Sequences from Robotic Bean - 1.1 is out!

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buddard
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Post 11 May 2019

artotaku wrote:
10 May 2019
Feature request: During step recording and while run/play is off, it should be possible to change the length of the recorded step, thus advancing the playhead by the step length. This step length property should also be remotable.
Have you tried mapping a button to "Advance/Erase Notes"? Because if you Advance while holding notes, it will advance the playhead and extend the held notes at the same time!

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buddard
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Post 11 May 2019

Creativemind wrote:
09 May 2019
Can you change the grid resolutuon? I needed to put a note in between where the grid resolutuon was currently set to if you get me and...
You can change the playback rate, but the grid is always 32 steps.
Would it be possible to get ctrl a to work to select all in the currently selected pattern in a future release?
RE's can't respond to keyboard commands, sorry... We can only read Cmd/Ctrl, Alt and Shift buttons while the mouse is being clicked, held or released.

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ljekio
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Post 11 May 2019

buddard wrote:
11 May 2019
tanni wrote:
10 May 2019
I have a question:
Have all 8 pattern buttons Remote control option, so I can switch them directly from 8 pads from my AKAI MPK2 Keyboard ?
"Pattern Select" is a single Remote object, that currently goes from -1 (no pattern selected) up to 7 (pattern #8).
This is built into Reason.
If RE able changing pattrens by cv input then this is my feature suggestion here :)
(But i know about remote through combinator :))

tanni
Posts: 95
Joined: 19 Jul 2015

Post 11 May 2019

buddard wrote:
11 May 2019
tanni wrote:
10 May 2019
I have a question:
Have all 8 pattern buttons Remote control option, so I can switch them directly from 8 pads from my AKAI MPK2 Keyboard ?
"Pattern Select" is a single Remote object, that currently goes from -1 (no pattern selected) up to 7 (pattern #8).
This is built into Reason.
So, there is no chance to switch the patterns directly in live situations from a controller. Exactly behavior like in the Drumsequencer from Propellerheads. Thats a shame, because it makes no sense to change patterns only in order up and downwards. If you want to switch from pattern 3 to pattern 7 and back to pattern 2 thats all not possible from a controller directly. you have to switch pattern up and backwards until you reach the right pattern....What a failure from Propellerheads to implement this in that way. Even the old devices like Matrix or Redrum can do this.
These advantages were backwards the reason, I switch from cubase to Reason.
So, in this way it makes no sense for me to use these players, sorry.
Now, steinberg has this amazing crossgrade... I think it over, because I think meanwhile at all, that propellerheads leave more and more their old line.

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buddard
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Post 11 May 2019

tanni wrote:
11 May 2019
buddard wrote:
11 May 2019


"Pattern Select" is a single Remote object, that currently goes from -1 (no pattern selected) up to 7 (pattern #8).
This is built into Reason.
So, there is no chance to switch the patterns directly in live situations from a controller. Exactly behavior like in the Drumsequencer from Propellerheads. Thats a shame, because it makes no sense to change patterns only in order up and downwards. If you want to switch from pattern 3 to pattern 7 and back to pattern 2 thats all not possible from a controller directly. you have to switch pattern up and backwards until you reach the right pattern....What a failure from Propellerheads to implement this in that way. Even the old devices like Matrix or Redrum can do this.
These advantages were backwards the reason, I switch from cubase to Reason.
So, in this way it makes no sense for me to use these players, sorry.
Now, steinberg has this amazing crossgrade... I think it over, because I think meanwhile at all, that propellerheads leave more and more their old line.
I think that a great and more generic solution would be if you could create a mapping from a button or pad to a combination of a Remote object and a specific value, for example:

Map pad 1 to "Pattern Select", value = 0
Map pad 2 to "Pattern Select", value = 1
...

This way, you could for example map different waveforms on a synth to different buttons/pads on your controller, without intervention from the developer.

This wouldn't be easy to do "on the fly" in Remote Override Edit mode in a satisfying way, but perhaps on the Remote Codec level?

