"Scale Mutator" player needed

[dvdrtldg]

I've got a nice setup with Evolution going into Inspiral going into Radical Keys, and all sort of cool combinations of single notes/chords/repeats/ratchets/arps etc as the result. But I want to experiment with other scales - i.e. just taking whatever's going on and shifting it through different keys, different modes etc WITHOUT necessarily doing anything else to the MIDI data

Scales & Chords is no good because it makes you choose single notes or chords. Inspiral could work with all settings at 0, but then its choice of scales is fairly limited. Chordline has hundreds of cool scales, but it also has that weird setup where the black notes change the chord set

So what I want is something with the scale variety of Chordline - blues modes, jazz modes, Gregorian modes, eight tone Spanish, pyramid hexatonic, whatever the fuck - but the ability to just feed MIDI into it, and all it does it spit out the same MIDI but transposed to another scale/mode. Is there anything available that will do this?

[Bes]

the other Tonic Mint RE "ScaleMatrix" might work for you

[EpiGenetik]

Interesting. How about something that can randomize the scales?

[Bes]

since you can draw in your own custom scales in Inspiral perhaps its just a database of scales you need. maybe this? https://www.scales-chords.com/

[dvdrtldg]

I thought of drawing scales into Inspiral, but in terms of workflow, it would be much easier to have a massive bank of ready-to-go scales that I could feed my MIDI into on the fly

Drawing the scales means I'd need to make some sort of decision beforehand about which four scales I wanted to try. I'd like to approach it more experimentally, like go browsing through various scales and just discover things that sound good

ScaleMatrix looks interesting - just downloaded the trial version and it seems like it'll do the trick, more or less. Excellent player, can see myself probably using it more than ChordLine

[Enlightenspeed]

Assuming that Inspiral was the ideal place to change things, what would the feature request be? Is it just a bigger bank of scales presets?

Or is there another way of working you would like to add, which is more fitting for the purpose?

[dvdrtldg]

Assuming that Inspiral was the ideal place to change things, what would the feature request be? Is it just a bigger bank of scales presets?

Or is there another way of working you would like to add, which is more fitting for the purpose?

Yep - bigger bank of scale presets, which imo would make Inspiral the One Player To Rule Them All

TonicMint's ChordLine has just short of 300 scales, and ScaleMatrix has over 1000, which is nuts. I really like being able to go exploring with them, especially in blues & jazz modes. Beefing up the Inspiral scale library would be fantastic!

[challism]

This sounds like a good job for Delta.
You can get different results, depending upon where you put Delta (above or below Inspiral).
There are 14 different scales being fed by a random/chance switch.
R12 Combi of player stack

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[dvdrtldg]

There are 14 different scales being fed by a random/chance switch.

Dude I want HUNDREDS of scales

Also, I don't own Delta - although I've been meaning to try it, and will do to check out those combis (thanks!)

But basically, I just want something very simple: a player with a comprehensive library of scale presets that I can flick through quickly & easily while the sequencer above it (Sequences, Kompulsion, whatever) feeds notes into it. Inspiral has the architecture for this, but not enough scales

[challism]

There are 14 different scales being fed by a random/chance switch.

Dude I want HUNDREDS of scales

Also, I don't own Delta - although I've been meaning to try it, and will do to check out those combis (thanks!)

But basically, I just want something very simple: a player with a comprehensive library of scale presets that I can flick through quickly & easily while the sequencer above it (Sequences, Kompulsion, whatever) feeds notes into it. Inspiral has the architecture for this, but not enough scales

It seems like randomly switching between 14 of the most standard/commonly used scales would yield practically the same results as hundreds of scales doing the same thing. I mean, how much overlapping/crossover is there between just 12 notes and hundreds of scales?

My my next thought would be put hundreds of presets into a folder and then automate the up/down load patch button (maybe map it to a CV in via the combi). This would require one of the developers add the up/down buttons as automation/mapping targets. This might work, if the patch loading is fast enough. If the patch loading isn't fast enough, you could use different instances of the player, with an automated switch... while a player is selected, the patch is already loaded; when the player isn't selected, the next patch is loading. Certainly a more complicated method than what you are probably wanting, but it would work. I think it would also be fun to build. Maybe EnglightenSpeed or TonicMint would humor the idea of automating the up/down arrows.

Do you have TonicMint In-Range? It seems to me that In-Range would be a perfect player for this job because it's simple enough (just loads scales) and has the feature of taking notes outside of the scale/range and relocating them inside the scale/range. It also loads patches really quickly. Looks like they are possible targets... just need the Dev to oblige and turn them on under the hood.

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[muckmclane]

Scales & Chords is no good because it makes you choose single notes or chords.

I just realized I can select from 4095 custom scales with scales and chords in the combinator. The same can be said with evolution & kompulsion.

