New Reason101 Parallax (Parsec-based) ReFIll

[Reason101]

Enjoy!

http://www.reason101.net/products/parallax-refill/

 

 
Get it while it's hot off the press!

[psychasm]

Thanks Rob, just waiting on the videos and demos
edit: Just saw there are 20 patches available to try.

[Reason101]

No problem. You know there's free demo files that you can actually try out on that page. Samples are better than videos and wav files no?

Edit: Ahh there you go.

[lowpryo]

No problem. You know there's free demo files that you can actually try out on that page. Samples are better than videos and wav files no?

 
i disagree with that! maybe for rack extensions that's true, but for a refill, I shouldn't need to download the demo, unzip it, open up reason, and load up the patches in order to hear the sounds. a quick demo reel gives the same first impressions but is 10 times more efficient!

[Reason101]

Sure. You can disagree. I'd rather have patches that are free that I can use in my own music, versus the ability to hear a sound sample that I can't use at all. And just to be straight, you're saying it's too difficult to unpack a zip file, open reason and then load the patch. Ummm, if you purchase the ReFill, you'd be doing the exact same thing. So no, I don't quite get that.

You're right though. It's not as immediate. But you can't quite evaluate the patches from listening to the sounds I create with them quite as well as you playing them directly. And using them how YOU want to use them. So perhaps it's a sacrifice in immediacy for usability. Or put another way: efficiency for quality.

Lastly, it clearly says that videos and sound samples will be forthcoming.

People today are way too ADHD. Take a step back and relax. Learn to enjoy the journey instead of shuttling to the next big thing and missing all the scenery along the way.

Peace!

[tibah]

Like the free patches.

Got your Synchronous ReFill last month and still need some fresh food for Parsec, so I'm always looking for patches and inspiration for my own sounds. 

Good luck with this one!

[lowpryo]

Sure. You can disagree. I'd rather have patches that are free that I can use in my own music, versus the ability to hear a sound sample that I can't use at all. And just to be straight, you're saying it's too difficult to unpack a zip file, open reason and then load the patch. Ummm, if you purchase the ReFill, you'd be doing the exact same thing. So no, I don't quite get that.

You're right though. It's not as immediate. But you can't quite evaluate the patches from listening to the sounds I create with them quite as well as you playing them directly. And using them how YOU want to use them. So perhaps it's a sacrifice in immediacy for usability. Or put another way: efficiency for quality.

Lastly, it clearly says that videos and sound samples will be forthcoming.

People today are way too ADHD. Take a step back and relax. Learn to enjoy the journey instead of shuttling to the next big thing and missing all the scenery along the way.

Peace!

well, all of the other major Refill makers provide audio demos, and sometimes those lead me to make a purchase. i don't understand why my preference for audio demos is being questioned here. it's not a revolutionary concept.
also, if I want a product, obviously I will have no problems downloading & unzipping it to use it. that's a totally different case than downloading a product i know nothing about.
but thanks for taking the time to write that long post lecturing me, a consumer, about how I should want to shop.

[Reason101]

Like the free patches.

Got your Synchronous ReFill last month and still need some fresh food for Parsec, so I'm always looking for patches and inspiration for my own sounds. 

Good luck with this one!

Thanks! Hope you enjoy the patches. Cheers!

[Reason101]

well, all of the other major Refill makers provide audio demos, and sometimes those lead me to make a purchase. i don't understand why my preference for audio demos is being questioned here. it's not a revolutionary concept.
also, if I want a product, obviously I will have no problems downloading & unzipping it to use it. that's a totally different case than downloading a product i know nothing about.
but thanks for taking the time to write that long post lecturing me, a consumer, about how I should want to shop.

Nothing I said above questions your preference, nor am I lecturing you. I'm stating my reasons and reaction to YOUR comment, not the other way around. I was also stating my preference, and also said from the very beginning how I'm open to your disagreement. I also have said that sample videos / sound files will be coming, which is what you're looking for right?

I am also not questioning how, where, why, or with whom you shop.

One more time: Peace.

[lowpryo]

well, all of the other major Refill makers provide audio demos, and sometimes those lead me to make a purchase. i don't understand why my preference for audio demos is being questioned here. it's not a revolutionary concept.
also, if I want a product, obviously I will have no problems downloading & unzipping it to use it. that's a totally different case than downloading a product i know nothing about.
but thanks for taking the time to write that long post lecturing me, a consumer, about how I should want to shop.

Nothing I said above questions your preference, nor am I lecturing you. I'm stating my reasons and reaction to YOUR comment, not the other way around. I was also stating my preference, and also said from the very beginning how I'm open to your disagreement. I also have said that sample videos / sound files will be coming, which is what you're looking for right?

