Digital Filter very very good

[Theo.M]

Hi guys, have given this plugin:

https://shop.propellerheads.se/product/digital-filter/

a killer workout, and I kept on trying to find ways to make my current filters sound as good (d filter - comes closest, factory stuff, F16, even etch) - and I can't.

The reason being is that sometimes we want to add some resonance and just do a high or low sweep - this is where the others fail because in the case of etch it doesn't have resonance compensation and you have to fiddle with all the in/out/drive on/odd/comp etc to get the original signal as close to the dry signal as possible before sweeping and then you boost resonance and you lose volume, with F16 even though it has a compensation feature, i can never ever get it quite right, and with D filter there is latency in the best sounding mode and this one still sounds a bit superior.

There is zero latency and it just sounds sweet, smooth, and funky to me on all the sources I have tried it on. Also doing a null test when fully open and resonance closed, it has the smallest HF loss of ALL of the filter plugins - it's negligible.

I am still looking for a filter plugin like this that has dry/wet cause I am a bit tired of hooking up crossfader and having to automate two plugins, so that's my request for it and TBH I can't understand why every filter plugin in VST has this feature automatically and in RE they just don't (besides etch). It should be an automatic inclusion. IMO.

So that's my request for this, hope to hear from the dev in this topic, and also his view on bundles/pricing structure so I know whether to bite

[selig]

I remember being a bit confused by the interface on this device when it first came out, which led me to dismiss it instead of critically listen to the filter itself. This is another case for re-trials IMO!

[rcbuse]

Its too bad the developer named it "digital filter". That probably put a lot of people off buy automatically assuming it sounded harsh.

[Benedict]

I recall it sounded fine. Decent even but I have very little use for stand-alone filters. And I too found the interface didn't flow so well and the extra modulation features slightly odd.

[Theo.M]

@rcbuse yep, true.

@ selig/benedict, yep, i initially discarded the trial due to the interface but a few days before expiry I decided to give it a proper whirl and ended up using it a lot. If D filter didn't have such drastic HF loss I would have been happier with that, the cpu of digital was also lower (you can use heaps).. it was also very good for the bass bump trick (resonant HP).

[Rice]

.. it was also very good for the bass bump trick (resonant HP).

Many times you guys mention these different "tricks" without describing what these "tricks" are...many of us have NO clue as to what these "tricks" are and greatly appreciate learning what they are, unless of course these are "secret tricks?" If that be the case, then oh well.

But I for one am always ready to learn more!

[selig]

.. it was also very good for the bass bump trick (resonant HP).

Many times you guys mention these different "tricks" without describing what these "tricks" are...many of us have NO clue as to what these "tricks" are and greatly appreciate learning what they are, unless of course these are "secret tricks?" If that be the case, then oh well.

But I for one am always ready to learn more!

Not sure I'd call it a trick, and I've never had any success with it myself. It's really the same thing as combining a low cut and high Q boost, and I don't find high Q boosts to work well much of the time (especially for low frequencies). Maybe Theo can share how he has managed to use it with good results, which I'd like to know as well!

There is a device called the VOG (voice of god) that was the first place I heard of the effect, which AFAIK is just a 24 dB/Oct HP filter.
http://www.littlelabs.com/vog.html

[Theo.M]

.. it was also very good for the bass bump trick (resonant HP).

Many times you guys mention these different "tricks" without describing what these "tricks" are...many of us have NO clue as to what these "tricks" are and greatly appreciate learning what they are, unless of course these are "secret tricks?" If that be the case, then oh well.

But I for one am always ready to learn more!

ahh i thought i had put it in brackets, sorry.

Basically between 50-80 hz somewhere about there, you do a 12 or 24 db low cut, and boos the resonance (so, use a low cut/high pass with Q basically). You will get the right balance and you will see the bottom end clean up in the ultra low frequencies, but actually sound bigger and phatter/bassier. Try it on a drum loop right now, let me know how you go

[Theo.M]

.. it was also very good for the bass bump trick (resonant HP).

Many times you guys mention these different "tricks" without describing what these "tricks" are...many of us have NO clue as to what these "tricks" are and greatly appreciate learning what they are, unless of course these are "secret tricks?" If that be the case, then oh well.

