Any Sampler REs in the making?

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kitekrazy
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03 Jan 2018

QVprod wrote:
23 Dec 2017
hurricane wrote:
23 Dec 2017


The world would be shitty if only UVI workstation existed wouldn't it? OPTIONS, I want sampler OPTIONS.I'm tired of using the NNXT. Do you only have one pair of shoes?
UVI workstation isn't a sampler. It's a sample player similar to the IDT or Kontakt Player. Even if it was a sampler the sound wouldn't be any different. Loading samples is loading samples. Unlike synths having multiple samplers only makes sense if they provide functions that other samplers you have do not such as the differences between Kontakt (full version) and the NNXT. But seeing as a Kontakt level sampling RE is highly unlikely (hence the IDT), I believe the question is valid. What do you want in a sampler that Grain and NNXT aren't capable of?

even suggesting something like Tal Sampler might would have been acceptable (couldn't remember it at the time), but again, it has functions that the NNXT doesn't. Simply saying you want "OPTIONS" isn't actually saying much
You'd be surprised that it can be used for a sampler.

kitekrazy
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03 Jan 2018

chaosroyale wrote:
28 Dec 2017
Kontakt is great for libraries, but is heavy, and very slow to program when doing original sampling and designing sounds.

NN-XT is very much faster to use, but lacks many rudimentary features.

An updated NN-XXXXT with just the features I listed above would be quicker and more intuitive than Kontakt, with enough power for *most* uses, and Kontakt could still be the go-to for high power applications.

More to the point, Kontakt is expensive, and Reason is supposed to be an in-the-box solution. If it "doesn't need a sampler" because Kontakt is better, then it certainly doesn't need Europa, because Serum is better, etc etc.
Not for me. I've mapped multi velocity pianos in Kontakt far quicker than the NNXT. The NNXT is clumsy. Kontakt is not expensive when there are crossgrades or part of Komplete. I think anyone serious in music production should have a copy of Kontakt.

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ejanuska
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03 Jan 2018

QVprod wrote:
03 Jan 2018

Yeah the dedicated sample editor in Reason is pretty bad (REs that sample same have the same sample editor IIRC). With the exception of looping, it's better to use the sequencer for the actual editing.

Edit: But that raises the question, do people really want to edit samples on something that fits in the rack? That just seems like such a small space, I would be irritated working with it. Unless RE's get the ability to have pop out windows I can't see sample editing being an improvement with a sampler.
Your right about editing in the sequencer. It's the best place. Which is pitiful.

If a RE version of a sampler had better features built in like a filters, effects, pitch shift, etc., with an editing window I think that would be nice. Imagine a high end synth like Expanse but the source is a sample, not a wave table or oscillator.
I get what they were trying do with NN-XT but I long for some kind of visual indications of what is happening to the actual sample other then the the position of the knobs. Other REs have nice visual windows like GQ-7, Shape, Nostromo etc.

That NN-XT light blue-green over blue-green color scheme? Fucking fail. I get a headache just thinking about it. CONTRAST PLEASE!!!!! You trying to make me blind?

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QVprod
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03 Jan 2018

kitekrazy wrote:
03 Jan 2018
QVprod wrote:
23 Dec 2017


UVI workstation isn't a sampler. It's a sample player similar to the IDT or Kontakt Player. Even if it was a sampler the sound wouldn't be any different. Loading samples is loading samples. Unlike synths having multiple samplers only makes sense if they provide functions that other samplers you have do not such as the differences between Kontakt (full version) and the NNXT. But seeing as a Kontakt level sampling RE is highly unlikely (hence the IDT), I believe the question is valid. What do you want in a sampler that Grain and NNXT aren't capable of?

even suggesting something like Tal Sampler might would have been acceptable (couldn't remember it at the time), but again, it has functions that the NNXT doesn't. Simply saying you want "OPTIONS" isn't actually saying much
You'd be surprised that it can be used for a sampler.
I will say I didn't realize you could load samples into it till you mentioned it. I tried it out it is surprising indeed. The stretching is pretty good, but still pretty limited and functions more like a sample player still since there's no editing capabilities. Provides no real advantages over using Grain from what I can see.

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EnochLight
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03 Jan 2018

ejanuska wrote:
03 Jan 2018
QVprod wrote:
03 Jan 2018

Yeah the dedicated sample editor in Reason is pretty bad (REs that sample same have the same sample editor IIRC). With the exception of looping, it's better to use the sequencer for the actual editing.

