To Zero or not to Zero

[Arjanders]

Hmm I'm in doubt. I like Zero and the sounddesign possibilities.

Two things though are holding me back.

Most important: no cv inputs for the matrix.
I know the Matrix per operator can be modulated, but I want to be able to modulate each on its own.
So to store those modulation I have to record in the sequencer (I like to stay in the rack) or set the knobs in a combinator (only 8 cv inputs and puts me out of the flow.

Second is not be able to modulate the amp envelope. I like to play with decay, sustain. Of course I can record the audio, but yea..

Am I missing something here? I hope so (:

[ab459]

I did not planned to grab Zero now, but unfortunately decided to check trial, and among painful working with envelopes lol found really something special in his frequency modulation character. So was forced to grab. It seems Blamsoft know how to make right sound.

[TritoneAddiction]

I hate working with Zero. But I like the sounds it can create. It definitely has its own character. For me Zero is strictly a preset bank, but I'm fine with that. It still offers value in my music. For the current sales price I'd say it's totally worth it.

[Auryn]

Hmm I'm in doubt. I like Zero and the sounddesign possibilities.

Two things though are holding me back.

Most important: no cv inputs for the matrix.
I know the Matrix per operator can be modulated, but I want to be able to modulate each on its own.
So to store those modulation I have to record in the sequencer (I like to stay in the rack) or set the knobs in a combinator (only 8 cv inputs and puts me out of the flow.

Second is not be able to modulate the amp envelope. I like to play with decay, sustain. Of course I can record the audio, but yea..

Am I missing something here? I hope so (:

Greetings fellow dutchie (probably?), well there are 4 assignable CV inputs, and every operator has an individual volume, mod, pitch envelope so for a lot of modulations you may be able to find a workaround. There's also a volume cv in on the back, and an amp env rate destination in the mod matrix. Zero is a lot of fun to mess around with so I would definitely recommend getting it.

[ab459]

BTW, never tried IL Sytrus though, just i see Zero are called often like his brother, hm interesting would be to compare.

[Arjanders]

Greetings fellow dutchie (probably?),

Yep dutch it is!

well there are 4 assignable CV inputs, and every operator has an individual volume, mod, pitch envelope so for a lot of modulations you may be able to find a workaround. There's also a volume cv in on the back, and an amp env rate destination in the mod matrix. Zero is a lot of fun to mess around with so I would definitely recommend getting it.

Yes, quite some possibilities, I guess I will spend the final maymadness days with it to feel if it's gonna connect with me.

Thanks all for the viewpoints!

[Auryn]

Yes, quite some possibilities, I guess I will spend the final maymadness days with it to feel if it's gonna connect with me.

Thanks all for the viewpoints!

if you're interested, I made a refill for Zero a few years ago, the sound examples are IMHO a pretty good overview of the type of sounds you can make

[Loque]

The FM matrix is great. Just needs more and smoother waves. A little eXpanse infusion please. And who needs oversampling, when Zero has a decimate switch on the back which sounds amazing.

[Reasonable man]

Yes, quite some possibilities, I guess I will spend the final maymadness days with it to feel if it's gonna connect with me.

Thanks all for the viewpoints!

if you're interested, I made a refill for Zero a few years ago, the sound examples are IMHO a pretty good overview of the type of sounds you can make

Very nice. You seem to do well with additive synths in particular.....they're not everyone's cup of tea!
I think i have an expanse refill of yours ..did you do one for expanse? Anyway if i get a cash injection soon i'll be hopefully getting this one and the oberon refill....very nice.

[ab459]

In my opinion the very first loaded preset (calls Alpha Trance AZ) successfully shows enough special character of this synth, especially in low octaves. Especially if disable delay and reverb (though reverb pretty good here).
You can even disable unison (set to minimum voices and detune knobs) but timbre will still interesting.

