Dry/Wet Knob RE ?

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Busta US
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Joined: 26 Oct 2019

Post 05 Dec 2019

Is it technically possible to create an RE that serves only as a Dry/Wet knob for the effect that you connect it to? For instance connect it to Skream or Alligator and be able to control the fx' dry/wet signal ?

Can it be done inside Reason?

Thx guys

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EpiGenetik
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Location: Glasgow, EU

Post 05 Dec 2019

Strictly speaking no, an FX device might not have a dry/wet, and there’s no guarantee that you can access a dry/wet controller via CV.

That said, if you split a signal in 2, so that one goes out dry and the other to the fx processor then you can merge and cross fade them using a free RE called Morfin Crossfader. It also has a few curves onboard to make things easier 😊


Proboscis
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Post 05 Dec 2019

Busta US wrote: ↑
05 Dec 2019
Is it technically possible to create an RE that serves only as a Dry/Wet knob for the effect that you connect it to? For instance connect it to Skream or Alligator and be able to control the fx' dry/wet signal ?

Can it be done inside Reason?

Thx guys
That's a good question. Makes me wonder how to setup a secondary instance of a note, for independent control and to 'push forward' the sound.

Time to fire up Reason !

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rcbuse
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Post 05 Dec 2019

Busta US wrote: ↑
05 Dec 2019
Is it technically possible to create an RE that serves only as a Dry/Wet knob for the effect that you connect it to? For instance connect it to Skream or Alligator and be able to control the fx' dry/wet signal ?

Can it be done inside Reason?

Thx guys
Your best bet is a parallel mix bus, this should use any plugin's delay compensation information. Many FX will introduce a few samples of delay or some phase shifting / inversion. If you straight mix the pre-RE signal with an post-RE signal, you are likely to have some wacky phase cancellation / comb filtering going on.

Ostermilk
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Post 06 Dec 2019

THIS^^^

One of the most eloquently implemented RE's in the entire store. I wish Groovy Melon had made more devices but this is my longest time favourite freebie in the shop.

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Boombastix
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Post 06 Dec 2019

rcbuse wrote: ↑
05 Dec 2019
Busta US wrote: ↑
05 Dec 2019
Is it technically possible to create an RE that serves only as a Dry/Wet knob for the effect that you connect it to? For instance connect it to Skream or Alligator and be able to control the fx' dry/wet signal ?

Can it be done inside Reason?

Thx guys
Your best bet is a parallel mix bus, this should use any plugin's delay compensation information. Many FX will introduce a few samples of delay or some phase shifting / inversion. If you straight mix the pre-RE signal with an post-RE signal, you are likely to have some wacky phase cancellation / comb filtering going on.
Like Panda says, potential delay comp issues. READ this section in the manual, it will tell you under what circumstances delay compensation is NOT done.
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Proboscis
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Post 06 Dec 2019

Busta US wrote: ↑
05 Dec 2019
Is it technically possible to create an RE that serves only as a Dry/Wet knob for the effect that you connect it to? For instance connect it to Skream or Alligator and be able to control the fx' dry/wet signal ?
Your post gave me an idea, so thanks for that. Whether this inspires you to create something for yourself to use for your purposes, well let us know !

Using a Combinator:

1. Add a 14:2 mixer
2. Add A Spider Splitter and a DDL-1 Delay (hold down shift so the don't auto route)
3. Add your Instrument

Now, take the output of your synth and route to the input jack. Then take one audio out pair to channel 1 of the mixer. Then use the second splitter output, route that to the DDL-1, then take the DDL-1 output into channel 2 of the mixer.

Set the DDL-1's dry/wet to hard right (ie; fully wet)

Here is a songfile with a Combinator(and I have included an alligator on Return #2), where it's possible to control the wet signal to trigger wherever you want in the bar, either in steps or milliseconds, and I have programmed the controls as follows:

Rotary 1: Time (sync)
Rotary 2: Time (ms)
Rotary 3: Feedback
Rotary 4: Dry / Wet
Button 1: Sync (toggles between steps or milliseconds)


.
dry_wet.zip


.
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dvdrtldg
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Post 06 Dec 2019

Ostermilk wrote: ↑
06 Dec 2019
THIS^^^

One of the most eloquently implemented RE's in the entire store. I wish Groovy Melon had made more devices but this is my longest time favourite freebie in the shop.
It's good, but it doesn't always work as a wet/dry because of the reasons mentioned by Selig above. With some FX you're going to get crazy phasing/comb filtering

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EsotericSound
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Post 07 Dec 2019

