Random Number generator - persistant, keeping number after reload.

[electrofux]

I am currently building a Drummachine Combi that randomizes the Sample Selection of 8 Mimics in Slice mode filled with 96 samples each (the idea of the device is being discussed here viewtopic.php?f=7&t=7531721).

I got it working with RandromRe BUT i had to realize that randomly generated slice/note numbers dont persist through a save and reload of the document. RandomRe generates a random number on a gate and when a document with the combi is loaded there is a.) no gate and b.) the last generated cv value is not saved and the current cv value is zero and thus the first sample in every Mimic is selected.

I am not sure what the closed and open values in RandomRe mean and if they can help me with this. Sadly i dont have the manual and the website is pretty empty

Also not sure if that is an unsolvable dilemmawith cv but maybe there is a way to generate a random number that is saved with the document? Any ideas?

[Imaginary191]

Maybe look at "BZR-1 Chaotic Signal Generator" RE. I don't have it myself yet. But its description says that its random CV sequences for specific set of parameters should be the same every time.

[electrofux]

Just tried it, actually a cool device. But it also doesnt keep its output value on reload. It would generate the same sequence again but then i would have to count the number of randomization runs and isnert it into the device to reproduce the last value.

Pandas devices actually have generators that produce a value internally that can then be saved. Evolution for example has 4 random outs and when i save a document and reload it and then press run on Evolution i get the last random numbers. Thats at least the mechanic i need. But having to press run before AND that the randomize button is not reachable from a Combitor is not workable for me.

[Pepin]

You could use the "X" CV output of BeatMap and click "Spawn XY" to change the value.

[electrofux]

That sound like a good idea. I am crossing the fingers that Spawn XY is accessible from the Combinator panel because i need a random number for every of the 8 channels of the drummachine. First thing i check when i come home.

[electrofux]

Like i feared the Spawn XY button is not available in the combinator.

The problem seems to be that my current random number generating device (in this case RandomRe) doesnt save his last produced random number and on reload the cv out is zero again.

All devices that i have tested that generate something random either lose the value on loadup or the random generating control (button) is not remotable or available in the Combinator. But i am still searching...

[crimsonwarlock]

Like i feared the Spawn XY button is not available in the combinator.

There is a way to sample-hold two values (from a random LFO) into the XY CV inputs. That would retain the current value. You can do this with this RE: https://www.reasonstudios.com/shop/rack ... cv-freeze/ It's also possible to setup with the free Morfin Crossfader, but you need to search the forum for instructions.

[electrofux]

Like i feared the Spawn XY button is not available in the combinator.

There is a way to sample-hold two values (from a random LFO) into the XY CV inputs. That would retain the current value. You can do this with this RE: https://www.reasonstudios.com/shop/rack ... cv-freeze/ It's also possible to setup with the free Morfin Crossfader, but you need to search the forum for instructions.

Does the CF Freeze device save the random value over to a relaunch of the Reason document? I have the Sample and Hold from Zvork and it didnt do the trick. CV was zero on reload.

[crimsonwarlock]

There is a way to sample-hold two values (from a random LFO) into the XY CV inputs. That would retain the current value. You can do this with this RE: https://www.reasonstudios.com/shop/rack ... cv-freeze/ It's also possible to setup with the free Morfin Crossfader, but you need to search the forum for instructions.

Does the CF Freeze device save the random value over to a relaunch of the Reason document? I have the Sample and Hold from Zvork and it didnt do the trick. CV was zero on reload.

Maybe I was wrong about that one, didn't use it myself. And thinking about it, it was not the cross fader either.

The trick is this one: run a random signal from an LFO into Pongasoft's A/B audio/CV switch (it's free). When you switch this signal to the X or Y CV input of Beatmap, it will randomize until you switch it off with A/B switch. A/B switch retains the last (random) CV value. I have no idea if this will be retained when you save the combinator patch, but I think it would.

[crimsonwarlock]

Well, tried it myself, doesn't work

[electrofux]

I have found 1 way to carry over a randomly generated value over to a document reload where the trigger is remotable/usable in the combinator. And that is with Quad Note Generator because you can freeze the randomly generated notes. Now it is still not 100% because Quadnote only has a limited range of note values (+20/-24 depending on the base keyi think) it can generate and it is a 2 step generation/save operation. But at least it shows that it is possible.

