"Precision Stereo Compressor" New RE from Red Rock Sound

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Red Rock
Posts: 68
Joined: 02 Apr 2016

Post 12 Jul 2020

Djstarski wrote:
12 Jul 2020
Red Rock wrote:
12 Jul 2020


I don’t have IK Multimedia plugins, but I assume that the “=” sign means that the settings for the mid and side channels are the same, it’s the same as the M / S mode in our compressor


The = sign means stereo not m/s
This is the way i understand it :

Stereo = Both left and right channels are treated equally

Dual mono = Left and right channels are treated separately

Mid/Side = The middle information and the side information are treated separately .

Please correct me if i`m wrong ?
That is, when you switch from L/ R mode to M / S mode, = button remains for l / r mode? I think if in the m / s mode the = button would not be needed, it would just be inactive
But I watch the video and in M / S mode = button is active. In addition, the button = is located between the buttons m and s, I do not see the buttons L and R in m / s mode

I repeat, I have no Ik plugins so I can not check it out on my own. But what I see on the video, I think it is an obvious fact that the button = in m / s mode refers to m / s mode and not to l / r mode

P.S. If you are not comfortable with the m / s button on the compressor there is a great option for you, add 100 euros and buy a compressor from IK
https://www.ikmultimedia.com/products/trpreccomplim/
Last edited by Red Rock on 12 Jul 2020, edited 2 times in total.

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Red Rock
Posts: 68
Joined: 02 Apr 2016

Post 12 Jul 2020

guitfnky wrote:
12 Jul 2020

I’m specifically talking about plugins where there is no second set of controls at all. based on what Red Rock is saying, I *think* I may have it right.
Yes, you understood everything correctly

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selig
RE Developer
Posts: 8785
Joined: 15 Jan 2015
Location: The NorthWoods, CT, USA

Post 12 Jul 2020

Djstarski wrote:
12 Jul 2020
Just when I thought something makes sense , it now becomes confusing again . I mix and master tracks using reason . So if I purchase a device with a mid/side mode I expect it to have two controls for me to do my job . I believe if the mode does not work in that way it should not be there .
Which REs support two sets of controls for separate Mid and Side processing?

IMO the Red Rocks option to do BOTH is a very clever way to give additional functionality beyond just "Mid Only" and "Side Only" compression (which is also supports, IIRC).

Plus, in Reason it is SO simple to create two devices, one for mid and one for side, which as I've said before I actually prefer over trying to do it all in one device. It allows you to display/view ALL controls at once rather than switching back and forth between them. It also allows you to do things you cannot do in other DAWs, like add ANY EQ to the mid or side signal since they are processed in separate audio paths. It's probably too advanced for most folks, but it is another example of how Reason's "modular" approach gives quite a bit of flexibility over other DAWs IMO.
Selig Audio, LLC

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Djstarski
Posts: 328
Joined: 20 Jan 2015

Post 12 Jul 2020

selig wrote:
12 Jul 2020
Djstarski wrote:
12 Jul 2020
Just when I thought something makes sense , it now becomes confusing again . I mix and master tracks using reason . So if I purchase a device with a mid/side mode I expect it to have two controls for me to do my job . I believe if the mode does not work in that way it should not be there .
Which REs support two sets of controls for separate Mid and Side processing?

IMO the Red Rocks option to do BOTH is a very clever way to give additional functionality beyond just "Mid Only" and "Side Only" compression (which is also supports, IIRC).

Plus, in Reason it is SO simple to create two devices, one for mid and one for side, which as I've said before I actually prefer over trying to do it all in one device. It allows you to display/view ALL controls at once rather than switching back and forth between them. It also allows you to do things you cannot do in other DAWs, like add ANY EQ to the mid or side signal since they are processed in separate audio paths. It's probably too advanced for most folks, but it is another example of how Reason's "modular" approach gives quite a bit of flexibility over other DAWs IMO.
I`m sorry if i don`t understand what you guys mean . I`m just thinking of what M/S processing is . when you place an m/s mode on a device , be it RE or VST you would expect that device to process the audio in the same way as seen on the video . If there is a different m/s processing technique please let me know as i would like to learn this technique as well .

Thank you in advance .

P.S. a video would be nice explaining this technique as i`m a visual person .

