Softube Saturation Knob: Type switch not working

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rgdaniel
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15 Aug 2020

Anybody still using Softube Saturation Knob? I hadn't used it in an age, then reached for it today because I remembered it fondly and was reminded of it, randomly.

For some reason, the 3-position "Type" switch cannot be switched by clicking on it. Everything else works, ie, the knob itself, the only other thing :lol:

I can select different patches, e.g. "Vocal Enhancer" has "Keep High" selected, and "Drum Kit Tamer" has "Keep Low" selected. I can even automate the "Type" switch. So easy workaround. Just wondering if anybody else is seeing this behaviour. I even deleted and re-downloaded it. No joy.

EDIT: Never mind, figured it out, you have to click and DRAG the switch, like halfway down the screen before it takes effect. Very weird behaviour. But "it is what it is" as worse people have said about worse things... :lol:
Last edited by rgdaniel on 15 Aug 2020, edited 1 time in total.

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Loque
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15 Aug 2020

Didnt used in a while and just throw it in. Its working, when i click the labels. But its not working, when i click the button. Cannot remember 100% if it was like this all the time :?
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rgdaniel
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15 Aug 2020

Loque wrote:
15 Aug 2020
Didnt used in a while and just throw it in. Its working, when i click the labels. But its not working, when i click the button. Cannot remember 100% if it was like this all the time :?
Thanks Loque, see my edit above... works if you really drag it way up or way down...

EdGrip
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15 Aug 2020

The lack of an output gain is still the main flaw with Saturation Knob.

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Creativemind
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15 Aug 2020

EdGrip wrote:
15 Aug 2020
The lack of an output gain is still the main flaw with Saturation Knob.
That's true and Softube said they wouldn't add one I think I saw someone say on here once.

Also to OP, I've never had a problem with the switch.
:reason:

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rgdaniel
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15 Aug 2020

Creativemind wrote:
15 Aug 2020
Also to OP, I've never had a problem with the switch.
It's not a problem, now that I know to drag it halfway up (or down) the screen to make it move. Never seen a switch behave like that, but whatever. It's free, right? :lol:

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Creativemind
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15 Aug 2020

rgdaniel wrote:
15 Aug 2020
Creativemind wrote:
15 Aug 2020
Also to OP, I've never had a problem with the switch.
It's not a problem, now that I know to drag it halfway up (or down) the screen to make it move. Never seen a switch behave like that, but whatever. It's free, right? :lol:
Yep lol!
:reason:

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Aosta
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15 Aug 2020

On a side note I still use it in my master set up very subtly to give an extra little fullness to the mix.
Tend the flame

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buddard
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16 Aug 2020

rgdaniel wrote:
15 Aug 2020
Creativemind wrote:
15 Aug 2020
Also to OP, I've never had a problem with the switch.
It's not a problem, now that I know to drag it halfway up (or down) the screen to make it move. Never seen a switch behave like that, but whatever. It's free, right? :lol:
I think in their GUI def they declared it as a knob widget instead of a fader widget, so it behaves like a knob instead of a switch. That's why you have to drag it. And they added hidden radio buttons where the labels are to make them clickable. Definitely a unique way of implementing it!

EdGrip
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16 Aug 2020

I've always wondered about the output gain knob. It would be so *simple* to add, that its omission must be deliberate. Did they consider that would make it too useful to be a free device? Like, it's always felt like they left it off as a punishment, or price, for the plugin being free. But it just serves to irritate me every time I add the plugin, and that in turn means the only Softube plugin I've personally encountered is tagged with a big negative emotion in my mind. Which is not good marketing.

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dioxide
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16 Aug 2020

I beta tested this way back and mentioned this to them, but they didn't understand that it was a problem that it behaved in a way different to everything else in Reason. That's fairly common with VST devs coming to RE format. They sometimes just don't understand the environment well enough to create something that feels like it integrates fully with the Reason rack.

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miscend
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16 Aug 2020

rgdaniel wrote:
15 Aug 2020

EDIT: Never mind, figured it out, you have to click and DRAG the switch, like halfway down the screen before it takes effect. Very weird behaviour. But "it is what it is" as worse people have said about worse things... :lol:
This issue also came up at the old PUF forums. I remember it really annoyed some people. Thankfully these days you can alternatively use the VST version. For some reason it's never really bothered me and I had even forgotten about it until you mentioned it. Even the large knob on the right, has a bit of lag when you drag it, but it's less obvious than the switch.

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miscend
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16 Aug 2020

EdGrip wrote:
15 Aug 2020
The lack of an output gain is still the main flaw with Saturation Knob.
This. Or even better auto gain compensation like a lot of newer saturation plug-ins are doing.

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selig
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16 Aug 2020

miscend wrote:
16 Aug 2020
EdGrip wrote:
15 Aug 2020
The lack of an output gain is still the main flaw with Saturation Knob.
This. Or even better auto gain compensation like a lot of newer saturation plug-ins are doing.
That can give you a false sense of security - how should the auto gain compensation work? Should it match the peak level? Should it match RMS/Average level? Should it match perceived loudness? Should it pay attention to equal loudness curves in determining perceived loudness?

The there's the question of "how well does it actually work", because without knowing how "hot" the input is, there's no way to know how much to compensate. For example if the input is way hot to start, there is much saturation already happening even before you increase any "drive" control. Contrast that with a super low signal that won't even start saturating until drive is substantially increased. With the same "drive" setting, the results can vary widely based on the input level, which in most cases is never considered when designed output compensation.

I speak from experience here, because I tried to do as much auto compensation with ColoringEQ as possible. But it's still a bit of a crap shoot since you don't know much about the input signal when determining how much output level is needed to compensate. And in my somewhat limited testing, there is no "auto gain" circuit that is 100% fool proof, but would love to find one if anyone is aware of one!
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guitfnky
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16 Aug 2020

yeah, auto gain compensation is really handy as a starting point, but I think you also need the ability to make manual adjustments, since as Selig mentions, it isn’t really ever foolproof.

I think this particular RE/plugin could GREATLY benefit from at least a manual output control so A/Bing the processed and unprocessed signals was easier to do. honestly, the fact that there’s no straightforward way to do that A/B comparison (without using other devices) is why I almost never reach for the Sat Knob. sad too, since it is a good sounding device.
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challism
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16 Aug 2020

I love the sound of the Sat knob. I also love the price. The switch has never bothered me. I had forgotten all about it until this post. The volume/gain issue, on the other hand, is a problem.

A simple way to deal with the Sat knob gain problem is by programming a Combi with Sat knob going into a line mixer. Turn the rotary knob up and the saturation turns up while the line mixer volume goes down.

Just drop this Combi into your rack instead of the Sat knob. Problem (kind of) solved! Reason's ability to create workarounds is amazing, really.
Saturation Volume Control.zip
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sat.JPG
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