Edit: But that raises the question, do people really want to edit samples on something that fits in the rack? That just seems like such a small space, I would be irritated working with it. Unless RE's get the ability to have pop out windows I can't see sample editing being an improvement with a sampler.
Your right about editing in the sequencer. It's the best place. Which is pitiful.

If a RE version of a sampler had better features built in like a filters, effects, pitch shift, etc., with an editing window I think that would be nice. Imagine a high end synth like Expanse but the source is a sample, not a wave table or oscillator.
I get what they were trying do with NN-XT but I long for some kind of visual indications of what is happening to the actual sample other then the the position of the knobs. Other REs have nice visual windows like GQ-7, Shape, Nostromo etc.

That NN-XT light blue-green over blue-green color scheme? Fucking fail. I get a headache just thinking about it. CONTRAST PLEASE!!!!! You trying to make me blind?
I don't have any issue with the way Reason's built-in sample editor is called up, as in - a full-screen pop-out window that all native Reason samplers and RE's can access. This unified approach is smart, and should remain that way IMHO. The issue I have is that it just needs more functions, more tweakability, more fine-tuning ability, etc. Just give us a revised, ramped-up, "pro" level sample editor that can be accessed the exact way that it is now, is all.
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QVprod
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03 Jan 2018

EnochLight wrote:
03 Jan 2018

I don't have any issue with the way Reason's built-in sample editor is called up, as in - a full-screen pop-out window that all native Reason samplers and RE's can access. This unified approach is smart, and should remain that way IMHO. The issue I have is that it just needs more functions, more tweakability, more fine-tuning ability, etc. Just give us a revised, ramped-up, "pro" level sample editor that can be accessed the exact way that it is now, is all.
Now that makes sense to me.

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ejanuska
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03 Jan 2018

EnochLight wrote:
03 Jan 2018

I don't have any issue with the way Reason's built-in sample editor is called up, as in - a full-screen pop-out window that all native Reason samplers and RE's can access. This unified approach is smart, and should remain that way IMHO. The issue I have is that it just needs more functions, more tweakability, more fine-tuning ability, etc. Just give us a revised, ramped-up, "pro" level sample editor that can be accessed the exact way that it is now, is all.
Obviously, there is a demand for a variety of devices and alternate ways to do something.
Why should sample editing be restricted to one method?
Further, I didn't suggest removing the pop-up sample editor, just adding an RE.

dustmoses
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03 Jan 2018

I would like an RE sampler somewhat similar to TAL sampler (because I much prefer REs.)

It should be easy to program and sound good.

Easy to program because I would predict 5 or less refills in the propshop. With VST support only a native reason device would capture enough market support for refill makers to make money for their time (keep in mind the first sample loading RE proton has zero refills AFAIK.)

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QVprod
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03 Jan 2018

ejanuska wrote:
03 Jan 2018
EnochLight wrote:
03 Jan 2018

I don't have any issue with the way Reason's built-in sample editor is called up, as in - a full-screen pop-out window that all native Reason samplers and RE's can access. This unified approach is smart, and should remain that way IMHO. The issue I have is that it just needs more functions, more tweakability, more fine-tuning ability, etc. Just give us a revised, ramped-up, "pro" level sample editor that can be accessed the exact way that it is now, is all.
Obviously, there is a demand for a variety of devices and alternate ways to do something.
Why should sample editing be restricted to one method?
Further, I didn't suggest removing the pop-up sample editor, just adding an RE.
I think the thing is, besides the above suggestion, a sampler RE would need its own pop out window anyway (currently not possible I don’t think) for any serious editing. And if you’re gonna use a pop out window anyway, then why does it need to be a RE when VSTs already do this.

With that in mind, should pop out windows become possible for RE, what advantage would a RE sampler have over a vst sampler aside from the sync all button? To me it seems that from a developer stand point It’d be hard to justify making one.

