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MrFigg
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Joined: 20 Apr 2018

Post 21 Jun 2020

Just noticed this...
http://17frames.com/lpcvfree
Excellent!!! :)
丰2ॐ

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Loque
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Post 21 Jun 2020

Cool. Could be my new drift device. Most others have a max of 32 bars or 0.02hz which is not enough and often too obvious.

It just needs a transport lock.
:reason: 11, Win10 64Bit.

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MrFigg
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Post 21 Jun 2020

Loque wrote:
21 Jun 2020
It just needs a transport lock.
What does that do?
丰2ॐ

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Loque
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Post 21 Jun 2020

MrFigg wrote:
21 Jun 2020
Loque wrote:
21 Jun 2020
It just needs a transport lock.
What does that do?
It always has the same value on a transport position. It's the same value in the song position, it's not changing, d flu will always have the same value. That is often a i problem with LFOs, eher you get unpredictable and unreproducable results without a transport lock.
:reason: 11, Win10 64Bit.

DaveyG
Posts: 442
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Post 21 Jun 2020

Loque wrote:
21 Jun 2020
MrFigg wrote:
21 Jun 2020


What does that do?
It always has the same value on a transport position. It's the same value in the song position, it's not changing, d flu will always have the same value. That is often a i problem with LFOs, eher you get unpredictable and unreproducable results without a transport lock.
That's the main point of an LFO though. It's asynchronous to everything else so the sounds morph in an interesting way. Unpredictable can be good. :thumbs_up:

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Loque
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Post 21 Jun 2020

DaveyG wrote:
21 Jun 2020
Loque wrote:
21 Jun 2020

It always has the same value on a transport position. It's the same value in the song position, it's not changing, d flu will always have the same value. That is often a i problem with LFOs, eher you get unpredictable and unreproducable results without a transport lock.
That's the main point of an LFO though. It's asynchronous to everything else so the sounds morph in an interesting way. Unpredictable can be good. :thumbs_up:
Add a switch for control. Lectric Panda knows how it works...
:reason: 11, Win10 64Bit.

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guitfnky
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Post 21 Jun 2020

DaveyG wrote:
21 Jun 2020
Loque wrote:
21 Jun 2020

It always has the same value on a transport position. It's the same value in the song position, it's not changing, d flu will always have the same value. That is often a i problem with LFOs, eher you get unpredictable and unreproducable results without a transport lock.
That's the main point of an LFO though. It's asynchronous to everything else so the sounds morph in an interesting way. Unpredictable can be good. :thumbs_up:
true, but sometimes you want the best of both worlds. unpredictable results, but once you find an unpredictable result that works particularly well, you’d like to be able to keep that one.

it’s sort of like some of the old Ochen K randomizing devices, where it has a seed value. it generates a randomized result, but if you use the same seed value, that randomized result will play back the exact same way every time.

it’s a pretty useful feature, especially when you’re nearing the export stage. for instance right now I have a couple of songs I’m working on that have randomized patches for effects in them. without this kind of feature, I have to export the file to see what I get, and if the randomization it applied during export doesn’t sound as good as I need it to, I have to keep re-exporting and listening until it does. with a transport lock, or seeded randomization value, I wouldn’t have to worry about it because it will always sound exactly the same.

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Zac
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Post 21 Jun 2020

Thanks 17 frames... Very much appreciated 👍

f3ilter
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Joined: 21 Jun 2020

Post 21 Jun 2020

Loque wrote:
21 Jun 2020
MrFigg wrote:
21 Jun 2020


What does that do?
It always has the same value on a transport position. It's the same value in the song position, it's not changing, d flu will always have the same value. That is often a i problem with LFOs, eher you get unpredictable and unreproducable results without a transport lock.
As long as you don't touch the reset button, it is transport locked.
Andy (17Frames)

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Loque
Posts: 7486
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Post 21 Jun 2020

f3ilter wrote:
21 Jun 2020
Loque wrote:
21 Jun 2020

It always has the same value on a transport position. It's the same value in the song position, it's not changing, d flu will always have the same value. That is often a i problem with LFOs, eher you get unpredictable and unreproducable results without a transport lock.
As long as you don't touch the reset button, it is transport locked.
Andy (17Frames)
Excellent ;) :thumbs_up:
:reason: 11, Win10 64Bit.

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guitfnky
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Post 21 Jun 2020

nice! there you have it. :)

Bes
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Post 21 Jun 2020

looking forward to this one. thanks 17Frames :)

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selig
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Post 21 Jun 2020

Loque wrote:
21 Jun 2020
Cool. Could be my new drift device. Most others have a max of 32 bars or 0.02hz which is not enough and often too obvious.

It just needs a transport lock.
I've always wondered why folks use LFOs for oscillator drift. Having had a synth that drifted, it's not something you'd ever want to recreate. But besides that, it's pitch doesn't drift up and down. It typically drifts one direction until the temp stabilizes, then it can stop.