I am also not questioning how, where, why, or with whom you shop.

One more time: Peace.

my first post was constructive criticism because you were clearly underestimating the value of audio/video demos. you said "samples are better than video and wav files, no?". i answered your question with a "no" and explained myself. i figured you would value that customer feedback (especially considering you asked for it), but instead you came back with a long defensive rant, as if i was attacking your business model. that was not necessary. sorry if i gave the wrong impression.

[hydlide]

i answered your question with a "no" and explained myself. i figured you would value that customer feedback (especially considering you asked for it), but instead you came back with a long defensive rant, as if i was attacking your business model. that was not necessary.
"Peace."

I personally didn't see the "defensive rant". All I am seeing right now is an open discussion from reason101 and yourself about different preferred methods on show casing a refill.

It is based on personal opinions, the word "rant" just puts the whole topic in a wrong perspective from my point of view while reading this as an outsider.
I don't mind just samples. Some refill creators do the same to reflect their ideas, others provide videos so they can get downvoted on youtube (because the refill isn't free). So on that note, every refill developer has their own methods to exploit the features that a refill has to provide.

We as a customer can decide if we get it, or don't... that is all up to us.

It is parsec + reason101, so I kind of know (from a history point of view) what to expect. Quality...

[lowpryo]

I personally didn't see the "defensive rant". All I am seeing right now is an open discussion from reason101 and yourself about different preferred methods on show casing a refill.

It is based on personal opinions, the word "rant" just puts the whole topic in a wrong perspective from my point of view while reading this as an outsider.
I don't mind just samples. Some refill creators do the same to reflect their ideas, others provide videos so they can get downvoted on youtube (because the refill isn't free). So on that note, every refill developer has their own methods to exploit the features that a refill has to provide.

We as a customer can decide if we get it, or don't... that is all up to us.

It is parsec + reason101, so I kind of know (from a history point of view) what to expect. Quality...

you're right, maybe "rant" was a poor word choice. i shouldn't have blown it out of proportion. but i think my perspective on this situation is different because i'm not seeing this as a 'boardie-to-boardie' discussion, but as a 'seller-to-consumer' discussion. and that's not really how this kind of interaction should happen.
imagine going to a restaurant and telling the waiter that you prefer your burger medium-rare. you wouldn't want to then hear the chef's explanation on why he thinks well-done burgers are better than medium-rare burgers. a discussion doesn't have to take place here. you would feel like your opinion is being invalidated, but in reality the customer's opinion should be the most valuable in that situation.
in that way, i'm just trying to provide constructive feedback as to how this kind of business should be handled. however, if Reason101 is just doing this as a personal hobby, and doesn't really aspire to be successful off of selling ReFills, then what i'm saying doesn't really matter, and i'm sorry for taking this way off track! if this is purely a boardie discussion, then of course we can agree to disagree!

[Reason101]

you're right, maybe "rant" was a poor word choice. i shouldn't have blown it out of proportion. but i think my perspective on this situation is different because i'm not seeing this as a 'boardie-to-boardie' discussion, but as a 'seller-to-consumer' discussion. and that's not really how this kind of interaction should happen.
imagine going to a restaurant and telling the waiter that you prefer your burger medium-rare. you wouldn't want to then hear the chef's explanation on why he thinks well-done burgers are better than medium-rare burgers. a discussion doesn't have to take place here. you would feel like your opinion is being invalidated, but in reality the customer's opinion should be the most valuable in that situation.
in that way, i'm just trying to provide constructive feedback as to how this kind of business should be handled. however, if Reason101 is just doing this as a personal hobby, and doesn't really aspire to be successful off of selling ReFills, then what i'm saying doesn't really matter, and i'm sorry for taking this way off track! if this is purely a boardie discussion, then of course we can agree to disagree!

If I'm the chef and I've served you a sample of the beef instead of a picture of it, I wouldn't expect you to burst through the doors and lecture me on how I should have served you a picture instead of a free sample to taste. Most customers would be overjoyed to have a little bite of the fillet before they purchased the entrée.

And I find it interesting that you choose to ignore my comment about how I stated in writing on that product page that videos and sound samples WILL BE COMING. It's interesting you refuse to acknowledge that point. That tells me a lot.

It tells me A) You haven't taken the time to read the product page, and B) You haven't seen any of my other products. If you had, you'd see I always provide exactly what you're lecturing me for not providing.

Now, I appreciate your feedback, as much as everyone's. You're suggesting that I provide something I've already said on my site I would provide. So where exactly is the problem here?

Rob

[lowpryo]

If I'm the chef and I've served you a sample of the beef instead of a picture of it, I wouldn't expect you to burst through the doors and lecture me on how I should have served you a picture instead of a free sample to taste. Most customers would be overjoyed to have a little bite of the fillet before they purchased the entrée.