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artotaku
Posts: 437
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Location: Munich, Germany

Post 11 May 2019

buddard wrote:
11 May 2019
artotaku wrote:
10 May 2019
Feature request: During step recording and while run/play is off, it should be possible to change the length of the recorded step, thus advancing the playhead by the step length. This step length property should also be remotable.
Have you tried mapping a button to "Advance/Erase Notes"? Because if you Advance while holding notes, it will advance the playhead and extend the held notes at the same time!
There you go. This works. Cool, thanks :-)

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artotaku
Posts: 437
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Location: Munich, Germany

Post 11 May 2019

buddard wrote:
11 May 2019
tanni wrote:
11 May 2019


So, there is no chance to switch the patterns directly in live situations from a controller. Exactly behavior like in the Drumsequencer from Propellerheads. Thats a shame, because it makes no sense to change patterns only in order up and downwards. If you want to switch from pattern 3 to pattern 7 and back to pattern 2 thats all not possible from a controller directly. you have to switch pattern up and backwards until you reach the right pattern....What a failure from Propellerheads to implement this in that way. Even the old devices like Matrix or Redrum can do this.
These advantages were backwards the reason, I switch from cubase to Reason.
So, in this way it makes no sense for me to use these players, sorry.
Now, steinberg has this amazing crossgrade... I think it over, because I think meanwhile at all, that propellerheads leave more and more their old line.
I think that a great and more generic solution would be if you could create a mapping from a button or pad to a combination of a Remote object and a specific value, for example:

Map pad 1 to "Pattern Select", value = 0
Map pad 2 to "Pattern Select", value = 1
...

This way, you could for example map different waveforms on a synth to different buttons/pads on your controller, without intervention from the developer.

This wouldn't be easy to do "on the fly" in Remote Override Edit mode in a satisfying way, but perhaps on the Remote Codec level?
Props "old" pattern based devices such like Redrum offered both ways to select a pattern by remote - either by an index remote item or by an individual trigger remote item for each pattern. So in Redrum it is "Selected Pattern" which is the index from -1 to 31 and "Pattern 1 ..." which is a trigger.

I suppose this has been done to make it easy to map pads/buttons of a midi controller without the need to add some custom logic into the remote codec or remotemap file of the midi controller to map a "button group" to an index value as you described above.

With players (Props own devices included), I only see the index item approach. The question is if a RE developer could add its own trigger properties to trigger individual patterns and expose them as remotable items (so these are mapped to the index property internally).

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ljekio
Posts: 646
Joined: 21 Jan 2015

Post 11 May 2019

tanni wrote:
11 May 2019
buddard wrote:
11 May 2019


"Pattern Select" is a single Remote object, that currently goes from -1 (no pattern selected) up to 7 (pattern #8).
This is built into Reason.
So, there is no chance to switch the patterns directly in live situations from a controller. Exactly behavior like in the Drumsequencer from Propellerheads. Thats a shame, because it makes no sense to change patterns only in order up and downwards. If you want to switch from pattern 3 to pattern 7 and back to pattern 2 thats all not possible from a controller directly. you have to switch pattern up and backwards until you reach the right pattern....What a failure from Propellerheads to implement this in that way. Even the old devices like Matrix or Redrum can do this.
Isn't correct. You CAN control pattern's switch from same controller and from keyboard/pads.

As example this way:
Keyboard Pattern Switch.zip
(Control pattern notes from C0 to B0 here. It can be change.
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artotaku
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Location: Munich, Germany

Post 11 May 2019

ljekio wrote:
11 May 2019
tanni wrote:
11 May 2019


So, there is no chance to switch the patterns directly in live situations from a controller. Exactly behavior like in the Drumsequencer from Propellerheads. Thats a shame, because it makes no sense to change patterns only in order up and downwards. If you want to switch from pattern 3 to pattern 7 and back to pattern 2 thats all not possible from a controller directly. you have to switch pattern up and backwards until you reach the right pattern....What a failure from Propellerheads to implement this in that way. Even the old devices like Matrix or Redrum can do this.
Isn't correct. You CAN control pattern's switch from same controller and from keyboard/pads.

As example this way:
Keyboard Pattern Switch.zip
(Control pattern notes from C0 to B0 here. It can be change.
The "holy" CV Switch/CV8x4 to the rescue ;) I don´t remember how often I used these devices to make quantized pattern switch behaviour possible.

seqoi
Posts: 316
Joined: 12 Aug 2017

Post 11 May 2019

It's perfect for what it is! Just perfect.

Please don't make it 64 step so font will be ultra tiny and please don't add next 4850 features. This is perfect device. Sure there is room for improvement and new features and there is even room on gui itself for that (i see empty slots). For everything else (as 64 step) users can do creative routing and automation (2x32 Sequencers can provide you 64 step)

Just don't ruin it with "i can do all" features because it will kill workflow and magic behind this neat Rack player. But i am positive you already knew that.

