PX1 Dual FM Synth in the shop: New DX7/DX1 emulation, PX7 alternative

[arnigretar]

I have seen those knobs before. Maybe in a ReBirth Mod? But I have PX7 so I will make a pass - but glad to see it's up there again in some form for others to enjoy

[crimsonwarlock]

So, you won't have any problem dropping a few links here about what you have found?

viewtopic.php?p=635593#p635593

I did look at his page, AND his resume. There is a mention of him working with RS in the past, but no reference to PX7 or even the fact he had anything to do with any rack extension in the past. Funny enough, his resume doesn't even mention DSP programming, it is all about databases and (mostly) email.

I could do a RE like this, as the Dexed source code is Open-Source and would probably be easy (for a seasoned developer) to port to the RE platform. It looks a lot like PX7, but the graphics for the controls are obviously different. I also find the inclusion of an Open-Source reverb algorithm a bit curious. If he is the original dev for PX7 and this has to do with some contractual stuff, being able to release this now would include the approved use of the original graphics. The layout of PX1 is certainly a quality step below PX7.

It is very well possible that he did PX7, but I didn't see or find anything pointing to that. So, still looking forward to that link where it is said that he was involved with PX7

[MrFigg]

Still Dexed here and about a million free .sys files.
Don’t like DX7s anyway.

[Loque]

viewtopic.php?p=635593#p635593

I did look at his page, AND his resume. There is a mention of him working with RS in the past, but no reference to PX7 or even the fact he had anything to do with any rack extension in the past. Funny enough, his resume doesn't even mention DSP programming, it is all about databases and (mostly) email.

I could do a RE like this, as the Dexed source code is Open-Source and would probably be easy (for a seasoned developer) to port to the RE platform. It looks a lot like PX7, but the graphics for the controls are obviously different. I also find the inclusion of an Open-Source reverb algorithm a bit curious. If he is the original dev for PX7 and this has to do with some contractual stuff, being able to release this now would include the approved use of the original graphics. The layout of PX1 is certainly a quality step below PX7.

It is very well possible that he did PX7, but I didn't see or find anything pointing to that. So, still looking forward to that link where it is said that he was involved with PX7

RS kept the dev of PX7 in secrete, so everything around this is speculation. Maybe there are some hints and and signs, like the similarity to PX7, he "worked" at PH and maybe more...

Nothing wrong with including OSS. A lot of devs do this and also there are RE using OSS or Open Source wavetables. There are also quite strange examples of OSS inclusions, where they sell a expensive product, which is completely based on OSS like Red Rocks C1-L1 which is in fact Molot Compressor.

If you could do a OSS to RE port easily, i highly would appreciate you doing this, since there are quite good OSS FX and synths out there, but they are not available as RE. Looking forward to your releases

[crimsonwarlock]

RS kept the dev of PX7 in secrete, so everything around this is speculation.

That is exactly what I was pointing at.

If you could do a OSS to RE port easily, i highly would appreciate you doing this, since there are quite good OSS FX and synths out there, but they are not available as RE. Looking forward to your releases

I'm not doing RE development, or any DSP stuff for that matter, although I've been tempted to do it all the time. I'm working full time in cognitive architecture development (very different from the current AI hype), so I'm knee-deep in code already on a daily basis.

There's even a Full Bucket synth I'm very much involved in the development, but he does the coding as I don't have the time to go there... and because he is extremely talented in DSP coding

[Loque]

RS kept the dev of PX7 in secrete, so everything around this is speculation.

That is exactly what I was pointing at.

If you could do a OSS to RE port easily, i highly would appreciate you doing this, since there are quite good OSS FX and synths out there, but they are not available as RE. Looking forward to your releases

I'm not doing RE development, or any DSP stuff for that matter, although I've been tempted to do it all the time. I'm working full time in cognitive architecture development (very different from the current AI hype), so I'm knee-deep in code already on a daily basis.

