Compressors. How many do you really need?

[fullforce]

I need... One MILLION compressors.

[normen]

There is something I don't get in compressor's marketing technique. They always say it's a super fast compressor yeee. But I tend not to use very fast attacks as much as possible. Am I nuts ? It just sounds better to me.

Back in the day it was actually technically hard to make a compressor fast. But now it's more like "this compressor still sounds good with fast attack, yeee". Most compressors get this "pushed back" or "small" sound when you use fast attack. Literally as if they were suppressing the sound - which effectively they do. Some compressors avoid that somehow though, be it by trading in for distortion or phase accuracy or simply timing and curve..

There isn't much data on it, I only saw one paper on this but I think it has a lot to do with how the protection system of our ears work. We have a built-in hardware compressor in our ears to protect us from loud sounds. And I think that has a lot to do with how compressors make something sound "big". Our brain might consider a compressed sound to be louder than it actually is because it "thinks" the ear had to compress it. Obviously these in-ear compressors most probably sound different from person to person (we will never know for sure ) so that might also be an explanation for people preferring different compression styles.

[Marco Raaphorst]

I am a big fan of RMS, variable-mu type compressors. Slow, like fader automation. Super smooth, almost unnoticeable. Often overlooked by many engineers imo.

I would say the LA-2a falls into the "super smooth, almost unnoticeable" camp, but is far from slow. Would you agree, or are you talking about vari-mu exclusively, and not opto types?

Yes LA-2A is great for quick but not pumping compression. And vari-mu is great for slow attack. I am using Klanghelm MJUC most of the time lately.

[NekujaK]

Thank you for this thread, and thak you, Selig, for the detailed and helpful explanation.

I have a selection of go-to compressors I use for specific purposes, but I also get overwhelmed (and sometimes confused) when trying to tease apart the differences between multiple compressors, especially when evaluating a brand new compressor. I guess what throws me the most is when people rave about how awesomely great some new compressor is, and I just can't hear what's so special. Case in point is the Klanghelm MJUC, which is lauded by seemingly everyone, but to me, it doesn't sound particularly special. It's definitely a functional compressor, but is it any "better" than my other 25 compressors? I can't really say.

And I guess this is where I get tripped up. I understand how compressors work and what they do, but to say that one is objectively "better" than another doesn't make much sense to me. Maybe I'm crazy, but for me, a compressor is "good" or even "great" if it simply helps me achieve the sound I want, regardless of brand, price, or hype.

[motuscott]

I think these engineers with a butt load of compressors set and forget, that is to say they get a good setting and that's where they leave it. If it works, fine. If not, on to the next unit. At least this is what I've ascertained from reading interviews with Brauer, Blake et al. I will defer to any actual audio engineers here. I'm not an audio engineer but I play one in my living room

[normen]

I think these engineers with a butt load of compressors set and forget, that is to say they get a good setting and that's where they leave it. If it works, fine. If not, on to the next unit. At least this is what I've ascertained from reading interviews with Brauer, Blake et al. I will defer to any actual audio engineers here. I'm not an audio engineer but I play one in my living room

I think it's true that certain compressors are known for certain combinations of settings that work well for certain things. Like the Dr.Pepper setting for the 1176 and such. That might be a reason for that. I mean nobody uses the limiter mode of the LA-2A so thats literally a one-trick pony. Blessed be the digital age

[Data_Shrine]

There is something I don't get in compressor's marketing technique. They always say it's a super fast compressor yeee. But I tend not to use very fast attacks as much as possible. Am I nuts ? It just sounds better to me.

Back in the day it was actually technically hard to make a compressor fast. But now it's more like "this compressor still sounds good with fast attack, yeee". Most compressors get this "pushed back" or "small" sound when you use fast attack. Literally as if they were suppressing the sound - which effectively they do. Some compressors avoid that somehow though, be it by trading in for distortion or phase accuracy or simply timing and curve..