Years ago, before the introduction to Rack Extensions, Nucleus Soundlab was putting out a series of tutorial videos called Reason Wizardry. These were very well done. I forget which video it was, but one of them covered how to make an equal power crossfade inside the conbinator using audio splitting and the Line 6 mixer. I remember he mentioned making this as a way to create a dry/wet control for effects that did not have one.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7beuF ... hei2z3oEQA

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selig
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Post 08 Dec 2019

EsotericSound wrote: ↑
07 Dec 2019
Years ago, before the introduction to Rack Extensions, Nucleus Soundlab was putting out a series of tutorial videos called Reason Wizardry. These were very well done. I forget which video it was, but one of them covered how to make an equal power crossfade inside the conbinator using audio splitting and the Line 6 mixer. I remember he mentioned making this as a way to create a dry/wet control for effects that did not have one.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7beuF ... hei2z3oEQA
The problem with that approach is that it creates a -6dB crossfade (due to the -6 dB pan laws used by the older Reason mixers), which makes the audio "dip" in the middle position.

The Groovy Melon RE is free and has many useful crossfade options.
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EsotericSound
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Post 08 Dec 2019

selig wrote: ↑
08 Dec 2019


The problem with that approach is that it creates a -6dB crossfade (due to the -6 dB pan laws used by the older Reason mixers), which makes the audio "dip" in the middle position.

The Groovy Melon RE is free and has many useful crossfade options.
Huh. I never paid attention to that before. Learn something new everyday. :puf_smile: Thanks for that bit of info.

groggy1
Posts: 463
Joined: 10 Jun 2015

Post 08 Dec 2019

Boombastix wrote: ↑
06 Dec 2019
rcbuse wrote: ↑
05 Dec 2019


Your best bet is a parallel mix bus, this should use any plugin's delay compensation information. Many FX will introduce a few samples of delay or some phase shifting / inversion. If you straight mix the pre-RE signal with an post-RE signal, you are likely to have some wacky phase cancellation / comb filtering going on.
Like Panda says, potential delay comp issues. READ this section in the manual, it will tell you under what circumstances delay compensation is NOT done.
Thanks for the reminder on delay compensation edge-cases. I always forgot about this

Busta US
Posts: 160
Joined: 26 Oct 2019

Post 08 Dec 2019

EpiGenetik wrote: ↑
05 Dec 2019
Strictly speaking no, an FX device might not have a dry/wet, and there’s no guarantee that you can access a dry/wet controller via CV.

That said, if you split a signal in 2, so that one goes out dry and the other to the fx processor then you can merge and cross fade them using a free RE called Morfin Crossfader. It also has a few curves onboard to make things easier 😊
oooo thanks for this I will check this right now :) :thumbs_up:

Busta US
Posts: 160
Joined: 26 Oct 2019

Post 08 Dec 2019


Busta US
Posts: 160
Joined: 26 Oct 2019

Post 08 Dec 2019

rcbuse wrote: ↑
05 Dec 2019
Busta US wrote: ↑
05 Dec 2019
Is it technically possible to create an RE that serves only as a Dry/Wet knob for the effect that you connect it to? For instance connect it to Skream or Alligator and be able to control the fx' dry/wet signal ?

Can it be done inside Reason?

Thx guys
Your best bet is a parallel mix bus, this should use any plugin's delay compensation information. Many FX will introduce a few samples of delay or some phase shifting / inversion. If you straight mix the pre-RE signal with an post-RE signal, you are likely to have some wacky phase cancellation / comb filtering going on.
OK I see what you're saying. Thx for the info :thumbs_up:

Busta US
Posts: 160
Joined: 26 Oct 2019

Post 08 Dec 2019

Proboscis wrote: ↑
06 Dec 2019
Busta US wrote: ↑
05 Dec 2019
Is it technically possible to create an RE that serves only as a Dry/Wet knob for the effect that you connect it to? For instance connect it to Skream or Alligator and be able to control the fx' dry/wet signal ?
Your post gave me an idea, so thanks for that. Whether this inspires you to create something for yourself to use for your purposes, well let us know !

Using a Combinator:

1. Add a 14:2 mixer
2. Add A Spider Splitter and a DDL-1 Delay (hold down shift so the don't auto route)
3. Add your Instrument

Now, take the output of your synth and route to the input jack. Then take one audio out pair to channel 1 of the mixer. Then use the second splitter output, route that to the DDL-1, then take the DDL-1 output into channel 2 of the mixer.