And I find it interesting that you choose to ignore my comment about how I stated in writing on that product page that videos and sound samples WILL BE COMING. It's interesting you refuse to acknowledge that point. That tells me a lot.

It tells me A) You haven't taken the time to read the product page, and B) You haven't seen any of my other products. If you had, you'd see I always provide exactly what you're lecturing me for not providing.

Now, I appreciate your feedback, as much as everyone's. You're suggesting that I provide something I've already said on my site I would provide. So where exactly is the problem here?

Rob

the food analogy is not relevant there. food samples and synth patch samples cannot objectively be compared. that's like comparing apples and airplanes. my analogy was about the vendor-customer relationship in both scenarios. but really that's besides the point.
clearly this conversation has totally sidetracked. i'm no longer complaining about the lack of samples. i'm glad you understood my original concern, and i'm super glad that you'll be providing samples. that's great. my problem was with your need to defend and debate when i provided totally reasonable feedback. that isn't how a business should operate. but if you're doing this as a hobby, and you don't necessarily care about good business practices, then forget i ever said anything.

[Reason101]

the food analogy is not relevant there. food samples and synth patch samples cannot objectively be compared. that's like comparing apples and airplanes. my analogy was about the vendor-customer relationship in both scenarios. but really that's besides the point.
clearly this conversation has totally sidetracked. i'm no longer complaining about the lack of samples. i'm glad you understood my original concern, and i'm super glad that you'll be providing samples. that's great. my problem was with your need to defend and debate when i provided totally reasonable feedback. that isn't how a business should operate. but if you're doing this as a hobby, and you don't necessarily care about good business practices, then forget i ever said anything.

I'm just running with the analogy you created. I think it was a good one. I also thing it's disengenuous to back away from it once you've thrown it out there.

Nothing wrong with a sidetrack. I'm ok talking about it if you are. Since I originated it, I think that I'm the person that moderates whether or not it's sidetracked (other than the actual forum moderators, that is).

You were never complaining about the lack of samples, unless I'm mistaken. You were complaining about the lack of videos / sound examples. Patch examples are what you were upset about having there, because it took you several steps to unload them and open them. That wasn't efficient enough for you.

You didn't necessarily provide "reasonable" feedback. You provided your personal feedback. Whether it's reasonable or not is debatable, and what we're discussing, among other things.

"That isn't how a business should operate" - so tell me how should a business operate? Is there a set of rules somewhere set in stone? Where are your credentials? And what businesses have you owned and operated that operated the "right" way? Where are your successes? Let's see them. 

I never said this was a hobby. That's your assumption. I've actually operated my business now since 2007, and before that I had a photoshop site / business which I ran very successfully. So while it's something I enjoy and I do consider it a hobby and not "work," it's still very much a business that I own and operate.

I always welcome a spirited debate on the subject of how businesses "should" be run. From my experience, there's a multitude of ways and there's no "right" way, as you are suggesting.

But I'm open to hearing what your "right" way is. Show me.

[lowpryo]

well if you say so..

I'm just running with the analogy you created. I think it was a good one. I also thing it's disengenuous to back away from it once you've thrown it out there.

i didn't "back away" from it. i explained how you were using my analogy incorrectly. i was comparing the relationship between "chef/customer" and "refill maker/customer". you were comparing food samples and synth samples. you completely missed my point, and used the restaurant scenario to illustrate a totally different point and it missed the mark.

You were never complaining about the lack of samples, unless I'm mistaken. You were complaining about the lack of videos / sound examples. Patch examples are what you were upset about having there, because it took you several steps to unload them and open them. That wasn't efficient enough for you.

by "samples" i meant audio/video examples. sorry for being inconsistent with my terminology. what you call "samples", i would call "demos" but i realize that i wasn't consistent there. i'm happy that you will provide examples in the future!

You didn't necessarily provide "reasonable" feedback. You provided your personal feedback. Whether it's reasonable or not is debatable, and what we're discussing, among other things.

you phrased the question "samples are better than videos and wav files, no?". i answered that question. if answering a question that you asked isn't considered "reasonable" then i don't know what is!