But I for one am always ready to learn more!

Not sure I'd call it a trick, and I've never had any success with it myself. It's really the same thing as combining a low cut and high Q boost, and I don't find high Q boosts to work well much of the time (especially for low frequencies). Maybe Theo can share how he has managed to use it with good results, which I'd like to know as well!

There is a device called the VOG (voice of god) that was the first place I heard of the effect, which AFAIK is just a 24 dB/Oct HP filter.
http://www.littlelabs.com/vog.html

I haven't heard the sort of music from you that could benefit from it - isn't it possible that's why in this case? I hear (amazing) orchestral/ambient stuff from you, perhaps guide me to an edmtrack of yours or something very bass heavy and i will tell you if it's suitable for this

[selig]

I haven't heard the sort of music from you that could benefit from it - isn't it possible that's why in this case? I hear (amazing) orchestral/ambient stuff from you, perhaps guide me to an edmtrack of yours or something very bass heavy and i will tell you if it's suitable for this

I agree with that, however only a small percentage of the music I work on is my own! Plus there are many track I've worked on that I've never finished or made public (lack of confidence in them, to be honest).

I have another (and better) technique I use for "kick ass" drum sounds which unfortunately I can't share here because it's a part of a future product (as you already know)!

[Theo.M]

I haven't heard the sort of music from you that could benefit from it - isn't it possible that's why in this case? I hear (amazing) orchestral/ambient stuff from you, perhaps guide me to an edmtrack of yours or something very bass heavy and i will tell you if it's suitable for this

I agree with that, however only a small percentage of the music I work on is my own! Plus there are many track I've worked on that I've never finished or made public (lack of confidence in them, to be honest).

I have another (and better) technique I use for "kick ass" drum sounds which unfortunately I can't share here because it's a part of a future product (as you already know)!

I don't do this all the time, and i don't use it on kicks really. On kicks I use brainworx dynamic EQ as i can control the amount of boost, well, dynamically. I also use the sine wave method on kicks. Just depends on what sounds right really. What i use the low cut trick on is basslines and drums that simply need to be bigger for whatever reason. Have you tried soundtoys decapitator? That has the trick built in like uad voice of God, and combined with it's incredible distortion/saturation, decapitator does an amazing job with it on bass. It's only useful on stuff that actually needs it, in any case. Not just to do it for the sake of it LOL.
By the way, I don't mean to be rude or ignorant in any way saying this, but there really are a lot of great producers I have known over the years who do use the technique. What I mean is, there are always multiple ways to achieve a goal. So whilst it makes your own methods absolutely no less valid and useful, it also means that because you don't use this "trick" that it is also no less valid or useful. As for the public track confidence thing, I hear you brother. I suffer from that too, real bad. Maybe we should collab on a track, you do the orchestral/melody, I will do the bass line and drums and we can do it as a killer orchestral EDM track, and we can just listen to it ourselves, dancing away without ever sharing it with a soul. Hope that gave you a chuckle

BTW FWIW, back onto the bass bump trick, the filter with the very best result for that purpose in reason, is D filter. The others are ok but i always go to the code diggers for this one purpose (i don't use it for anything else at all). for low pass sweeps, i prefer futzbox with just the filter active, but i really do like digital filter the most out of all of them for low pass resonant sweeps. I regret the F filter from blamsoft cause of the volume resonance loss. If it had an auto compensation and wet/dry and less HF loss when fully open i'd be happyier and probably use that as it's good quality I can't buy digital filter now anyway, even though I want to as i know in reason, for me at least, it gives me the best sounding low pass sweep - but I can't right now due to my new sales/buy policy and of course the dispute i'm having with props. I hope it all works out soon, as my finger is itching like crazy.

[selig]

I haven't heard the sort of music from you that could benefit from it - isn't it possible that's why in this case? I hear (amazing) orchestral/ambient stuff from you, perhaps guide me to an edmtrack of yours or something very bass heavy and i will tell you if it's suitable for this

I agree with that, however only a small percentage of the music I work on is my own! Plus there are many track I've worked on that I've never finished or made public (lack of confidence in them, to be honest).

I have another (and better) technique I use for "kick ass" drum sounds which unfortunately I can't share here because it's a part of a future product (as you already know)!