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Creativemind
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Location: Stoke-On-Trent, England, UK

Post 11 May 2019

buddard wrote:
11 May 2019
Creativemind wrote:
09 May 2019
Can you change the grid resolution? I needed to put a note in between where the grid resolution was currently set to if you get me and...
You can change the playback rate, but the grid is always 32 steps.
Would it be possible to get ctrl a to work to select all in the currently selected pattern in a future release?
RE's can't respond to keyboard commands, sorry... We can only read Cmd/Ctrl, Alt and Shift buttons while the mouse is being clicked, held or released.
OK thanks.

I was hoping this would be able to work for a Cloning / Aliasing Clips thing but with the grid always being fixed you can't always place notes where you want as you would need to change the grid resolution in some scenarios. Like the other day, I wanted the note to start in between 2 of the steps. That was the loop I wanted so sadly this can't work for this. :(

There's other issues with it being used as a midi editor type thing too. The ctrl / a thing I mentioned and not being able to zoom in and out (makes it fiddly tryna select all the notes in a chord when it spans large octave ranges) and the fact that it starts to interfere with how the midi editor works as you have to remember 2 different ways of dealing with midi notes and I could see it kinda getting confusing having 2 different ways (for me anyway) like if you use 2 daws at a certain period of time and one midi editor works in 1 way and another works in another way and you start to forget which one acts which way as regards editing and how notes are manipulated etc etc
:reason:

Propellerhead Reason 10.4 / Cockus Reaper 5.978 / Cakewalk By Bandlab / Steinberg Cubase LE 5
http://soundcloud.com/creativemind75/iv ... soul-mix-3

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buddard
Posts: 651
Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 11 May 2019

Creativemind wrote:
11 May 2019
I was hoping this would be able to work for a Cloning / Aliasing Clips thing but with the grid always being fixed you can't always place notes where you want as you would need to change the grid resolution in some scenarios. Like the other day, I wanted the note to start in between 2 of the steps. That was the loop I wanted so sadly this can't work for this. :(
We're not trying to replicate note clips exactly, we wanted to make a simplified version that's faster to work with. So the grid will stay fixed, although you can play it back at different speeds of course, and with a separate speed multiplier (0.5x, 1x, 2x) for each pattern.

But it's not impossible that we add menu commands for doubling or halving the distance between the notes. So if you have a pattern that's 16 steps long, and you need "notes between the notes", we could "explode" the pattern to 32 steps instead.
There's other issues with it being used as a midi editor type thing too. The ctrl / a thing I mentioned and not being able to zoom in and out (makes it fiddly tryna select all the notes in a chord when it spans large octave ranges) and the fact that it starts to interfere with how the midi editor works as you have to remember 2 different ways of dealing with midi notes and I could see it kinda getting confusing having 2 different ways (for me anyway) like if you use 2 daws at a certain period of time and one midi editor works in 1 way and another works in another way and you start to forget which one acts which way as regards editing and how notes are manipulated etc etc
Well, some things simply can't be done in an RE (like the key commands), but the editing actions that we do support, like Cmd-click/double-click to create notes, Alt-drag to copy, selection box to select multiple notes and toggle selection, etc, work exactly like in a Reason note clip. So I don't think that saying that they work in two completely different ways is an honest description?

Again, Sequences is not supposed to be a complete replacement of note clips (or you could use actual note clips instead), we were aiming more for a fast/easy/fun/inspiring way to create melodies in Reason, like a Matrix++. So of course it's not for everyone. :puf_smile:

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buddard
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Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 11 May 2019

seqoi wrote:
11 May 2019
It's perfect for what it is! Just perfect.

Please don't make it 64 step so font will be ultra tiny and please don't add next 4850 features. This is perfect device. Sure there is room for improvement and new features and there is even room on gui itself for that (i see empty slots). For everything else (as 64 step) users can do creative routing and automation (2x32 Sequencers can provide you 64 step)

Just don't ruin it with "i can do all" features because it will kill workflow and magic behind this neat Rack player. But i am positive you already knew that.
No worries, we won't ruin it! :D

Most new stuff will go into the reserved lane boxes and into the Tools menu, and aside from that we might add some workflow improvements and additions.