"That isn't how a business should operate" - so tell me how should a business operate? Is there a set of rules somewhere set in stone? Where are your credentials? And what businesses have you owned and operated that operated the "right" way? Where are your successes? Let's see them.

you don't have to be a good chef to recognize bad food. you don't have to be a good athlete to recognize poor athletic talent. and you don't have to be a good businessman to recognize bad business. i'm a frequent customer of refills, and your reaction to my feedback turned me away from giving you business. i'm not claiming to have written any books on business practices, but clearly something went wrong here, yes? and maybe it was my fault just as much as it was yours. but debates with potential customers should probably be avoided. i'm sure that's been written down somewhere maybe? haha

[Reason101]

I don't think you're realizing my points. And you're saying that because of this discussion I've "lost" your business? If so, then your buying habits have nothing to do with the product itself but more with the attitude of the person who created it. Interesting approach. Do you need to know the personality of the chef in each restaurant you eat in? Or how about this analogy: If a member of a band rubs you the wrong way because they challenge your notions and beliefs, would you then refrain from purchasing their music? Does that automatically mean you won't give the music a chance?

Anyway, if you want a quality product, here it is. I enjoy a spirited debate over business practices, and I've enjoyed our back and forth. I miss these forum conversations. It's nice to be back!

One more time: Peace!

[lowpryo]

I don't think you're realizing my points. And you're saying that because of this discussion I've "lost" your business? If so, then your buying habits have nothing to do with the product itself but more with the attitude of the person who created it.

yep! that's not a very foreign concept. when people don't like how they are treated at a store or a restaurant, they will be unsatisfied. and this often leads to people taking their money elsewhere, regardless of the quality of the "products".
now with music and musicians, that is a much trickier subject. i can't think of a time where i've felt personally disrespected by a musician. but i can think of scenarios where people have stopped being fans because of a musician's beliefs. it's not that unreasonable.
now i realize that by continuing this debate, i probably appear much more offended than i really am. i'm not that hurt by your initial response. but it was pretty off-putting. maybe something to consider in the future.
peace!

[Reason101]

yep! that's not a very foreign concept. when people don't like how they are treated at a store or a restaurant, they will be unsatisfied. and this often leads to people taking their money elsewhere, regardless of the quality of the "products".
now with music and musicians, that is a much trickier subject. i can't think of a time where i've felt personally disrespected by a musician. but i can think of scenarios where people have stopped being fans because of a musician's beliefs. it's not that unreasonable.
now i realize that by continuing this debate, i probably appear much more offended than i really am. i'm not that hurt by your initial response. but it was pretty off-putting. maybe something to consider in the future.
peace!

Maybe consider how you initially respond to people who put in a lot of work to create products for you? And offer you free files. Note I said "consider it" -- since I don't want to come across as "lecturing" you. Consider that your initial response was quite off-putting. Especially considering it showed you didn't even bother to read the product page from the original post. Otherwise you would have seen that what you were asking for was going to be there shortly.

"Consider" that I didn't mistreat you, and "consider" that you initiated this conversation in the first place.

Again, it's been a lot of fun debating with you. No hard feelings. From the Chef to the gourmand: I'm here anytime you want to bite down on another morsel.

Chef Robere.

[lowpryo]

Consider that your initial response was quite off-putting. Especially considering it showed you didn't even bother to read the product page from the original post. Otherwise you would have seen that what you were asking for was going to be there shortly.

"Consider" that I didn't mistreat you, and "consider" that you initiated this conversation in the first place.

alright, i'll promise to do that. as long as you "consider" that my initial comment was merely answering a question that you posed. and "consider" that my original post wasn't even referring to this specific product (go re-read it if you'd like!), so the info on the product page is irrelevant. regardless of what content the webpage provided, your post was expressing that audio examples were inferior to demos. i disagreed with that. and now we're back to square one haha

[decibel]

keen to hear some samples

[Reason101]

alright, i'll promise to do that. as long as you "consider" that my initial comment was merely answering a question that you posed. and "consider" that my original post wasn't even referring to this specific product (go re-read it if you'd like!), so the info on the product page is irrelevant. regardless of what content the webpage provided, your post was expressing that audio examples were inferior to demos. i disagreed with that. and now we're back to square one haha

I tell you what. I will give you more consideration than you gave me. I have read and responded to every single post you've made here. Whereas, you didn't even take a minute to go read about the product I was presenting in the original post.

If you had taken the time to look at the product, and then come back with some constructive feedback, this discussion would have taken a totally different turn. But like many people these days, you leapt before you looked, and provided a knee-jerk reaction. And here's the result.

The real irony is that all the time you've taken to respond to me on this post could have been used to download and try out the sample patches I've provided for you.

Cheers!

Rob

[Reason101]

pssst. You may want to revisit the page. I posted a demo using only sounds from the ReFill. Have a listen and see what you think.

[Reason101]

Like the free patches.

Got your Synchronous ReFill last month and still need some fresh food for Parsec, so I'm always looking for patches and inspiration for my own sounds. 

Good luck with this one!

Thanks Tibah!

[tibah]

You don't have to thank me twice! Check post #8