There's even a Full Bucket synth I'm very much involved in the development, but he does the coding as I don't have the time to go there... and because he is extremely talented in DSP coding

Oh, so no RE releases from you of OSS soon

pandas-cute.gif (925.87 KiB) Viewed 6317 times

[EdGrip]

It seems likely this is PX7, but there's no confirmation. PX7 was always a bit of a gammy synth to program, (but easier than a DX7!) and I expect most of us who got it mainly used it as a preset player for Kosh's 30k collection: https://koshdukaimusicreason.blogspot.c ... o-30k.html

These days I'd reach for NI's FM8, Primal's FM4 RE, or Ableton's Operator if I just wanted to mess around with some FM synthesis.

[MuttReason]

PXFront.pngPXBack.png

Well that’s more than a passing resemblance!! Either a serious act of homage to the original or an actual update to the original. Either way, this could be my next purchase although I wish the original UI had also been used instead of the black and gold (not a fan).

[mcatalao]

TBH, it's great to see this on the store.
I often directed people to PX7 when they talked about FM, despite using Algorithm moroe for new stuff, and now i can "send them" to PX1.

This poses some questions though...

1 - I like the looks of this. Can we have a crossgrade to PX1? I understand it is a dual PX7 but again, looks matter.

2 - Can this read PX7 patches, will the PX7 refills be relevant to PX1 (specially nucleus soundlab and Navi Retlav's stuff, sound really nice and would be great to still be usable for people who get px1 now)??

3 - If 2 is true, if we have PX1 and PX7 installed, and open a PX7 patch, what will open this, PX1 or PX7?

4 - Are there any interactions between the 2 processors, that a dual combi with 2 PX7 couldn't do?

Cheers,
MC

[crimsonwarlock]

4 - Are there any interactions between the 2 processors, that a dual combi with 2 PX7 couldn't do?

The real DX1 can split the two engines across the keyboard. As far as I can see, this PX1 does not have that function, so you'll need a combinator anyway to do that. I don't see anything that you couldn't do with two PX7s, at least so far.

As I used to plug a stereo chorus after my DX7, I tend to do that with PX7 as well, and the only way to save those combined patches is, again, a combinator. So far I don't see any reason for me to get this in addition to PX7. I don't like the colors either, but that could be because the PX7 layout reminds me more of a real DX7.

But it is obviously great to have a DX7 emulator available again as a RE. If I didn't have PX7, I would have bought this the minute it came available in the shop

[NoisiaTHX]

No PX7 patches can be opened with the PX1.

[jam-s]

No PX7 patches can be opened with the PX1.

As they are very similar, I suppose it would be possible to write a converter script for the repatch files between those two REs.

[joeyluck]

The copy/paste feature (to build dual-engine patches) takes some getting used to. As much as I enjoy having everything streamlined into one interface and enjoy the dual-engine presets, building them isn't as intuitive and informative as just using two devices. Which of course, you can still do with this just using a device per single engine.

It would be cool if it were possible to simply load sysex files into each engine, rather than needing to load presets, copy one, navigate to another and then paste it... Maybe a RE SDK update could allow for that?

It would also be nice if it displayed patch names per engine and showed you the name of the patch copied in the clipboard. I think that's why I would gravitate towards the workflow of using two instances of PX1—so I can see what DX7 patches I have loaded per engine.

[mcatalao]

The real DX1 can split the two engines across the keyboard. As far as I can see, this PX1 does not have that function, so you'll need a combinator anyway to do that. I don't see anything that you couldn't do with two PX7s, at least so far.

So in reality, a couple of more PX7's in a combi do more than 1 px1. Oh well... :/

[mcatalao]

No PX7 patches can be opened with the PX1.

As they are very similar, I suppose it would be possible to write a converter script for the repatch files between those two REs.

I gave some thought to this.
Re patches are actually xml like files, so you probably have the exact same implementation but the device description is different and the 2 engine sound parameters are probably "encapsulated" in some form. There might be an easy way to do this. I might just try this in the weekend just for kicks...

[reasonosaer]

From what I can see it looks to be the same developer that made the PX7.

Just because it closely resembles PX7 doesn't mean it is the same developer.

I wonder what changed that allowed them to sell a new RE considering the PX7 was apparently taken down due to a licensing issue?

PX7 was made by a third party and licensed to Reason Studios. This is an RE that is being sold in the shop by an external dev. There is nothing (so far) indicating they have anything to do with each other.