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buddard
Posts: 651
Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 11 May 2019

artotaku wrote:
11 May 2019
The question is if a RE developer could add its own trigger properties to trigger individual patterns and expose them as remotable items (so these are mapped to the index property internally).
In short, no, this is not possible. We could of course create separate trigger properties, but they would "compete" with Pattern Select, and they could not both be represented by the same buttons.
So we would have to sacrifice Alt-to-automate, and we would add lots of extra confusion for users, only to cater to a relatively small portion of the user base, who would probably not be happy with the final implementation either... :|

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dusan.cani
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Location: Slovakia

Post 11 May 2019

buddard wrote:
11 May 2019
dusan.cani wrote:
10 May 2019
Why is there only 8 patterns ? It's not enough for whole song arrangement needs. The native Reason pattern devices have 8 x 4 patterns which is really sufficient. I find quite unfcomfortable to use another device only for additional patterns. Hm...
Mainly due to panel space constraints, and that we thought 8 would be enough. But it's not impossible to add more patterns in the future if we come up with a good way to present them.
Thank you for the answer.

electrofux
Posts: 612
Joined: 21 Jan 2015

Post 11 May 2019

buddard wrote:
11 May 2019
Creativemind wrote:
11 May 2019
I was hoping this would be able to work for a Cloning / Aliasing Clips thing but with the grid always being fixed you can't always place notes where you want as you would need to change the grid resolution in some scenarios. Like the other day, I wanted the note to start in between 2 of the steps. That was the loop I wanted so sadly this can't work for this. :(
We're not trying to replicate note clips exactly, we wanted to make a simplified version that's faster to work with. So the grid will stay fixed, although you can play it back at different speeds of course, and with a separate speed multiplier (0.5x, 1x, 2x) for each pattern.

But it's not impossible that we add menu commands for doubling or halving the distance between the notes. So if you have a pattern that's 16 steps long, and you need "notes between the notes", we could "explode" the pattern to 32 steps instead.

Maybe the slide parameter could be made a per step parameter?

tanni
Posts: 95
Joined: 19 Jul 2015

Post 11 May 2019

tanni wrote:
11 May 2019
buddard wrote:
11 May 2019


"Pattern Select" is a single Remote object, that currently goes from -1 (no pattern selected) up to 7 (pattern #8).
This is built into Reason.
So, there is no chance to switch the patterns directly in live situations from a controller. Exactly behavior like in the Drumsequencer from Propellerheads. Thats a shame, because it makes no sense to change patterns only in order up and downwards. If you want to switch from pattern 3 to pattern 7 and back to pattern 2 thats all not possible from a controller directly. you have to switch pattern up and backwards until you reach the right pattern....What a failure from Propellerheads to implement this in that way. Even the old devices like Matrix or Redrum can do this.
These advantages were backwards the reason, I switch from cubase to Reason.
So, in this way it makes no sense for me to use these players, sorry.
Now, steinberg has this amazing crossgrade... I think it over, because I think meanwhile at all, that propellerheads leave more and more their old line.
Thank you guys for all your comments to this.

I though today over and over and.....I think I have found a good workaround for the pattern adress-directly- problem !
I have a Matrix CURVE CV Output routed to the Rotary 1 Combinator Input. Then programmed the Rotary 1 in the programmer to a player device in the combinator (pattern select (1-8)). Then programmed the first 8 patterns from the Matrix (A1-A8) on different curve values, which correspond with the values from the Rotary 1. Voila, now I can remote the pattern of the Matrix from my controller keyboard pads. 8 pads for 8 patterns. Now I can switch the Matrix pattern and the player pattern follows !! Nice, it works !!! I can record the pattern switches from the Matrix in sync to a track of the sequencer....you can also switch direct record on the player and record so the notes directly on a sequencer track, all in sync ! thats what I want to have.
Man, how many hours I brood over this.... :)

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buddard
Posts: 651
Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 11 May 2019

tanni wrote:
11 May 2019
I though today over and over and.....I think I have found a good workaround for the pattern adress-directly- problem !
I have a Matrix CURVE CV Output routed to the Rotary 1 Combinator Input. Then programmed the Rotary 1 in the programmer to a player device in the combinator (pattern select (1-8)). Then programmed the first 8 patterns from the Matrix (A1-A8) on different curve values, which correspond with the values from the Rotary 1. Voila, now I can remote the pattern of the Matrix from my controller keyboard pads. 8 pads for 8 patterns. Now I can switch the Matrix pattern and the player pattern follows !! Nice, it works !!! I can record the pattern switches from the Matrix in sync to a track of the sequencer....you can also switch direct record on the player and record so the notes directly on a sequencer track, all in sync ! thats what I want to have.
Man, how many hours I brood over this.... :)
Wow, that's a pretty neat solution!