There isn't much data on it, I only saw one paper on this but I think it has a lot to do with how the protection system of our ears work. We have a built-in hardware compressor in our ears to protect us from loud sounds. And I think that has a lot to do with how compressors make something sound "big". Our brain might consider a compressed sound to be louder than it actually is because it "thinks" the ear had to compress it. Obviously these in-ear compressors most probably sound different from person to person (we will never know for sure ) so that might also be an explanation for people preferring different compression styles.

Thank you that's very interesting. I thought that the "it's a fast compressor!" thing pretty much only related to the possible attack ms settings (I know that all compressors are not made equal, esp. hardware vs digital in ms terms). With a standard compressor I usually the knee to make it hit harder or not, rather than a very fast attack.

[kuhliloach]

2

[BRIGGS]

I need... One MILLION compressors.

[Jmax]

http://www.pspaudioware.com/plugins/dyn ... etpressor/

[Marco Raaphorst]

I am also loving the compressors which are included in my favorite saturation device, the SDRR of Klanghelm: https://klanghelm.com/contents/products/SDRR/SDRR.php

[dvdrtldg]

I am also loving the compressors which are included in my favorite saturation device, the SDRR of Klanghelm: https://klanghelm.com/contents/products/SDRR/SDRR.php

Such a great plugin, as is the MJUC

[C//AZM]

Our brain might consider a compressed sound to be louder than it actually is because it "thinks" the ear had to compress it. Obviously these in-ear compressors most probably sound different from person to person (we will never know for sure ) so that might also be an explanation for people preferring different compression styles.

Well there's less dynamic range, and the quiet stuff is louder and closer to the volume of the louder stuff, so it's perceived as louder because there's more "stuff" that can be heard. Maybe that's the psychoacoustic part of it. ; If we can hear a singer breathing, then it must be very loud.

[Marco Raaphorst]

I am also loving the compressors which are included in my favorite saturation device, the SDRR of Klanghelm: https://klanghelm.com/contents/products/SDRR/SDRR.php

Such a great plugin, as is the MJUC

Yes MJUC is my fav compressor !

[Marco Raaphorst]

Our brain might consider a compressed sound to be louder than it actually is because it "thinks" the ear had to compress it. Obviously these in-ear compressors most probably sound different from person to person (we will never know for sure ) so that might also be an explanation for people preferring different compression styles.

Well there's less dynamic range, and the quiet stuff is louder and closer to the volume of the louder stuff, so it's perceived as louder because there's more "stuff" that can be heard. Maybe that's the psychoacoustic part of it. ; If we can hear a singer breathing, then it must be very loud.

Yes RMS goes up. Less dynamic is often felt as louder.

[selig]

Our brain might consider a compressed sound to be louder than it actually is because it "thinks" the ear had to compress it. Obviously these in-ear compressors most probably sound different from person to person (we will never know for sure ) so that might also be an explanation for people preferring different compression styles.

Well there's less dynamic range, and the quiet stuff is louder and closer to the volume of the louder stuff, so it's perceived as louder because there's more "stuff" that can be heard. Maybe that's the psychoacoustic part of it. ; If we can hear a singer breathing, then it must be very loud.

And to add to that, I’ve always assumed that if we can “hear” a sound compress, it must be REALLY loud because only loud sounds make our ears compress.

It’s the same effect as when something gets so bright on screen that it “whites out” (basically clips) like our eyes do, making us believe it’s brighter than it is (especially if it follows a mostly dark scene).

Speaking of film AND really loud sounds, ever notice the sound design after a big explosion when the perspective is first person POV? Everything gets muffled and there’s a high pitch ringing for a few seconds/minutes. If anyone’s ever experienced that, or anything close to it, you’ll recognize the effect immediately!


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[selig]

Well there's less dynamic range, and the quiet stuff is louder and closer to the volume of the louder stuff, so it's perceived as louder because there's more "stuff" that can be heard. Maybe that's the psychoacoustic part of it. ; If we can hear a singer breathing, then it must be very loud.

Yes RMS goes up. Less dynamic is often felt as louder.

Less dynamic, yes. But “compressed”, not always. With slow attack and fast release at a high ratio and low threshold, RMS often does not go up and may even go down with extreme settings.