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EnochLight
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03 Jan 2018

ejanuska wrote:
03 Jan 2018
Obviously, there is a demand for a variety of devices and alternate ways to do something.
Why should sample editing be restricted to one method?
Is it obvious? I didn't really think so. As a unified method that addresses the issue for all devices (like it does now), it keeps things simple and in line with Reason's workflow.
ejanuska wrote:
03 Jan 2018
Further, I didn't suggest removing the pop-up sample editor, just adding an RE.
There's nothing keeping a dev from making an RE that does this right now. RE's can sample. Said RE can have a custom display that allows you to manipulate the sample. Exporting would obviously be the kicker, in its current form. That said, RE's are confined to a max size of 9U, which is way too small for sample editing, IMHO.

So which solution makes more sense from a Reason workflow perspective?

Solution 1: the current unified sample editor window that pops up, full-screen, and allows editing of any sample for all Reason samplers and RE samplers?

Solution 2: an RE that is restricted to 9U rack size.

If you want Solution 2, then you'll also need an updated RE SDK that allows full-screen windows (IMHO) and easier sample export. Good luck with that! ;) I feel Solution 1 is the best option still, IMHO. Just give us more advanced sample editing in the same package, is all.
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Marc Swing
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03 Jan 2018

I would like a sampler where you can add loop points (non destructive slices) like in this video.



And a big point why i would like to have it as a Re is the better integration in the rack + drag n drop samples from the browser.

You could do the design kind of like the Grain where you could easy chop/edit slice points on that waveform edit window + you can zoom in and out on the waveform just like Grain for more precise editing.

Image

When i was on an interview at propellerhead for the upcoming Reason 10 and i saw that Grain and thought it YES FINALLY a new sampler where you can chop/edit slice points i was so happy until i was told i was more like a "sampler player" :(

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EnochLight
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03 Jan 2018

ejanuska wrote:
03 Jan 2018
We don't need a full screen editor, you seem to be happy with that shitty small window that exists, why do you need a huge window now?
You also seem to be blissfully unaware of some things:

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MirEko
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07 Jan 2018

EnochLight wrote:
03 Jan 2018
ejanuska wrote:
03 Jan 2018
We don't need a full screen editor, you seem to be happy with that shitty small window that exists, why do you need a huge window now?
You also seem to be blissfully unaware of some things:

I accidentally clicked your profile when svolling down the page on my phone..
3k+ posts!!
3.5 per day for the the last 3 years o_0
Damn dude
:reason: :record: :re: :ignition: :refill: :PUF_take: :PUF_figure:

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EnochLight
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07 Jan 2018

MirEko wrote:
07 Jan 2018
I accidentally clicked your profile when svolling down the page on my phone..
3k+ posts!!
3.5 per day for the the last 3 years o_0
Damn dude
Just 3.5 per day? I seem to be falling behind! :lol:

memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=5225

memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=5179
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MirEko
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07 Jan 2018

EnochLight wrote:
07 Jan 2018
MirEko wrote:
07 Jan 2018
I accidentally clicked your profile when svolling down the page on my phone..
3k+ posts!!
3.5 per day for the the last 3 years o_0
Damn dude
Just 3.5 per day? I seem to be falling behind! :lol:

memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=5225

memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=5179
But they are Mods :lol:
:reason: :record: :re: :ignition: :refill: :PUF_take: :PUF_figure:

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EnochLight
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07 Jan 2018

MirEko wrote:
07 Jan 2018
EnochLight wrote:
07 Jan 2018


Just 3.5 per day? I seem to be falling behind! :lol:

memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=5225

memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=5179
But they are Mods :lol:
Don’t be jealous. :lol: :lol: :lol:
Win 10 | Ableton Live 11 Suite |  Reason 12 | i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz | 16 GB RAM | RME Babyface Pro | Akai MPC Live 2 & Akai Force | Roland System 8, MX1, TB3 | Dreadbox Typhon | Korg Minilogue XD

chaosroyale
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08 Jan 2018

Fair point. I have a longer history with NN-XT than Kontakt so I might just be more used to navigating around the NN-XT. I do find Kontakt heavier, but that might be because of the current VST implementation in Reason.

Kontakt is expensive though- at least in comparison to "included with your DAW" which is the comparison to make if talking about the NN-XT.

"anyone serious in music production should have a copy of Kontakt." Yup, I fully agree.

kitekrazy wrote:
03 Jan 2018
Not for me. I've mapped multi velocity pianos in Kontakt far quicker than the NNXT. The NNXT is clumsy. Kontakt is not expensive when there are crossgrades or part of Komplete. I think anyone serious in music production should have a copy of Kontakt.

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