Beyond Europa?

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dvdrtldg
Posts: 2090
Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 01 Mar 2023

crimsonwarlock wrote:
28 Feb 2023
FullBucket has a (free) modular synth like that (and polyphonic to boot): https://www.fullbucket.de/music/modulair.html


Image
Great synth, very underrated imo

reasonosaer
Posts: 16
Joined: 20 Dec 2022

Post 01 Mar 2023

phase plant and uvi falcon are two standouts in the current generation of what I used to think of as "just use omnisphere" synths designed to be the be all end all in terms of sound quality and features. i've always enjoyed more synths that encourage you to do something different or go in a particular creative direction sound wise via interesting architectures or interfaces.

hardware examples i can think of off the top of my head are the casio cz synths, octave plateau cat series, and more recently nonlinear labs c15. reason has a bunch of good softsynths i'd put in this category like nostromo, jps harmonic, grain, saw-1, driver, revival, oberon, etc.

the only synth i currently use that's further in the "just use omnisphere" direction than europa and expanse is dune 3 by synapse. i'd also point out that between the synapse and blamsoft REs and subtractor we have a unique embarassment of va riches in reason. i'm struggling to think of any softsynths as old as subtractor that hold up as well today. there was other really good dsp around back then but not a lot, and i doubt any of it still constitutes the core ip of a going concern today the way p jubel's og code does for RS.

Jac459
Posts: 672
Joined: 29 Mar 2022
Location: Singapore

Post 02 Mar 2023

jam-s wrote:
28 Feb 2023
I'd love for RS to include some well made physical modelling brass and woodwind synths.
Well said!
Bitwig and RRP fanboy...

iTrensharo
Posts: 41
Joined: 17 Jun 2021

Post 02 Mar 2023

Jac459 wrote:
02 Mar 2023
jam-s wrote:
28 Feb 2023
I'd love for RS to include some well made physical modelling brass and woodwind synths.
Well said!
Brass and Woodwinds are both basically wind instruments. You can't easily physically model them. That's why Strings, Pluck and Percussion are usually what are physically modeled...

Violin/Cello/Viola/Bass, Pianos, Drums, Harp, etc.

It's a bit harder to "physically model" air blowing through an instrument, and it's certainly going to be a lot hard to make it sound anything near realistic. Samples are very likely to be the gold standard for those types of instruments ... for the foreseeable future.

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dvdrtldg
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Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 02 Mar 2023

iTrensharo wrote:
02 Mar 2023
Brass and Woodwinds are both basically wind instruments. You can't easily physically model them. That's why Strings, Pluck and Percussion are usually what are physically modeled...

Violin/Cello/Viola/Bass, Pianos, Drums, Harp, etc.

It's a bit harder to "physically model" air blowing through an instrument, and it's certainly going to be a lot hard to make it sound anything near realistic. Samples are very likely to be the gold standard for those types of instruments ... for the foreseeable future.
SWAM wants a word with you


iTrensharo
Posts: 41
Joined: 17 Jun 2021

Post 02 Mar 2023

dvdrtldg wrote:
02 Mar 2023
iTrensharo wrote:
02 Mar 2023
Brass and Woodwinds are both basically wind instruments. You can't easily physically model them. That's why Strings, Pluck and Percussion are usually what are physically modeled...

Violin/Cello/Viola/Bass, Pianos, Drums, Harp, etc.

It's a bit harder to "physically model" air blowing through an instrument, and it's certainly going to be a lot hard to make it sound anything near realistic. Samples are very likely to be the gold standard for those types of instruments ... for the foreseeable future.
SWAM wants a word with you

It sounds... like a synth. with robotic vibrato and pretty obviously generated note attacks, etc. This is what I'm talking about.

It's much easier to synthesize those other types of sounds. There is a reason why this area is not nearly as explored, while the other instrument types were modeled fairly decently a decade ago.

I'm not saying it won't get there, but it certainly isn't there yet. It has some of the same issues that plague mediocre sample libraries (e.g. NI's Cremona Quartet) and cause composers to avoid them.

I wouldn't buy this. I would use a sample library.
Last edited by iTrensharo on 02 Mar 2023, edited 1 time in total.

iTrensharo
Posts: 41
Joined: 17 Jun 2021

Post 02 Mar 2023

Popey wrote:
28 Feb 2023
Beyond europa for me would be a synth with more lfo's and envelopes/mseg. Europa is a great synth but wish rs added more as sometimes I run out.

It could be a europa 2 with these added and I would be very happy.
I think RS could benefit a lot from focusing on the core Sequencer and actually updating what is there.

A lot of what they have feels almost like abandonware. Once it's released, they barely ever touch it.

dusan.cani
Posts: 383
Joined: 16 Oct 2018
Location: Slovakia

Post 02 Mar 2023

Jac459 wrote:
28 Feb 2023

Funny, I am a big fan of blamsoft, I love zero and expanse so bought vk2 but never used it much.
Maybe you should revisit this synth because it sounds really awesome :mrgreen:

Pity that it isn't possible to sell RE licenses between users. I would buy this synth from you, immediately :mrgreen:

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moalla
Posts: 397
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Location: DDR WEST

Post 02 Mar 2023

dusan.cani wrote:
02 Mar 2023
Jac459 wrote:
28 Feb 2023

Funny, I am a big fan of blamsoft, I love zero and expanse so bought vk2 but never used it much.
Maybe you should revisit this synth because it sounds really awesome :mrgreen:

