May I have recommendations for choir sounds?

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AALLF
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Post 18 Jul 2020

(I'm new here, and wasn't sure whether to post this in the Re-fill or Rack Extension section)

I love the "Female Choir" patch in Thor. That type of ambient sound is what I'm looking for. I have the Olympus Micro Re-fill, but if I could have recommendations for any synthesizers in the shop that produce a choir sound like the Thor does, that would be great!

I am also aware of the ProjectSAM Orchestral Sampler, which says it has the choir combined with the orchestra. I would use that, but I need the choir to be by itself, and I'm not sure if that is possible with that instrument.

I am open to any recommendations, both for synthesizers and Re-fills with real sampled choirs. When I compared the Thor "Female Choir" patch to the Olympus Micro, however, I much preferred the Thor. My ear is leaning towards a synthesizer, but any recommedations would be appreciated.

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guitfnky
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Post 18 Jul 2020

not sure what version of Reason you're on, but if you want something clean, a great bet would be to go with Humana--there are several female vocal options to choose from. that one also has an excellent built-in reverb. the benefit of going with a nice clean sound like that is it's easy to dirty up if you need to--otherwise, you can keep things nice and pretty.

you can also check out the ChamberTron and Re-Tron Rack Extensions from GForce Software. they're not as realistic sounding, but they're not meant to be--they still sound great. they don't sound as breathy as that Thor patch, and they don't have built-in reverb, but it's easy enough to add some external verb to get them sounding nice and epic.

there may also be some good stuff for other devices in the factory soundbank, but I'm not sure--might be worth a look.

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raymondh
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Post 19 Jul 2020

+1 on Humana

Also suggest Rob Papen Vecto.
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deeplink
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Post 19 Jul 2020

Search 'choir' in Reason Sounds. Humana, NNXT, NN19 and ID8 all provide choir samples - which can be made quite interesting with help of some panning, chorus, reverb and layering within a combinator

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AALLF
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Post 20 Jul 2020

Thank you everyone for your recommendations. I'll be sure to check those out!

madmacman
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Post 23 Jul 2020

Olympus Micro Refill is more or less the same as Humana. Except for the boy‘s choir which is missing in the Refill.

mtbh
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Post 23 Jul 2020

Try a Mellotron choir. Definitely a different “color”, you might like it.

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guitfnky
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Post 23 Jul 2020

mtbh wrote:
23 Jul 2020
Try a Mellotron choir. Definitely a different “color”, you might like it.
the Re-Tron and Chambertron Rack Extensions I mentioned are Mellotron emulations. definitely a distinct flavor, and very cool if you like a more vintage vibe.

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JiggeryPokery
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Post 23 Jul 2020

guitfnky wrote:
18 Jul 2020
not sure what version of Reason you're on, but if you want something clean, a great bet would be to go with Humana--there are several female vocal options to choose from.
Did they ever fix Humana?

Because as far as I know despite both alpha and beta testers pleaded with PH at the time to add legato, it was <sigh> ignored, even though Gorilla Editor included a basic legato script by default, so it could have been added, with a GUI switch, in probably less than 30 minutes. So concerned they were to just add in a ton of cheaply licensed content fast, they demonstrably didn't care to apply any basic application of attention to detail in the quality of the content they were pasting in.

The result is that Humana sounds like a choir where no singer is capable of producing more than one note without taking a breath in between. Literally no-one sings like that. Even people who can't sing don't sing like that. Try it yourself, right now: regardless of whether you can hit a pitch, go (somewhere where no-one can hear you if need be!) and sing an entire octave of "Doh Re Me... "

I bet you've just sung all twelve notes in one breath, cos you're not an idiot and it's the natural way to do it. Now try it again but take a short breath between each note. That's Humana. Every note forces you to have the initial transients.

You can apply a bit of attack to remove the first transients, but you still don't get that subtle slide between notes, plus to compensate for the gain loss at the start, you'll need to add release, which creates its own problems, particularly with solo vocals. Of course, a serious choir device for musicians, rather than for marketeer's winning Facebook likes, wouldn't merely have been content with just basic legato, but would actually have bothered to add dedicated legato samples too and scripted automatic keyswitching.

As a texture deep in a mix, or layered with stuff, sure, it's not unusuable, you can mostly get away with it, but as a lead or standalone it's extraordinarily piss-poor. Absolutely one of the shoddiest devices PH ever produced.

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guitfnky
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Post 23 Jul 2020

JiggeryPokery wrote:
23 Jul 2020
guitfnky wrote:
18 Jul 2020
not sure what version of Reason you're on, but if you want something clean, a great bet would be to go with Humana--there are several female vocal options to choose from.
Did they ever fix Humana?

Because as far as I know despite both alpha and beta testers pleaded with PH at the time to add legato, it was <sigh> ignored, even though Gorilla Editor included a basic legato script by default, so it could have been added, with a GUI switch, in probably less than 30 minutes. So concerned they were to just add in a ton of cheaply licensed content fast, they demonstrably didn't care to apply any basic application of attention to detail in the quality of the content they were pasting in.

The result is that Humana sounds like a choir where no singer is capable of producing more than one note without taking a breath in between. Literally no-one sings like that. Even people who can't sing don't sing like that. Try it yourself, right now: regardless of whether you can hit a pitch, go (somewhere where no-one can hear you if need be!) and sing an entire octave of "Doh Re Me... "

I bet you've just sung all twelve notes in one breath, cos you're not an idiot and it's the natural way to do it. Now try it again but take a short breath between each note. That's Humana. Every note forces you to have the initial transients.