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mjxl
Posts: 337
Joined: 23 Nov 2018

Post 12 May 2019

This one is frickin amazing Bean !

I've put an RND in front of sequence, let it run 3 loops to (RND on 1/8) to get 3 random notes for each chord in the sequence:
Sequences.png
Then after recording those, i've moved RND behind Sequences and put the Midi note change probability on 10/15ish% for some variations, lovely !! :D
(ofc a Scales & Chords at the end to catch the notes in a scale)

Also putting a DualArp at the end it becomes a always evolving arpeggio.. super neat !
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
:reason: 10+ :re:

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dioxide
Posts: 1105
Joined: 15 Jul 2015

Post 12 May 2019

tanni wrote:
11 May 2019
tanni wrote:
11 May 2019


So, there is no chance to switch the patterns directly in live situations from a controller. Exactly behavior like in the Drumsequencer from Propellerheads. Thats a shame, because it makes no sense to change patterns only in order up and downwards. If you want to switch from pattern 3 to pattern 7 and back to pattern 2 thats all not possible from a controller directly. you have to switch pattern up and backwards until you reach the right pattern....What a failure from Propellerheads to implement this in that way. Even the old devices like Matrix or Redrum can do this.
These advantages were backwards the reason, I switch from cubase to Reason.
So, in this way it makes no sense for me to use these players, sorry.
Now, steinberg has this amazing crossgrade... I think it over, because I think meanwhile at all, that propellerheads leave more and more their old line.
Thank you guys for all your comments to this.

I though today over and over and.....I think I have found a good workaround for the pattern adress-directly- problem !
I have a Matrix CURVE CV Output routed to the Rotary 1 Combinator Input. Then programmed the Rotary 1 in the programmer to a player device in the combinator (pattern select (1-8)). Then programmed the first 8 patterns from the Matrix (A1-A8) on different curve values, which correspond with the values from the Rotary 1. Voila, now I can remote the pattern of the Matrix from my controller keyboard pads. 8 pads for 8 patterns. Now I can switch the Matrix pattern and the player pattern follows !! Nice, it works !!! I can record the pattern switches from the Matrix in sync to a track of the sequencer....you can also switch direct record on the player and record so the notes directly on a sequencer track, all in sync ! thats what I want to have.
Man, how many hours I brood over this.... :)
This is more or less what I do too, except I use one of the CV inputs. If Sequences had a CV input for Pattern Selection, you could do this without all the fuss of Combinator mapping.

As a bonus you get the Pattern On function of the Matrix which allows you to latch patterns on and off, starting at the next bar.

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diminished
Posts: 929
Joined: 15 Dec 2018

Post 12 May 2019

Honestly, all that talk about features that might be added in the future reminds me of Steam early access and drives me away from the product. So much functionality depending on other tools :(
This thread should be part of the beta process.
Now grab your pitchforks and hunt me through the village :P

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geronimo
Posts: 365
Joined: 17 Jan 2015
Location: France

Post 12 May 2019

Don't worry; the more the merrier ! :lol:

tanni
Posts: 95
Joined: 19 Jul 2015

Post 12 May 2019

[/quote]
As a bonus you get the Pattern On function of the Matrix which allows you to latch patterns on and off, starting at the next bar.
[/quote]

:thumbs_up: :thumbs_up:

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buddard
Posts: 651
Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 12 May 2019

diminished wrote:
12 May 2019
Honestly, all that talk about features that might be added in the future reminds me of Steam early access and drives me away from the product. So much functionality depending on other tools :(
This thread should be part of the beta process.
Now grab your pitchforks and hunt me through the village :P
In my opinion we released a complete and functional product. If we never got the chance to update it again, I would still be happy with it.
I thought that choosing to leave it open for future developments based on user feedback was a good thing?
But to each their own, I guess!

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buddard
Posts: 651
Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 12 May 2019

mjxl wrote:
12 May 2019
This one is frickin amazing Bean !

I've put an RND in front of sequence, let it run 3 loops to (RND on 1/8) to get 3 random notes for each chord in the sequence:
Sequences.png

Then after recording those, i've moved RND behind Sequences and put the Midi note change probability on 10/15ish% for some variations, lovely !! :D
(ofc a Scales & Chords at the end to catch the notes in a scale)

Also putting a DualArp at the end it becomes a always evolving arpeggio.. super neat !
Video or it didn't happen! ;)

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