Pity that it isn't possible to sell RE licenses between users. I would buy this synth from you, immediately :mrgreen:
So let us make a VK2 challenge next time, this synth needs more attention, and maybe a new video tutorial about. But I´m not so common with obs studio etc.. I think i can take the time to realize that in two weeks, especial when my desktop machine is reactivated, but I´m still in reconstructing my whole studiospace now, so it would be really nice to start this hopefully before reasonstudios relleasing the new synth ;)
https://soundcloud.com/user-594407128
Reason12.5, Ibanez SR305, Yamaha PF10, RhythmWolf, Miniak, Ipad+SparkLE
U47fet MOTO:better repair-mod well made stuff than buy the next crap

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Loque
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Post 02 Mar 2023

RS needs something with AI. At least for marketing buzz.
Reason12, Win10

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DaveyG
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Post 02 Mar 2023

Loque wrote:
02 Mar 2023
RS needs something with AI. At least for marketing buzz.
RAIson Studios

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Loque
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Post 03 Mar 2023

DaveyG wrote:
02 Mar 2023
Loque wrote:
02 Mar 2023
RS needs something with AI. At least for marketing buzz.
RAIson Studios
rAck Intension

Ok... Too many bad jokes...
Reason12, Win10

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Quarmat
Posts: 275
Joined: 11 Feb 2021
Location: Europe

Post 03 Mar 2023

Loque wrote:
02 Mar 2023
RS needs something with AI. At least for marketing buzz.
I agree, some kind of AI mixing/mastering helper that analyzes your reference tracks and suggest you adjustments or a "murf.ai"-like singer where you can set the lyrics, chose the voice, write the melody in the sequencer and then modulate the voice timbre, intensity, articulations with MW, PB and other expression interfaces.

That would be awesome

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_andreypetr_
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Post 03 Mar 2023


Jac459
Posts: 672
Joined: 29 Mar 2022
Location: Singapore

Post 03 Mar 2023

dusan.cani wrote:
02 Mar 2023
Maybe you should revisit this synth because it sounds really awesome :mrgreen:

Pity that it isn't possible to sell RE licenses between users. I would buy this synth from you, immediately :mrgreen:
OK I will try it ... again this weekend.

Now I am all about twin 3, my new favorite toy.
Bitwig and RRP fanboy...

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Loque
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Joined: 28 Dec 2015

Post 03 Mar 2023

_andreypetr_ wrote:
03 Mar 2023
In may? Meehhh...that is ages away :-(
Reason12, Win10

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SebAudio
Posts: 279
Joined: 08 Mar 2015

Post 04 Mar 2023

Chi-Individual wrote:
28 Feb 2023
The one thing missing from Reason that I’ve asked for is a truly modular synth. Like a modular cmb, or a modular page similar to Bitwig’s grid, where you can add as many oscillators , filters, lfo’s etc as your heart, mind and cpu can handle. Complex-1 is nice but sometimes you want just a few more LPG’s or a different oscillator. Imagine RS using vertical half racks but all modular on the front.

Other than that, like mentioned before, physical modeling is always welcomed. I’d also like to see the RS version of V Collection slowly become a thing(I know I’m asking a lot but I can dream :-)) just to start replacing the Layers REs. A RS Matrix-12 or Jupiter-8 would be some welcome additions/REs for me.
The « modular comb » is great idea that’s been mentioned here a few times.
I quite like Complex-1 as it is even if not expandable. What I’d prefer is greater sounding modules. Oscillators, wavefolders and « East coast » filter in Complex-1 are not very good, hence you wish you had several choices. You talked about jp8 : this synth is very simple, but what a great sound ! For me, in the end, it’s not having all the possibilities, but having thoughtful great sounding ones.

Jac459
Posts: 672
Joined: 29 Mar 2022
Location: Singapore

Post 04 Mar 2023

iTrensharo wrote:
02 Mar 2023
It sounds... like a synth. with robotic vibrato and pretty obviously generated note attacks, etc. This is what I'm talking about.

It's much easier to synthesize those other types of sounds. There is a reason why this area is not nearly as explored, while the other instrument types were modeled fairly decently a decade ago.

I'm not saying it won't get there, but it certainly isn't there yet. It has some of the same issues that plague mediocre sample libraries (e.g. NI's Cremona Quartet) and cause composers to avoid them.

I wouldn't buy this. I would use a sample library.
Your tough... Sounds pretty convincing to me. And I think it demonstrate we are quite near there... So hoping that RS nailed it and managed to cover the last centimeters of reality isn't unrealistic to me...

Before Friktion, nothing was as convincing by far....
Bitwig and RRP fanboy...

iTrensharo
Posts: 41
Joined: 17 Jun 2021

Post 05 Mar 2023

Jac459 wrote:
04 Mar 2023
iTrensharo wrote:
02 Mar 2023
It sounds... like a synth. with robotic vibrato and pretty obviously generated note attacks, etc. This is what I'm talking about.

It's much easier to synthesize those other types of sounds. There is a reason why this area is not nearly as explored, while the other instrument types were modeled fairly decently a decade ago.

I'm not saying it won't get there, but it certainly isn't there yet. It has some of the same issues that plague mediocre sample libraries (e.g. NI's Cremona Quartet) and cause composers to avoid them.

I wouldn't buy this. I would use a sample library.
Your tough... Sounds pretty convincing to me. And I think it demonstrate we are quite near there... So hoping that RS nailed it and managed to cover the last centimeters of reality isn't unrealistic to me...

Before Friktion, nothing was as convincing by far....
Unless it's free, tough is the only way to be.

Market is beyond saturated.

Friction was never that attractive cause I have string libraries that sound better and other synths that do physical modeling (some DAWs ship with this - Logic, Live Suite).

I would be buying it for... presets? I don't doubt its potential value, esp to those who produce in the reason sequencer.

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