Triggering Euclidian with other players

[chimp_spanner]

Hey! I posted this over on FB but figured I'd try here as well. I'm trying to program a basic single note progression in something like Kompulsion or PolyStep set to low playback speeds, and then run that into Euclidian to give it more of an interesting rhythm (like a bassline or whatever).

However, Euclidian isn't catching the start of the notes properly, or at least consistently. Any idea why that might be?

**Edit: okay someone replied and said it's a known thing with Euclidian and Sequences but can be fixed by sliding/delaying or something?

[challism]

That reply was from me. ha ha ha Your name is Paul, yeah?

Yup, just turn the slide knob to the right about 10 clicks. This issue only seems to happen when you start the song or when the song loops back to the beginning. The slide knob should take care of it, though.

[chimp_spanner]

That reply was from me. ha ha ha Your name is Paul, yeah?

Yup, just turn the slide knob to the right about 10 clicks. This issue only seems to happen when you start the song or when the song loops back to the beginning. The slide knob should take care of it, though.

Hey! Ah nice, yeah that's me - I have a real name and everything haha. I'll report it to the developer anyway and hopefully they'll work a fix into the next update

[challism]

That reply was from me. ha ha ha Your name is Paul, yeah?

Yup, just turn the slide knob to the right about 10 clicks. This issue only seems to happen when you start the song or when the song loops back to the beginning. The slide knob should take care of it, though.

Hey! Ah nice, yeah that's me - I have a real name and everything haha. I'll report it to the developer anyway and hopefully they'll work a fix into the next update

Wait a minute! Are you telling me your parents didn't name you Chimp? Mind.Blown!

[chimp_spanner]

Hey! Ah nice, yeah that's me - I have a real name and everything haha. I'll report it to the developer anyway and hopefully they'll work a fix into the next update

Wait a minute! Are you telling me your parents didn't name you Chimp? Mind.Blown!

Haha, of all the names I could've picked to follow me around forever. This is the one.

Anyway I heard back from Robotic Bean support. They're saying Euclidean is sample accurate, but PolyStep isn't. And possibly not Kompulsion etc. Would be interesting to get some perspective from those guys too!

[challism]

Wait a minute! Are you telling me your parents didn't name you Chimp? Mind.Blown!

Haha, of all the names I could've picked to follow me around forever. This is the one.

Anyway I heard back from Robotic Bean support. They're saying Euclidean is sample accurate, but PolyStep isn't. And possibly not Kompulsion etc. Would be interesting to get some perspective from those guys too!

I've only encountered this issue when playing with Sequences and Euclidean. That isn't to say it's a problem with Robotic Bean; this could very well be an issue with Reason, itself. WTferk do I know? I'm just happy that there is a simple and easy fix via the slide knob.

[buddard]

Hi!

We tested this by creating a sequence in PolyStep and then sending it to track (without passing it through any other players). What we found was the following:

PolyStep_NoteOn.png (35.4 KiB) Viewed 452 times

As the highlighted part of the screenshot indicates, the note on message is 2 ticks late. Similar delays are found for almost every note in the clip.

The next screenshot is from the same test performed in Sequences:

Sequences_NoteOn.png (38.61 KiB) Viewed 452 times

As you can see, the note starts on the intended position, without any offset.

It's possible that PolyStep and some of the other players don't calculate the sample offset for the note on message, which leaves a 1/64 probability of the note start being sample accurate.

The best workaround for now is to add a similar delay to Euclidean and Sequences using the Slide knob. About +3 ticks should do it, but it depends on the tempo and samplerate. (Higher tempo and/or lower samplerate means that a higher offset might be needed.)

[chimp_spanner]

Awesome thanks for this! I'll experiment with what values work once I've got a break in work. But that seems like an easy enough fix to me

In the long term do you think this is something that warrants a ticket to RS?

[challism]

So these other players are sending the note info with a bit of delay, thus causing lower/slave players to miss the note. Or something like that?

Anyway, it's good to know we have a simple workaround (at least for the RB players). If the issue is encountered with other players (that don't have a slide knob), I guess the next solution is to bounce the MIDI notes to track and adjust accordingly.

[buddard]

Ultimately we want our devices to work well with other devices, because it's sort of the point of the Reason rack.

So I think that for the long term we will probably consider adding some kind of tolerance to our inputs, so even if a trigger misses the beat by one or a couple of batches, we could play the step a little late and compensate by shortening the note with the same number of samples.
This would probably improve interoperability with CV devices, as well.

But it will require careful testing to make sure we don't break something or introduce behaviour that's not backwards compatible, so it's not something we'll just throw together in an afternoon.