Remember that RS never made the developer of PX7 known.

hopefully it's the same person since they more or less lifted the PX7 interface intact. i actually like the PX7 interface and use it to load old DX7 patches on occaison but i thought it was overpriced at $99 and this seems overpriced at $89, especially given that dexed is out there for free and can also load DX7 patches, still i'm glad it's back in the shop so we at least have an RE available that can.

[fieldframe]

Interesting to finally see the mystery developer behind PX7, along with a de-Propellerheaded version of the synth.

Given that the panel layouts appear to have the exact same coordinates for the same widgets *and* the author's site lists previous, unnamed work at what was formerly Propellerhead, I'd say there's about a 0% chance this isn't the original developer of PX7.

My guess as to why the UI is different for PX1: Reason Studios designed PX7's UI in-house, while contracting development out to pskonsult. The contract must have stipulated that pskonsult retained ownership of the codebase, but not the UI assets, so when they decided to repurpose the codebase into a new product, they had to replace the UI assets while leaving the overall UI the same.

[SebAudio]

Propellerhead & RS are very good when it comes to UI and it shows once again.
I think most of you know https://www.plogue.com/products/chipsynth-ops7.html as a possible alternative

[arnigretar]

My guess as to why the UI is different for PX1: Reason Studios designed PX7's UI in-house, while contracting development out to pskonsult. The contract must have stipulated that pskonsult retained ownership of the codebase, but not the UI assets, so when they decided to repurpose the codebase into a new product, they had to replace the UI assets while leaving the overall UI the same.

Yeh, would assume that is correct.

[madmacman]

this seems overpriced at $89, especially given that dexed is out there for free and can also load DX7 patches

The price tag discussion is usually futile, because there are far more examples of RE‘s with an excellent freeware VST replacement. E.g. Pultec or Mäag Eq‘s. But as you said: there are a lot of people out there who prefer a RE-only environment and so it‘s good to have another option back.

[SebAudio]

The PX1 is 2 PX7s in one instrument. The presets are exactly the same. Combinator patches for PX7 are « simple » preset patches for PX1. The only exception I’ve noticed is the « exclusive » content for PX7 is not in its entirety available.
So a great RE for those who don’t already have a PX7. As a PX7 owner, I don’t see what can be done with the 1 that can’t be done with the 7 and combinator.
One of the flaws of PX7 is that the envelopes aren’t remote controllable. I didn’t check if it’s possible with PX1. That would be a big plus.

[miscend]

hopefully it's the same person since they more or less lifted the PX7 interface intact. i actually like the PX7 interface and use it to load old DX7 patches on occaison but i thought it was overpriced at $99 and this seems overpriced at $89, especially given that dexed is out there for free and can also load DX7 patches, still i'm glad it's back in the shop so we at least have an RE available that can.

Hey but it seems you're getting two PX7s in one instrument for less than half the price with this one.

[mcatalao]

Hey but it seems you're getting two PX7s in one instrument for less than half the price with this one.

It's not hardware right? If you want/need a dual sound patch, just duplicate the PX7.

On a side note, as i was saying back there, you don't have anything happening between the 2 engines, and you can't even define what engine plays in what notes, then getting a PX1 if you already have PX7, is just tossing money out as you even lose functionality (well, you don't as you can use PX1 in mono mode and toss 2 in a combi as PX7).

My point is, this is software. You can add 4000 px7's or 2000 PX1's, and it will be all the same.

Again, it's great to see people can get a DX emulation again. IMHO it is the rawest form of an FM synth, it performs great.
And you got2love it's simplicity, it sticks to what it is supposed to do, and everything else you do outside of it, with effects, modulations and so forth!

[EnochLight]

I've already got PX-7, so PX-1 is of no interest to me. Had he added a few more integrated effects aside from just a reverb, it would have greatly improved the out-of-the-box sound though. Those audio demos on the shop page are embarrassingly pathetic, BTW. It's 2023 for chrissake - going to need more than that to impress.

[joeyluck]

Well I wouldn't rule out any features already. Maybe the dev would be open to hearing suggestions?