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Post 20 Apr 2021

Auryn wrote:
20 Apr 2021
I tried several times to get some kind of communication going about packs going forward. I also submitted a test pack. Long silence. Mailed James again. Was referred to Joachim, who was "looking forward" to working with me. Resubmitted sound pack. Response was "I'm busy but I'll get back in a week". Since then silence, for about 5 weeks now.
Will PM you....

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QVprod
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Post 20 Apr 2021

nickb523 wrote:
19 Apr 2021
I love this Reasontalk myth that ReFills are slowly dying since the introduction of RE's (9 years ago BTW!). Do you really think DNA Labs, Unrgrnd Sounds, New Loops etc are regularly releasing ReFill products just for fun? ​
It could be that you and the others listed here have a fan base. I know it sounds like an oxymoron but dying (aside from human life) doesn't always lead to a complete death. Even MySpace still has users. New Loops and DNA Labs also sell for other platforms. Not sure of the others, but I would wager my guess that RS wouldn't potentially cannibalize their own income potential (with packs) if it were a substantial one for them. I think we can agree though that there are far more options for the exclusive to Reason users than there were when refills were the only option.

I do agree to your point though that packs could possibly lead to a resurgence for Refill makers seeing as RE hype has considerably died down as well.

DaveyG
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Post 21 Apr 2021

Surely Refill makers need to just switch to making packs.

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selig
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Post 21 Apr 2021

DaveyG wrote:
21 Apr 2021
Surely Refill makers need to just switch to making packs.
Unless you want to distribute exclusively through the Reason+ subscription service, which as I understand it pays a fixed amount per pack, this would unlikely be a good path forward for many ReFill makers. It's also a fairly specific format, so some ReFills such as those that only represent a single instrument, wouldn't "fit".

But I DO believe that some ReFill makers will probably consider doing their own version of a "pack" for future ReFill releases, but release it themselves where they can control the content and the profits (and be able to sell to more than just the Reason+ customers!). ;)
Selig Audio, LLC

DaveyG
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Post 21 Apr 2021

selig wrote:
21 Apr 2021
It's also a fairly specific format
Isn't it just a zip file with patches, samples and/or combis in it? Certainly the freebie ones are.

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Auryn
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Post 21 Apr 2021

DaveyG wrote:
21 Apr 2021
selig wrote:
21 Apr 2021
It's also a fairly specific format
Isn't it just a zip file with patches, samples and/or combis in it? Certainly the freebie ones are.
what he's alluding to (I think) is that the format is built around demo songs so that if you (like me for example) make refills that use just 1 synth, this isn't going to fit neatly as you need to make drums, bass, and other synths which is usually not the best way to use a single synth. (some are better at x, others better at y)

I'd love to try to make some packs regardless and improvise, but am stuck in a waiting line of undisclosed length while RS delve through a backlog of packs (or that's what they tell me) that they've somehow stumbled into. In the mean time, they keep hiding the shop and pushing their own subscriptions and packs. Which to me is a pretty good reason for withdrawing your products from the shop.
~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-~-.-
Quixotic Sound Design: http://www.quixoticsounddesign.com
Europandemonium Refill: https://gumroad.com/l/YxIGB

DaveyG
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Post 21 Apr 2021

Auryn wrote:
21 Apr 2021
DaveyG wrote:
21 Apr 2021


Isn't it just a zip file with patches, samples and/or combis in it? Certainly the freebie ones are.
what he's alluding to (I think) is that the format is built around demo songs so that if you (like me for example) make refills that use just 1 synth, this isn't going to fit neatly as you need to make drums, bass, and other synths which is usually not the best way to use a single synth. (some are better at x, others better at y)

I'd love to try to make some packs regardless and improvise, but am stuck in a waiting line of undisclosed length while RS delve through a backlog of packs (or that's what they tell me) that they've somehow stumbled into. In the mean time, they keep hiding the shop and pushing their own subscriptions and packs. Which to me is a pretty good reason for withdrawing your products from the shop.
Yeah, I see what you are saying. I had not really noticed the "elements for a whole song" commonality. I know some of the packs involve whole songs because there has been a debate about whether the song file should be included but I have only briefly explored the contents of the free packs. I don't see why a pack could not consist of just patches for one instrument though. Acid Basslines, Supersaw Leads, Huge Chords etc. It would seem a bit restrictive if every pack has to contain all the instruments for a genre. Those packs are going to get very samey, very quickly.

It just feels like RS should give all refill makers the opportunity to sell packs, which I guess would usually be smaller than a typical refill so you could split a refill into, say, 8 or 10 packs and sell each of them for pocket money prices. Same effort, same overall income. And I'm expecting RS to find a way to sell packs to their non-subscription users before too long. They would be daft not to.

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joeyluck
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Post 21 Apr 2021

DaveyG wrote:
21 Apr 2021
Auryn wrote:
21 Apr 2021


what he's alluding to (I think) is that the format is built around demo songs so that if you (like me for example) make refills that use just 1 synth, this isn't going to fit neatly as you need to make drums, bass, and other synths which is usually not the best way to use a single synth. (some are better at x, others better at y)

I'd love to try to make some packs regardless and improvise, but am stuck in a waiting line of undisclosed length while RS delve through a backlog of packs (or that's what they tell me) that they've somehow stumbled into. In the mean time, they keep hiding the shop and pushing their own subscriptions and packs. Which to me is a pretty good reason for withdrawing your products from the shop.
Yeah, I see what you are saying. I had not really noticed the "elements for a whole song" commonality. I know some of the packs involve whole songs because there has been a debate about whether the song file should be included but I have only briefly explored the contents of the free packs. I don't see why a pack could not consist of just patches for one instrument though. Acid Basslines, Supersaw Leads, Huge Chords etc. It would seem a bit restrictive if every pack has to contain all the instruments for a genre. Those packs are going to get very samey, very quickly.

Yeah there are packs that focus on types of instruments like basses for Algoritm, or supersaw leads, etc.

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