You can apply a bit of attack to remove the first transients, but you still don't get that subtle slide between notes, plus to compensate for the gain loss at the start, you'll need to add release, which creates its own problems, particularly with solo vocals. Of course, a serious choir device for musicians, rather than for marketeer's winning Facebook likes, wouldn't merely have been content with just basic legato, but would actually have bothered to add dedicated legato samples too and scripted automatic keyswitching.

As a texture deep in a mix, or layered with stuff, sure, it's not unusuable, you can mostly get away with it, but as a lead or standalone it's extraordinarily piss-poor. Absolutely one of the shoddiest devices PH ever produced.
I guess I just always assumed that was kind of standard for choir samples. I don’t have the patience to program stuff with lots of different articulations or any of that. I wouldn’t ever need (or want, really) to use a bunch of samples as a main focus instrument, because, well I would just assume it wouldn’t sound good for all the reasons you state. like, it kind of amazes me that anyone would even consider that as a use case. to me, almost any sample-based “real” instrument falls into the Mellotron category—the only real distinction being where it falls on the chintzy scale.

so for me, Humana is great—because I’ll only ever want or need to use it as a backing instrument, usually slathered in reverb. maybe it is a lazy RS device—I don’t build instruments, so I wouldn’t know. but it’s been an excellent tool for my purposes.

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raymondh
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Post 24 Jul 2020

JiggeryPokery wrote:
23 Jul 2020
guitfnky wrote:
18 Jul 2020
not sure what version of Reason you're on, but if you want something clean, a great bet would be to go with Humana--there are several female vocal options to choose from.
Did they ever fix Humana?

Because as far as I know despite both alpha and beta testers pleaded with PH at the time to add legato, it was <sigh> ignored, even though Gorilla Editor included a basic legato script by default, so it could have been added, with a GUI switch, in probably less than 30 minutes. So concerned they were to just add in a ton of cheaply licensed content fast, they demonstrably didn't care to apply any basic application of attention to detail in the quality of the content they were pasting in.

The result is that Humana sounds like a choir where no singer is capable of producing more than one note without taking a breath in between. Literally no-one sings like that. Even people who can't sing don't sing like that. Try it yourself, right now: regardless of whether you can hit a pitch, go (somewhere where no-one can hear you if need be!) and sing an entire octave of "Doh Re Me... "

I bet you've just sung all twelve notes in one breath, cos you're not an idiot and it's the natural way to do it. Now try it again but take a short breath between each note. That's Humana. Every note forces you to have the initial transients.

You can apply a bit of attack to remove the first transients, but you still don't get that subtle slide between notes, plus to compensate for the gain loss at the start, you'll need to add release, which creates its own problems, particularly with solo vocals. Of course, a serious choir device for musicians, rather than for marketeer's winning Facebook likes, wouldn't merely have been content with just basic legato, but would actually have bothered to add dedicated legato samples too and scripted automatic keyswitching.

As a texture deep in a mix, or layered with stuff, sure, it's not unusuable, you can mostly get away with it, but as a lead or standalone it's extraordinarily piss-poor. Absolutely one of the shoddiest devices PH ever produced.
I tried your experiment and found that not only is the point about legato accurate, but Humana also fails to reproduce the sound of splattering rotten tomatoes, banana skins and expletives that are heard after the the Doh and Re, and just before the Me.
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DaveyG
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Post 24 Jul 2020

The best choir sounds, and orchestral sounds for that matter, are to be found in Kontakt libraries. Great sounds, daft prices.

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Boombastix
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Post 24 Jul 2020

Roland and Korgs flagship synths always had great synth choir sounds. Eg XV5080/Triton
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JiggeryPokery
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Post 24 Jul 2020

raymondh wrote:
24 Jul 2020
Humana also fails to reproduce the sound of splattering rotten tomatoes, banana skins and expletives that are heard after the the Doh and Re, and just before the Me.
:lol: :lol: :lol:

Perfect! ;)

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guitfnky
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Post 24 Jul 2020

oh, so I guess this is a “look down on people who don’t use the tools I like” thread now. that’s cool. :?

pretty sure nobody cares which sample library we used when they’re listening to our tracks. whatever gets the job done, folks.

bieh
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Post 24 Jul 2020

I don't like Humana much at all. Plenty of the voices sound out of tune to the point of being unusable. I don't know whether it was created that way to make an attempt at humanisation, but I think it sounds ridiculous and would only use Humana on certain voices and syllables if it happens to fit in with any background vocal sound I want to create. I think the SoundIron Tuned Micro refill that's been around for years is a little better, but it's still pretty limited. I don't have anything that I'd call a really good choir instrument, but will go looking for a Kontakt instrument if/when I need one.

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mcatalao
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Post 27 Jul 2020

Humana is good but if you want something more than just ooos and aaaas, and more control like real word building, you should look at east west choirs. It works great with Reason, i've used it.

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challism
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Post 29 Jul 2020

I tried your experiment too, Matt. And I keep getting this (video).
It would be nice if they had decided to add legato, especially since it was already available to them, as you mentioned.

Another good choir sound is the Mormon Tabernacle. ;)

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