I gues the ground issue is that CV behaves like in the real world - if you turn off power all values go down to zero. So any randomly generated cv value turns zero too. Now that the sample and hold devices i tried also dont save the last sampled value is kinda dissapointing. It sounds like this could be solved differently.

The second thing is regarding the remotability of all the inbuilt random functions i have checked so far. I assume that whenever a random function is implemented that affects already available parameters (and that is what spawn XY or the other random functions i have checked do) then the trigger to that is not remotable. Smells like an SDK thing.

Gonna trial the Tonic Mint thing, maybe they do save the sampled value.

Edit: nope, CV-Freeze also goes back to 0 after reload. Since Quad Note can do it, how about a new sample and hold device that can also do it?

[selig]

I have found 1 way to carry over a randomly generated value over to a document reload where the trigger is remotable/usable in the combinator. And that is with Quad Note Generator because you can freeze the randomly generated notes. Now it is still not 100% because Quadnote only has a limited range of note values (+20/-24 depending on the base keyi think) it can generate and it is a 2 step generation/save operation. But at least it shows that it is possible.

As I understand how Reason REs work, any solution will be a two step operation. This is because while controls can be persistent, ‘generated’ values cannot until ‘committed’. This is why you have to have a REC button on REs to record/enter data, and the “freeze” button on QNG does the same thing if I’m not mistaken.
I haven’t explored all the possibilities here, so maybe there’s another way around this…

[electrofux]

I have found 1 way to carry over a randomly generated value over to a document reload where the trigger is remotable/usable in the combinator. And that is with Quad Note Generator because you can freeze the randomly generated notes. Now it is still not 100% because Quadnote only has a limited range of note values (+20/-24 depending on the base keyi think) it can generate and it is a 2 step generation/save operation. But at least it shows that it is possible.

As I understand how Reason REs work, any solution will be a two step operation. This is because while controls can be persistent, ‘generated’ values cannot until ‘committed’. This is why you have to have a REC button on REs to record/enter data, and the “freeze” button on QNG does the same thing if I’m not mistaken.
I haven’t explored all the possibilities here, so maybe there’s another way around this…

The difference between the Rec buttons and Quads freeze function is that the freeze can be remote controlled while the rec buttons cannot (never really understood why they committed to such a limitation in their SDK - if there is one control that you want to remote control then it is the Rec Button.).

Regardless, it would be very handy to have a sample and hold device that does the same as Quad does internally. You press a button and it freezes the value so that it can be saved with the document or patch - it seems at least be possible.

[Timmy Crowne]

Here's a way you can do it:

1. Create a virtual MIDI loopback bus in your computer's preferences. On Mac, it's the IAC Driver. On Windows, I know there are apps like loopMIDI or loopBe1.
2. In Reason's MIDI settings, make sure the internal loopback bus is recognized. With Reason's easy MIDI detection, your loopback device should already be visible.
3. Create a MIDI Out device in the rack and select your loopback bus.
4. Route your RNG CV to one of the CV inputs on the rear of the MIDI Out device and choose a CC. (You may need to throw the MIDI device in a Combinator and disable incoming MIDI to make sure you don't get feedback loops.)
5. Right click your desired parameter and enable Remote Override using the MIDI loopback bus and CC you selected.
6. Generate your random CV values and when you find a sound you like, disable the loopback device in your settings. This will ensure your paramaters won't change when you reopen the project.

Because you're driving your parameters via MIDI, Reason sees the modulation the same way as if you had used the mouse to make changes. This means the changes will be saved with the project. However, it also means all the changes will take space in the undo history. Hope this helps!

[turn2on]

Hello to all.

Have good news. Today already create RE, that finished.
RE include:

- Only 1 button (randomizer)
- Text line (custom description)
- 1 CV output (always last generated CV value at the output)

You can regenerate values. When find your needed value, CV output level is saved.
You can save/open reason project, remove device and return it.. Always last generated value is stored at output.

I prepare it for release and soon as it can be approved, it going to the shop.

[electrofux]

Hello to all.

Have good news. Today already create RE, that finished.
RE include:

- Only 1 button (randomizer)
- Text line (custom description)
- 1 CV output (always last generated CV value at the output)

You can regenerate values. When find your needed value, CV output level is saved.
You can save/open reason project, remove device and return it.. Always last generated value is stored at output.

I prepare it for release and soon as it can be approved, it going to the shop.

Nice, just to make sure. That button to generate the random number, is that accessible from the Combinator Panel/remotable?