Set the DDL-1's dry/wet to hard right (ie; fully wet)

Here is a songfile with a Combinator(and I have included an alligator on Return #2), where it's possible to control the wet signal to trigger wherever you want in the bar, either in steps or milliseconds, and I have programmed the controls as follows:

Rotary 1: Time (sync)
Rotary 2: Time (ms)
Rotary 3: Feedback
Rotary 4: Dry / Wet
Button 1: Sync (toggles between steps or milliseconds)


.
dry_wet.zip



.
I'm glad it did and you're welcome :D Thank you very much for the step-by-step guide as well as the zip file I will follow your guide :thumbup:

Busta US
Posts: 160
Joined: 26 Oct 2019

Post 08 Dec 2019

EsotericSound wrote: ↑
07 Dec 2019
Years ago, before the introduction to Rack Extensions, Nucleus Soundlab was putting out a series of tutorial videos called Reason Wizardry. These were very well done. I forget which video it was, but one of them covered how to make an equal power crossfade inside the conbinator using audio splitting and the Line 6 mixer. I remember he mentioned making this as a way to create a dry/wet control for effects that did not have one.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7beuF ... hei2z3oEQA
Thank you for the Youtube link I will check his videos then! They seem pretty advanced :thumbs_up:

Busta US
Posts: 160
Joined: 26 Oct 2019

Post 08 Dec 2019

Thank you all for your input and feedback!

Proboscis
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Post 08 Dec 2019

Busta US wrote: ↑
08 Dec 2019
Thank you very much for the step-by-step guide
Out of interest, are you new to Reason ? I saw a thread where you mentioned you had just bought R11. If this is your first time - it's well worth getting your head around the mighty Combinator. By using it (and having a 14:2 mixer within) you can layer instruments, independently control the gain, panning and basic EQ for each, and add AUX FX to build your own super-synth that is completely unique. Or... you can even use a Combinator to create your own epic FX units, where you can build anything that your imagination allows. Combinator patches can also be saved for future use

Proboscis
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Post 08 Dec 2019

EsotericSound wrote: ↑
07 Dec 2019
Years ago, before the introduction to Rack Extensions, Nucleus Soundlab was putting out a series of tutorial videos called Reason Wizardry.
Adding to this - The 'Filter Research' series of ReFills are some of the more incredible Combinator FX out there. They are not cheap, but if Jeremy has a free demo pack showcasing some of these, it's of great value to deconstruct what's going on as a reference point to build some DIY FX

For other great general tips, especially for those just starting out, the '52 Reasons' youtube video series is gold.


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EpiGenetik
Posts: 402
Joined: 19 Jan 2015
Location: Glasgow, EU

Post 10 Dec 2019

rcbuse wrote: ↑
05 Dec 2019
Your best bet is a parallel mix bus, this should use any plugin's delay compensation information. Many FX will introduce a few samples of delay or some phase shifting / inversion. If you straight mix the pre-RE signal with an post-RE signal, you are likely to have some wacky phase cancellation / comb filtering going on.
This^^^

Kinda thing I tend to engineer as I'm going along if I'm honest, rather than thinking of it beforehand :puf_bigsmile:

Busta US
Posts: 160
Joined: 26 Oct 2019

Post 10 Dec 2019

Proboscis wrote: ↑
08 Dec 2019
Out of interest, are you new to Reason ? I saw a thread where you mentioned you had just bought R11.
Yes I use Logic and Fl Studio mainly but Reason's soundscape possibilities and UI are making me want to stay more in it. I'm experimenting and I'd like to be able to fully finish a song in it :)
Proboscis wrote: ↑
08 Dec 2019
If this is your first time - it's well worth getting your head around the mighty Combinator. By using it (and having a 14:2 mixer within) you can layer instruments, independently control the gain, panning and basic EQ for each, and add AUX FX to build your own super-synth that is completely unique. Or... you can even use a Combinator to create your own epic FX units, where you can build anything that your imagination allows. Combinator patches can also be saved for future use
I...did not know about that...OK this has opened endless possibilities in my mind right now :o

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Creativemind
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Location: Stoke-On-Trent, England, UK

Post 11 Dec 2019

Couldn't you just add the effect as a send and then the send amount on the mixer channel will act as a dry / wet?
:reason:

Reason Studio's 11.3 / Cockos Reaper 6.64 / Cakewalk By Bandlab / Orion 8.6
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Loque
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Post 11 Dec 2019

Creativemind wrote: ↑
11 Dec 2019
Couldn't you just add the effect as a send and then the send amount on the mixer channel will act as a dry / wet?
Its separated dry and wet control. Something i would prefer.
Reason12, Win10

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