The thing that makes analog oscillators sound "analog" IMO is imperfect tuning and tracking. Tracking and tuning is super easy to do digitally, but more difficult to do with analog. So when you have more than one oscillator and they don't track perfectly or can never be perfectly in tune, that's part of the sound right there. The other part is tuning across voices - a random pitch per note added to the detuning and key tracking being off is going to sound far more "analog" than a slow LFO affecting pitch IMO.

That being said, I AM a sucker for super slow LFOs, and having a dedicated device for this function will be welcome (and beats rigging Thor just for a super slow LFO!).
Selig Audio, LLC

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Boombastix
Posts: 1503
Joined: 18 May 2018
Location: Bay Area, CA

Post 21 Jun 2020

selig wrote:
21 Jun 2020
Loque wrote:
21 Jun 2020
Cool. Could be my new drift device. Most others have a max of 32 bars or 0.02hz which is not enough and often too obvious.

It just needs a transport lock.
I've always wondered why folks use LFOs for oscillator drift. Having had a synth that drifted, it's not something you'd ever want to recreate. But besides that, it's pitch doesn't drift up and down. It typically drifts one direction until the temp stabilizes, then it can stop.

The thing that makes analog oscillators sound "analog" IMO is imperfect tuning and tracking. Tracking and tuning is super easy to do digitally, but more difficult to do with analog. So when you have more than one oscillator and they don't track perfectly or can never be perfectly in tune, that's part of the sound right there. The other part is tuning across voices - a random pitch per note added to the detuning and key tracking being off is going to sound far more "analog" than a slow LFO affecting pitch IMO.

That being said, I AM a sucker for super slow LFOs, and having a dedicated device for this function will be welcome (and beats rigging Thor just for a super slow LFO!).
Probably not that many who actually have used/owned the big 2-osc 6-voice analogs. So they don't know what makes them sound like that. In fact, back in the days there were service technicians that were sought after to re-tune each synth voice, key track, pitch, filter track, and so on. And they tuned it by ear, like a piano tuner, to make them sound big and fat, it was an artform actually! Any service manual can give you an idea just by reading the tuning instruction. Diva has a tune per voice knob, but not many "analog" VSTs have that.

The "temperature drift" settings are pretty silly IMO as well, as a temp drift moves slowly, like 15-30min in to a new stable point, there is no LFO like temp drift in a synth unless you sit there with a hair dryer and blow hot air on certain transistors, lol :lol:
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Benedict
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Location: Gold Coast, Australia

Post 21 Jun 2020

selig wrote:
21 Jun 2020
I've always wondered why folks use LFOs for oscillator drift. Having had a synth that drifted, it's not something you'd ever want to recreate. But besides that, it's pitch doesn't drift up and down. It typically drifts one direction until the temp stabilizes, then it can stop.

The thing that makes analog oscillators sound "analog" IMO is imperfect tuning and tracking. Tracking and tuning is super easy to do digitally, but more difficult to do with analog. So when you have more than one oscillator and they don't track perfectly or can never be perfectly in tune, that's part of the sound right there. The other part is tuning across voices - a random pitch per note added to the detuning and key tracking being off is going to sound far more "analog" than a slow LFO affecting pitch IMO.

That being said, I AM a sucker for super slow LFOs, and having a dedicated device for this function will be welcome (and beats rigging Thor just for a super slow LFO!).
I am with Selig. Analog drift in a positive sense is best as offsets per voice of pitch, filter and even things like LFO rates. Just putting a slow LFO over the whole synth is more digital. Can be nice but not Analog in feel.

Europa is relatively easy with Random as a Mod Source but for Thor is not so easy for a fuller patch (already using the LFO 1 trick) buuuuut if you have something like Freq Shifter or Grain Pitch shifting in EchoBode or the Pitch module in Q-FX, you can use those with a subtle modulation to "munge" up overall sense of pitch/tone over time. Not so useful for pads but bass or other shorter sounds like Hi-hats this workes great.

Image
Image

:-)

f3ilter
Posts: 3
Joined: 21 Jun 2020

Post 22 Jun 2020

So, I have to admit that 'recreating' old analogue synths is not my aim. I'm more interested in the structural possibilities. I only include a few patches, but in one I've wired up the LPCV (via spider) to a bunch of Pulsars rate CV. I then changed the level inputs of each and sent them into the trigs for a ReDrum. The LPCV then controls this eclectic rhythmic build up.
As for pitch, I tend to think more dramatically. I think the first few bars of Brahms 1st is truely awesome: it has two parts of the orchestra falling in and past each other (pitchwise). This is the kind of thing that i was thinking about.
There are, I'm sure, some very subtle uses for LPCV, but I'm all about the noise and the strange.
Cheers
Andy(17frames)

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Loque
Posts: 7486
Joined: 28 Dec 2015

Post 22 Jun 2020

selig wrote:
21 Jun 2020
Loque wrote:
21 Jun 2020
Cool. Could be my new drift device. Most others have a max of 32 bars or 0.02hz which is not enough and often too obvious.

It just needs a transport lock.
I've always wondered why folks use LFOs for oscillator drift. Having had a synth that drifted, it's not something you'd ever want to recreate. But besides that, it's pitch doesn't drift up and down. It typically drifts one direction until the temp stabilizes, then it can stop.