[Auryn]

Very nice. You seem to do well with additive synths in particular.....they're not everyone's cup of tea!
I think i have an expanse refill of yours ..did you do one for expanse? Anyway if i get a cash injection soon i'll be hopefully getting this one and the oberon refill....very nice.

Thanks man, that's nice to hear! I hope you're getting some mileage out of the expanse refill (it's in my sig)

The additive synth comment: Oberon is the only "explicit" additive synth I've worked with. Zero, Expanse, and now Europa (my latest refill) are also additive by nature but the way you interact with them/manipulate the partials is dressed up as FM and wavetable synthesis. I'm no DSP programmer but I think that additive synthesis is uniquely suited to software instruments because of its digital nature (i.e. there is no emulating of analog components involved) which is why it is used so often.

[Auryn]

In my opinion the very first loaded preset (calls Alpha Trance AZ) successfully shows enough special character of this synth, especially in low octaves. Especially if disable delay and reverb (though reverb pretty good here).
You can even disable unison (set to minimum voices and detune knobs) but timbre will still interesting.

this is also an interesting comment. In my refill I often tuned some of the operators waaay down to LFO-like speed/frequency for vibrato. You can still interact with them/modulate them with other operators. This approach certainly gets you some interesting and unique sounds.

[Arjanders]

Yes, quite some possibilities, I guess I will spend the final maymadness days with it to feel if it's gonna connect with me.

Thanks all for the viewpoints!

if you're interested, I made a refill for Zero a few years ago, the sound examples are IMHO a pretty good overview of the type of sounds you can make

Thanks for the tip! I will try your free 0-PEACE after work today. A good way see how you made those sounds.

[Arjanders]

In my opinion the very first loaded preset (calls Alpha Trance AZ) successfully shows enough special character of this synth, especially in low octaves. Especially if disable delay and reverb (though reverb pretty good here).
You can even disable unison (set to minimum voices and detune knobs) but timbre will still interesting.

Thanks for the tip!

[Auryn]

Thanks for the tip! I will try your free 0-PEACE after work today. A good way see how you made those sounds.

Man, it's been so long since I made that archive that I actually have almost no clue what's in it... I hope it's good!

[danc]

Thanks for the tip! I will try your free 0-PEACE after work today. A good way see how you made those sounds.

Man, it's been so long since I made that archive that I actually have almost no clue what's in it... I hope it's good!

I read this yesterday and thought... blimey I used to use ZERO loads... and used to love it. Well - I booted it up again and created myself an FM bassline.

Here's the result... hot off the press.... listen to SIMPLE ME.



There's 2 303's in there too courtesy of ABL 3 RE.

[Arjanders]

Thanks for the tip! I will try your free 0-PEACE after work today. A good way see how you made those sounds.

Man, it's been so long since I made that archive that I actually have almost no clue what's in it... I hope it's good!

Yes, It helped me do decide, you used the convenient modulations available in the osc in nice ways. I was a bit too focused on what is not possible/difficult to do, but there is quite some modulation possible already. Thanks for pointing out!

[Arjanders]

Man, it's been so long since I made that archive that I actually have almost no clue what's in it... I hope it's good!

I read this yesterday and thought... blimey I used to use ZERO loads... and used to love it. Well - I booted it up again and created myself an FM bassline.

Here's the result... hot off the press.... listen to SIMPLE ME.



There's 2 303's in there too courtesy of ABL 3 RE.

Thanks for sharing! You found a lost loved one I hear (:

[eXode]

Hmm I'm in doubt. I like Zero and the sounddesign possibilities.

Two things though are holding me back.

Most important: no cv inputs for the matrix.
I know the Matrix per operator can be modulated, but I want to be able to modulate each on its own.
So to store those modulation I have to record in the sequencer (I like to stay in the rack) or set the knobs in a combinator (only 8 cv inputs and puts me out of the flow.

Second is not be able to modulate the amp envelope. I like to play with decay, sustain. Of course I can record the audio, but yea..