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Loque
Posts: 7777
Joined: 28 Dec 2015

Post 12 Jul 2020

I didnt checked the Compressor yet, but i speculate, it is a slightly changed version of the Molot (since Red Rock provides a copy or a port - i dont know - of it in the shop). And the Molot compressor says M/S mode:
https://www.tokyodawn.net/labs/vladgsou ... pdf?x70938
In M/S mode input stereo signal is encoded into M/S format, then both signal components are processed by two compressors and maximum gain reduction of both compressors is used. Both limiter modules work independently. Saturation is not applied for S-channel processing. This mode is used as a special effect for stereo signal.
I guess this might be an intersting operation mode for very wide sounds, like unison synths.
:reason: 11, Win10 64Bit.

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selig
RE Developer
Posts: 8785
Joined: 15 Jan 2015
Location: The NorthWoods, CT, USA

Post 12 Jul 2020

Djstarski wrote:
12 Jul 2020
selig wrote:
12 Jul 2020


Which REs support two sets of controls for separate Mid and Side processing?

IMO the Red Rocks option to do BOTH is a very clever way to give additional functionality beyond just "Mid Only" and "Side Only" compression (which is also supports, IIRC).

Plus, in Reason it is SO simple to create two devices, one for mid and one for side, which as I've said before I actually prefer over trying to do it all in one device. It allows you to display/view ALL controls at once rather than switching back and forth between them. It also allows you to do things you cannot do in other DAWs, like add ANY EQ to the mid or side signal since they are processed in separate audio paths. It's probably too advanced for most folks, but it is another example of how Reason's "modular" approach gives quite a bit of flexibility over other DAWs IMO.
I`m sorry if i don`t understand what you guys mean . I`m just thinking of what M/S processing is . when you place an m/s mode on a device , be it RE or VST you would expect that device to process the audio in the same way as seen on the video . If there is a different m/s processing technique please let me know as i would like to learn this technique as well .

Thank you in advance .

P.S. a video would be nice explaining this technique as i`m a visual person .
The video mentions more than one way to process Mid/Side, one of which seems in line with this compressor and other Reason devices that support Mid/Side.
At the risk of repeating myself, you can process Mid, or Side, with full control over the settings. OR, you can process Mid AND Side, with one set of controls. What is missing from the video is "DUAL" mode, where you have two sets of controls. But again, in Reason, unlike other DAWs, it's so easy and even an advantage to create two devices, one for mid and one for side, and use them on the same signal. This is kinda like DUAL mode in the video, with the advantage you don't have to switch the UI back and forth to access each set of controls, and the huge advantage you can add any additional processing to either mid or side (or both) signals! No other DAW can do that, so for those DAWs you have to compromise and stack all the controls in one device, switching between them to set each control.

Contrast this to hardware mid/side compression which would work exactly like with Reason: two mono compressors, one for the mid and one for the side signal. Something like two Distressors would be ideal, or a dual mono unit like Retro Instruments Retro Revolver Tube Compressor.

And again, much of the time you'll only need to process one channel, like de-essing the center channel of a mix that is overly sibilant, or compressing the center of the overheads of a drum kit, or brightening the sides of any stereo signal to add width. Here are some "real world" references:
http://www.recordingbootcamp.com/2015/0 ... rocessing/
https://ask.audio/articles/sound-proces ... ide-stereo

Sure, there may be cases where you need to work with both the mid and the side together, and the beauty of Reason is that you can do this with ANY device even using the built in devices (Thor makes a great M/S convertor).
Selig Audio, LLC

bieh
Posts: 40
Joined: 18 May 2020

Post 05 Sep 2020

For those who want an RE compressor with separate controls for mid and side, there's the Lab One Recordings' Mace.

By default, Mace is a stereo compressor with identical but separate controls for left and right channels. Loading an instance of Mace and clicking on the dark red rectangle near the middle of the top showing "L / R" changes it "M / S", assigning the left compressor controls to "mid" and the right ones to "side". You also have separate compression response plots to see what's going on with the mid and side channels.

As Selig said, the modular nature of Reason ensures you can do compression with separate and simultaneously accessible controls for mid and side, even without a compressor that has a mid/side mode, as long as you use two compressor devices and have some kind of mid/side converter. If you don't want to use Thor for mid/side conversion, other options include the free Anansi or RE 181 devices, or the $9 Quadelectra Stereo Splitter.

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