The thing that makes analog oscillators sound "analog" IMO is imperfect tuning and tracking. Tracking and tuning is super easy to do digitally, but more difficult to do with analog. So when you have more than one oscillator and they don't track perfectly or can never be perfectly in tune, that's part of the sound right there. The other part is tuning across voices - a random pitch per note added to the detuning and key tracking being off is going to sound far more "analog" than a slow LFO affecting pitch IMO.

That being said, I AM a sucker for super slow LFOs, and having a dedicated device for this function will be welcome (and beats rigging Thor just for a super slow LFO!).
I use it all, "bad" key tracking, Randomizing and LFOs. Just the LFOs are often too fast and it becomes too obvious.
:reason: 11, Win10 64Bit.

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MrFigg
Posts: 4604
Joined: 20 Apr 2018

Post 23 Jun 2020

It’s in the shop now for those he didn’t already see it :)
https://www.reasonstudios.com/shop/rack ... /lpcvfree/
丰2ॐ

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geronimo
Posts: 425
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Location: France

Post 23 Jun 2020

Super: my two cents .
Murena.cmb.zip
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selig
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Location: The NorthWoods, CT, USA

Post 24 Jun 2020

f3ilter wrote:
22 Jun 2020
So, I have to admit that 'recreating' old analogue synths is not my aim. I'm more interested in the structural possibilities. I only include a few patches, but in one I've wired up the LPCV (via spider) to a bunch of Pulsars rate CV. I then changed the level inputs of each and sent them into the trigs for a ReDrum. The LPCV then controls this eclectic rhythmic build up.
As for pitch, I tend to think more dramatically. I think the first few bars of Brahms 1st is truely awesome: it has two parts of the orchestra falling in and past each other (pitchwise). This is the kind of thing that i was thinking about.
There are, I'm sure, some very subtle uses for LPCV, but I'm all about the noise and the strange.
Cheers
Andy(17frames)
To be clear, I love stuff like this and my comment wasn't aimed at your product in any way! One of the first things I did when I discovered you could push Thor's values past the front panel knobs was to create super slow LFOs for the type of stuff you describe above (and for modular style evolving patches).
Then I found Echobode, which can sweep as low as 1 cycle per 16.667 minutes, and that's about as slow as I'd ever need an LFO to go!
But your device is different - it's tempo based and it's not synced to the transport (bar/beat) position (unless you want it to be). My only requests (had to go there, sorry!) would be a sine wave option (still my favorite LFO shape), and either allow the period to be set in min/sec or at least display the conversion to min/sec from bars. :)
Selig Audio, LLC

f3ilter
Posts: 3
Joined: 21 Jun 2020

Post 24 Jun 2020

Hi Selig. No offence taken, no offence meant.
I'm curious now about the Echobode (i'm often late to the party). Going to check it out soon.
I have thought about adding curve/slew options, as well as a bunch of other options, but didn't want to want to go overboard as it really took longer than I expected for a freebie.
While I was testing it I often used it in combination with Alien Seed Tech's ARCUS User Knobs (cool curve options).
Another option is to plug 2 LPCVs into my Double Dutch CVW (or Robotic Bean's Compare CV Scope) and use the 2nd one into the scale cv input. Lots of cool options.

BedsitAudio
Posts: 9
Joined: 16 May 2020

Post 25 Jun 2020

A syncable LFO that goes beyond 8 bars is the one thing I have been missing the most when designing my half hour drone ambient pieces. I realise it might sound like sarcasm, but I'm serious! I've come to rely more on automation for this, but I'm sure this will find a lot of use in my sound design.

So thank you so, *so* much for this!

And I realise it's looking a gift horse in the mouth, but I can't help thinking a gate in for the reset button on the back could have been useful. Not essential, just useful.

NDKay
Posts: 256
Joined: 04 Jul 2018
Location: Suite 11

Post 25 Jun 2020

:thumbs_up:

Just got it.... thank you
This is a SmartAss. Really nothing more than that !

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selig
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Post 25 Jun 2020

f3ilter wrote:
24 Jun 2020
Hi Selig. No offence taken, no offence meant.
I'm curious now about the Echobode (i'm often late to the party). Going to check it out soon.
I have thought about adding curve/slew options, as well as a bunch of other options, but didn't want to want to go overboard as it really took longer than I expected for a freebie.
While I was testing it I often used it in combination with Alien Seed Tech's ARCUS User Knobs (cool curve options).
Another option is to plug 2 LPCVs into my Double Dutch CVW (or Robotic Bean's Compare CV Scope) and use the 2nd one into the scale cv input. Lots of cool options.
Understood, and I can totally appreciate not wanting to succumb to feature creep - maybe a paid version with a more robust feature set would be worth your time? I'd be a customer, for sure! :)
Selig Audio, LLC

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dioxide
Posts: 1200
Joined: 15 Jul 2015

Post 25 Jun 2020

I'm very interested in this and I'm going to demo it. I've been using Blamsoft's envelope for rise and falls for sweeps, volume etc, but it isn't locked to the timeline. It look like this won't allow you to use it like an envelope but the idea is good. If you ever plan on trying an extended paid-for version of this, I would be very interested.

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