BTW, you have me very interested in demoing the Klangheim plugins…


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[C//AZM]

In answering the OP's question, I was gonna say all I need is a lot of 1176s, and LA2As and I'm good! But then the Distressor which is a gift to all mankind popped up in my mind . Then there's the Neve 33609 Stereo bus compressor which glues a mix together. Oh and the DBX 160 (the old one) which is so good on drums that I never got around to using it on anything else since it's already being used on kick and snare.


In Plug-in world; I follow my HW preferences because #crotchetyoldman... BUT I use the Waves Renaissance comp all the time, It's a lot like the Mclass comp in reason in that it's a no fuss comp without a lot of sonic signature....unlike the secret weapon "P".

If they made the Pulveriser into a HW unit, I would already own at least two of them. It's got so much WTF-ness that it's a golden weapon for us Reason heads!

Klangenhelm DC1A FREE is my favorite free plug and the MJUC is great with a good price

The FET has a sonic sig that I love and use a lot. The Slate plugins are fantastic and have a lot of character and get at the essence of the HW they're trying to emulate..not exact, but they seem to not worry about faithful emulations as much as capturing and accentuating the mojo that people love about that specific gear.

UAD Compressors are wonderful...except for the fact that we ain't never gonna use them in Reason other than via some convoluted patch sequence involving light pipe, crack pipe and a young priest and an old nun.

Selig Leveler on vocs. I've even imported into Reason, used leveler and exported back out. The only problem with the Levelor is that it's not an obvious device. Unlike other compressors, you don't crank it up and see the magic. It's a surgical device that you don't really notice till much later in the mixing process..."why does this vocal take clearer and more present than the aux take? oh right" It's like using bleach on white clothes and then seven months later comparing two white shirts.

The other comps which emulate HW are also useful but here. I'm mentioning the favs.

Oh and Mace.

[selig]

In answering the OP's question, I was gonna say all I need is a lot of 1176s, and LA2As and I'm good! But then the Distressor which is a gift to all mankind popped up in my mind . Then there's the Neve 33609 Stereo bus compressor which glues a mix together. Oh and the DBX 160 (the old one) which is so good on drums that I never got around to using it on anything else since it's already being used on kick and snare.…

+1 to everything you said.
Man, just gotta say we think a LOT alike. It’s a little scary…




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[djadalaide]

Its not the only thing i use to alter dynamics, i use preamps, tape sims, tubes, limiters and any kind of distortion.
A lot of these are like compression, not the same.. but have an effect on dynamics and/or coloration.

[Hauser+Quaid]

Need? One, maybe two.

Want? ALL OF THEM!!

[Kalm]

Man if yo want to learn the compressors, take one compressor and attempt tweaking all your necessary instances with that one only. You'll soon learn the character and reason why compressors are different, including their recovery, response times, transient detection, distortion, curves, and anything else that's not based on a ratio, attack, and release. I only use three in Reason. McDsp Moo Tube (which people either underrate or can't use), Synapse 160 emulation, and the SSL Bus Comp. I have to check out the other models but i just haven't needed anymore.

[Zac]

2

Prior to r6 this was true? From a choice of conp01 and mclass comp. Oh and Scream... actually does very nice compression.

[Loque]

2

Prior to r6 this was true? From a choice of conp01 and mclass comp. Oh and Scream... actually does very nice compression.

Yea, Scream4 is still very good. I like the RM, tape compression and lofi very much...

[normen]

Man if yo want to learn the compressors, take one compressor and attempt tweaking all your necessary instances with that one only. You'll soon learn the character and reason why compressors are different, including their recovery, response times, transient detection, distortion, curves, and anything else that's not based on a ratio, attack, and release. I only use three in Reason. McDsp Moo Tube (which people either underrate or can't use), Synapse 160 emulation, and the SSL Bus Comp. I have to check out the other models but i just haven't needed anymore.

This is a great tip - for more than just compressors. You will only know WHY you might want a certain device when you experienced the limits of others.