I don't do this all the time, and i don't use it on kicks really. On kicks I use brainworx dynamic EQ as i can control the amount of boost, well, dynamically. I also use the sine wave method on kicks. Just depends on what sounds right really. What i use the low cut trick on is basslines and drums that simply need to be bigger for whatever reason. Have you tried soundtoys decapitator? That has the trick built in like uad voice of God, and combined with it's incredible distortion/saturation, decapitator does an amazing job with it on bass. It's only useful on stuff that actually needs it, in any case. Not just to do it for the sake of it LOL.
By the way, I don't mean to be rude or ignorant in any way saying this, but there really are a lot of great producers I have known over the years who do use the technique. What I mean is, there are always multiple ways to achieve a goal. So whilst it makes your own methods absolutely no less valid and useful, it also means that because you don't use this "trick" that it is also no less valid or useful. As for the public track confidence thing, I hear you brother. I suffer from that too, real bad. Maybe we should collab on a track, you do the orchestral/melody, I will do the bass line and drums and we can do it as a killer orchestral EDM track, and we can just listen to it ourselves, dancing away without ever sharing it with a soul. Hope that gave you a chuckle

BTW FWIW, back onto the bass bump trick, the filter with the very best result for that purpose in reason, is D filter. The others are ok but i always go to the code diggers for this one purpose (i don't use it for anything else at all). for low pass sweeps, i prefer futzbox with just the filter active, but i really do like digital filter the most out of all of them for low pass resonant sweeps. I regret the F filter from blamsoft cause of the volume resonance loss. If it had an auto compensation and wet/dry and less HF loss when fully open i'd be happyier and probably use that as it's good quality I can't buy digital filter now anyway, even though I want to as i know in reason, for me at least, it gives me the best sounding low pass sweep - but I can't right now due to my new sales/buy policy and of course the dispute i'm having with props. I hope it all works out soon, as my finger is itching like crazy.

Apologies if I came off as a know it all, I only intended to say it didn't work for me - not that it didn't for for others! Hope that clears up any confusion!

[Theo.M]

Apologies if I came off as a know it all, I only intended to say it didn't work for me - not that it didn't for for others! Hope that clears up any confusion!

oh i am going to smack you! I was the one trying not to come across as a know it all in return and i was trying to say it in a way that, I was in fact trying to say to you i don't think you are coming across as a know it all. I failed LOL!
GRR! there's never ever an issue with you Giles, please know that by now.. ever..i respect you, alot.

[selig]

Apologies if I came off as a know it all, I only intended to say it didn't work for me - not that it didn't for for others! Hope that clears up any confusion!

oh i am going to smack you! I was the one trying not to come across as a know it all in return and i was trying to say it in a way that, I was in fact trying to say to you i don't think you are coming across as a know it all. I failed LOL!
GRR! there's never ever an issue with you Giles, please know that by now.. ever..i respect you, alot.

Same here dude, no worries.

[Benedict]

I know of the HP Filter Bass bump Resonance idea but in reality I wonder "why use it?" as it is a bit crude because the cutoff and boost are in the same spot and locked that way. With Reason's SSL you can use the High Pass and the Low EQ with a Bell and place each independently. Generally with the bump I want it to be higher than the HP cutoff to work in the mix instead of just make a wolly/woofy thump.

[challism]

I have another (and better) technique I use for "kick ass" drum sounds which unfortunately I can't share here because it's a part of a future product (as you already know)!

Oh, goody! Another Selig device on the horizon. I'm very excited to learn more!
I assume it's an RE?

[Theo.M]

I have another (and better) technique I use for "kick ass" drum sounds which unfortunately I can't share here because it's a part of a future product (as you already know)!

Oh, goody! Another Selig device on the horizon. I'm very excited to learn more!
I assume it's an RE?

i wonder if he let it "slip" out intentionally. I have known about if for quite some time.

(and no, I am trustworthy, so don't try LOL unless Giles himself wants to give more away).

[gak]

Selig gain has become invaluable for me personally. Looking forward to it.

[MDTerps2015]

Hi guys, have given this plugin:

https://shop.propellerheads.se/product/digital-filter/

a killer workout, and I kept on trying to find ways to make my current filters sound as good (d filter - comes closest, factory stuff, F16, even etch) - and I can't.