Am I missing something here? I hope so (:

The Operator # Mod destination in the modulation matrix is used for modulating the amount which said operator is modulated by other operators. So by assigning i.e. CV Input 1 to Operator 1 - Mod you can modulate the amount that Operator 1 is modulated by other operators in the FM matrix. Each operator has it's own Mod Envelope though so you can do pretty creative modulation within Zero itself. If you want more detailed control over specific operators then I suggest you use the associated Volume Envelope. You can also modulate Operator Volume in the modulation matrix. This is where FM can go Inception. You can have different levels of cascaded modulation.

All the envelopes in Zero are MSEGs and not traditional ADSR, so you cannot modulate a single stage, only the rate (speed) of the entire envelope.

[Arjanders]

Hmm I'm in doubt. I like Zero and the sounddesign possibilities.

Two things though are holding me back.

Most important: no cv inputs for the matrix.
I know the Matrix per operator can be modulated, but I want to be able to modulate each on its own.
So to store those modulation I have to record in the sequencer (I like to stay in the rack) or set the knobs in a combinator (only 8 cv inputs and puts me out of the flow.

Second is not be able to modulate the amp envelope. I like to play with decay, sustain. Of course I can record the audio, but yea..

Am I missing something here? I hope so (:

The Operator # Mod destination in the modulation matrix is used for modulating the amount which said operator is modulated by other operators. So by assigning i.e. CV Input 1 to Operator 1 - Mod you can modulate the amount that Operator 1 is modulated by other operators in the FM matrix. Each operator has it's own Mod Envelope though so you can do pretty creative modulation within Zero itself. If you want more detailed control over specific operators then I suggest you use the associated Volume Envelope. You can also modulate Operator Volume in the modulation matrix. This is where FM can go Inception. You can have different levels of cascaded modulation.

All the envelopes in Zero are MSEGs and not traditional ADSR, so you cannot modulate a single stage, only the rate (speed) of the entire envelope.

Thanks a lot. The volume envelope in the oscillator is exactly what I was looking for. That plus the LFO per osc and the cv1 for volume on the back. Enough options!

In the multistage envelope movement modulation is possible. I am no way an expert or such, just curious. I wonder what the difference is in implementation(?) that modulation of the envelopes in Zero are not possible.

[eXode]

In the multistage envelope movement modulation is possible. I am no way an expert or such, just curious. I wonder what the difference is in implementation(?) that modulation of the envelopes in Zero are not possible.

I don't know the exact difference either, but I think that it has to do with Zero's amount of possible parameters. As far as I understand there's a physical limit as to how many controls/parameters a RE can have, so basically with a complex device like Zero you have to make sacrifices.

[Benedict]

Hi Exode

I often look at Zero & PX-7 and wonder which I would get. I Tried Zero when it first came out and there was a Song Comp. I haven't dared Try PX-7 yet. Sometimes I get a hankering for FM. Thor can do some, Europa can do a bit, I made my own 4-Op... but there is a lure to full FM and the detail thing it does so well. I even wonder if Expanse is the ticket but I Tried that one at 1.0 too and I can't see how structured the added FM in Expanse can get - I assume not as much as Zero or PX-7

[eXode]

Hi Exode

I often look at Zero & PX-7 and wonder which I would get. I Tried Zero when it first came out and there was a Song Comp. I haven't dared Try PX-7 yet. Sometimes I get a hankering for FM. Thor can do some, Europa can do a bit, I made my own 4-Op... but there is a lure to full FM and the detail thing it does so well. I even wonder if Expanse is the ticket but I Tried that one at 1.0 too and I can't see how structured the added FM in Expanse can get - I assume not as much as Zero or PX-7

Zero is probably the deepest/most flexible FM synth in Reason. PX-7 is a more of a pure DX7 emulation with a pretty straight forward interface. Expanse can do 4-OP FM (and possibly cascaded 8-OP FM), but the way the routing is implemented is not as straight forward as Zero or PX-7.

Nice little patching FM synth.

[Benedict]

Thanks