[Enlightenspeed]

Maybe EnglightenSpeed or TonicMint would humor the idea of automating the up/down arrows.

Can't be done, I'm afraid. The SDK doesn't give you access to the patch control properties in the motherboard.

[challism]

Maybe EnglightenSpeed or TonicMint would humor the idea of automating the up/down arrows.

Can't be done, I'm afraid. The SDK doesn't give you access to the patch control properties in the motherboard.

Curious that when you right click on the up/down buttons, you get that grayed out automation menu. I always assumed that meant it could be automated, if enabled by the Dev. I guess not.

[Enlightenspeed]

Can't be done, I'm afraid. The SDK doesn't give you access to the patch control properties in the motherboard.

Curious that when you right click on the up/down buttons, you get that grayed out automation menu. I always assumed that meant it could be automated, if enabled by the Dev. I guess not.

In most cases it is, but not for the patch buttons.

Cheers,
Brian

[Enlightenspeed]

I just realized I can select from 4095 custom scales with scales and chords in the combinator. The same can be said with evolution & kompulsion.

This is only partially correct. What you can select is truncated by the rotary resolution, so you only really have 127 possible choices, out of 4095, and as these increment, even in a perfect world, they step by way of binary increments rather than anything musically related. Of course, you can program for specifics if you know what they are (or you have the time to calculate the binary value), but how many people, off the top of their heads can tell you that 2773 is C Major? The original request is for something more hands on and "realtime", and thus, for experimentation it's not really a great solution - unless of course you are happy for it to be a bit brutal

Cheers,
Brian

[muckmclane]

I just realized I can select from 4095 custom scales with scales and chords in the combinator. The same can be said with evolution & kompulsion.

This is only partially correct. What you can select is truncated by the rotary resolution, so you only really have 127 possible choices, out of 4095, and as these increment, even in a perfect world, they step by way of binary increments rather than anything musically related.

Cheers,
Brian

What I have been doing is using multiple instances of chords and scales and in the combinator, assigning 1 knob and 1 button to each instance. The knob for scales and chords "1" is in relation to the custom scale and the range is set to 0-127(approximate as yes many values are not possible). The button turns scales and chords "1" on or off. So knob 2 is for scales and chords "2" with the range being set to 128 to 255(approximate) and so on and so forth.

[dvdrtldg]

What I have been doing is using multiple instances of chords and scales and in the combinator, assigning 1 knob and 1 button to each instance. The knob for scales and chords "1" is in relation to the custom scale and the range is set to 0-127(approximate as yes many values are not possible). The button turns scales and chords "1" on or off. So knob 2 is for scales and chords "2" with the range being set to 128 to 255(approximate) and so on and so forth.

It's a cool idea, but even if I could be bothered setting it up, there's the problem of (as mentioned) keeping track of which particular scale is located at which point on which rotary

There's also the issue of Scales & Chords forcing you to choose between EITHER single notes OR chords. If my sequencer is outputting a nice pattern of single notes AND chords, I want that pattern to go into the "scale mutator" and come out the other side (almost) exactly as is, with the only change to the notes being the ones necessary to fit the chosen scale

To be honest I find Scales & Chords a bit of a flop. It's so stiff and clunky, the amount of automation needed to make it flexible enough to be useful is crazy. I always feel like I'm fighting the thing rather than working with it

[Bes]

wait a minute @dvdrtldg. the scales and chords player remains polyphonic when not in chords mode, if your playing a chord into it it will adjust those notes into the scale and output the corrected chord

[dvdrtldg]

wait a minute @dvdrtldg. the scales and chords player remains polyphonic when not in chords mode, if your playing a chord into it it will adjust those notes into the scale and output the corrected chord

Oh yeah you're right Duhhh @ me, it's a while since I used it. My main point stands, though - not enough scales!

[Enlightenspeed]

This is only partially correct. What you can select is truncated by the rotary resolution, so you only really have 127 possible choices, out of 4095, and as these increment, even in a perfect world, they step by way of binary increments rather than anything musically related.

Cheers,
Brian

What I have been doing is using multiple instances of chords and scales and in the combinator, assigning 1 knob and 1 button to each instance. The knob for scales and chords "1" is in relation to the custom scale and the range is set to 0-127(approximate as yes many values are not possible). The button turns scales and chords "1" on or off. So knob 2 is for scales and chords "2" with the range being set to 128 to 255(approximate) and so on and so forth.

I think this is about as good as it's going to getfor that kind of wrokflow, really. It would be better if either there was a CV in port on S&C, or if the new Combi2 could use a rotary etc as a modulator rather than an explicit specifier - and offer better resolution, of course. I tried a couple of other things but struggled to get much further with it.

Anyway, scale randomization is fully available in Agnostik, if you will pardon the shameless plug, and it will be getting more feature heavy in this regard soon enough

Cheers,
Brian