The reason being is that sometimes we want to add some resonance and just do a high or low sweep - this is where the others fail because in the case of etch it doesn't have resonance compensation and you have to fiddle with all the in/out/drive on/odd/comp etc to get the original signal as close to the dry signal as possible before sweeping and then you boost resonance and you lose volume, with F16 even though it has a compensation feature, i can never ever get it quite right, and with D filter there is latency in the best sounding mode and this one still sounds a bit superior.

There is zero latency and it just sounds sweet, smooth, and funky to me on all the sources I have tried it on. Also doing a null test when fully open and resonance closed, it has the smallest HF loss of ALL of the filter plugins - it's negligible.

I am still looking for a filter plugin like this that has dry/wet cause I am a bit tired of hooking up crossfader and having to automate two plugins, so that's my request for it and TBH I can't understand why every filter plugin in VST has this feature automatically and in RE they just don't (besides etch). It should be an automatic inclusion. IMO.

So that's my request for this, hope to hear from the dev in this topic, and also his view on bundles/pricing structure so I know whether to bite

Hey Theo, Im not getting it because i tried this and truly didnt think very high of it. I noticed that since this was posted that the rating in the shop went down. Not calling anyone out or questioning you but what the heck is it, its either loved or hated. Talk about polarizing. I am actually peed off that i didnt buy gq-7 when it was on sale now im going to pay full price when i get those funds. Im buying it simply for the shelving.

[Theo.M]

Hey if people tried it or bought it because of me and rated it low I am really sorry! It's just my opinion that it does great resonant low pass sweeps. I haven't bought it yet but will at some point when it's half price. Note i think i originally rated it 3 stars myself because i hated the interface and didn't really give it a chance. But i can't rerate. It would now be a 4 anyway... no filter plugin will ever get 5 from me unless it has dry/wet at minimum. I feel bad for my rating but that was ages ago and i made the wrong call. When i first started this topic the filter was at 3 stars - oh edit i see it has gone to two stars wow! It doesn't deserve that. I will also say I've rated something 5 stars in haste and never used it once and would now rate them a 1! So honestly even though I used to I don't trust the rating system that much.

[Theo.M]

FWIW also would like to say my 2c about what sort of filter plugin the shop *really* needs. Something like etch but using 10% of the cpu and much simpler to modulate. I am thinking of the original WOW by sugar bytes as a perfect example. So basically the usual low and high pass, but also a vowel option, and a super easy lfo depth dial with a synced time knob and a wet/dry. I don't know why it doesn't exist yet. Etch does it but it's like programming a space shuttle expedition IMO. Vengeance Philta is another perfect example - super easy to get automated funky patters and sounds great. I know the CV system is designed to help us do all this with using LFO's but i am still the type that likes it all in one pluggie.

[MDTerps2015]

Yeah i was told not to trust that rating system because some devices might be good for what i do and not others. Im not blaming you for the ratings dip, lol, but i just found it nothing special. Anyway, that was just my two cents but im not knocking the thread because this is what its for. The only thing im hoping for hopefully in the near future is something like the blue cat pro eq and fab filter.

[Theo.M]

Yeah i was told not to trust that rating system because some devices might be good for what i do and not others. Im not blaming you for the ratings dip, lol, but i just found it nothing special. Anyway, that was just my two cents but im not knocking the thread because this is what its for. The only thing im hoping for hopefully in the near future is something like the blue cat pro eq and fab filter.

Oh of course LOL any opinion is valid and i mean ANY. I have always advocated that - we are all absolutely entitled to think whatever we like about a product.

Ironically, i think the blue cat EQ's are more or less ordinary and i'd happily have GEQ7 over them. If you mean the mid side features, true, but the quad electra allows easy mid side use with GEQ7.( i know i know, a workaround lol). But beneath that, they are such ordinary EQ's (imo). Really missing some basic features and no match for ProQ2 (which i assume is the fabfilter you were meaning).

There are however a couple of blu cat products i would love to see as RE's. The main ons is MB7 mixer which has 5 bands and splits inserted plugins per band as well as other features like stereo control/M-S/basic EQ - the thing is unless he could write in a way that it could load other RE's and factory stuff it would be pointless. The other is the dynamics plugin which I have stated at other forums for years now, is the most overlooked and underrated dynamics plugin on the planet. It does it all, from frequency dependant upward and downward compression, to both upward and downward gating and expansion.. it can be extreme like a waveshaper distortion or smooth as butter. Very comprehensive great sounding plugin

[MDTerps2015]

Yeah i was told not to trust that rating system because some devices might be good for what i do and not others. Im not blaming you for the ratings dip, lol, but i just found it nothing special. Anyway, that was just my two cents but im not knocking the thread because this is what its for. The only thing im hoping for hopefully in the near future is something like the blue cat pro eq and fab filter.

Oh of course LOL any opinion is valid and i mean ANY. I have always advocated that - we are all absolutely entitled to think whatever we like about a product.

Ironically, i think the blue cat EQ's are more or less ordinary and i'd happily have GEQ7 over them. If you mean the mid side features, true, but the quad electra allows easy mid side use with GEQ7.( i know i know, a workaround lol). But beneath that, they are such ordinary EQ's (imo). Really missing some basic features and no match for ProQ2 (which i assume is the fabfilter you were meaning).

There are however a couple of blu cat products i would love to see as RE's. The main ons is MB7 mixer which has 5 bands and splits inserted plugins per band as well as other features like stereo control/M-S/basic EQ - the thing is unless he could write in a way that it could load other RE's and factory stuff it would be pointless. The other is the dynamics plugin which I have stated at other forums for years now, is the most overlooked and underrated dynamics plugin on the planet. It does it all, from frequency dependant upward and downward compression, to both upward and downward gating and expansion.. it can be extreme like a waveshaper distortion or smooth as butter. Very comprehensive great sounding plugin

I was talking more along the lines of eq matching. Ozone has an eq that can do that too. GQ-7 should be able to do it. Someone else told me that you can do that in Reason with multiple devices but i think the object of having RE's is to use less devices. BTW you might be right about the it being the fabfilter. I look at so much stuff and i get my clues from youtube. Anyway thats all i have. Thanx for the response. Still looking for that perfect eq with matching. Saw an awesome video on how to use it.

[Theo.M]

Yeah i was told not to trust that rating system because some devices might be good for what i do and not others. Im not blaming you for the ratings dip, lol, but i just found it nothing special. Anyway, that was just my two cents but im not knocking the thread because this is what its for. The only thing im hoping for hopefully in the near future is something like the blue cat pro eq and fab filter.

Oh of course LOL any opinion is valid and i mean ANY. I have always advocated that - we are all absolutely entitled to think whatever we like about a product.

Ironically, i think the blue cat EQ's are more or less ordinary and i'd happily have GEQ7 over them. If you mean the mid side features, true, but the quad electra allows easy mid side use with GEQ7.( i know i know, a workaround lol). But beneath that, they are such ordinary EQ's (imo). Really missing some basic features and no match for ProQ2 (which i assume is the fabfilter you were meaning).

There are however a couple of blu cat products i would love to see as RE's. The main ons is MB7 mixer which has 5 bands and splits inserted plugins per band as well as other features like stereo control/M-S/basic EQ - the thing is unless he could write in a way that it could load other RE's and factory stuff it would be pointless. The other is the dynamics plugin which I have stated at other forums for years now, is the most overlooked and underrated dynamics plugin on the planet. It does it all, from frequency dependant upward and downward compression, to both upward and downward gating and expansion.. it can be extreme like a waveshaper distortion or smooth as butter. Very comprehensive great sounding plugin

I was talking more along the lines of eq matching. Ozone has an eq that can do that too. GQ-7 should be able to do it. Someone else told me that you can do that in Reason with multiple devices but i think the object of having RE's is to use less devices. BTW you might be right about the it being the fabfilter. I look at so much stuff and i get my clues from youtube. Anyway thats all i have. Thanx for the response. Still looking for that perfect eq with matching. Saw an awesome video on how to use it.

never had really good results from eq matching myself, especially during mastering. Where i have had great results was inverse EQ matching to "make space". I use the melda auto EQ (my favourite of the matching EQ's) to take the eq spectrums, then choose to "sound opposite" then adjust amount to taste (usually just a little bit) with a simple "amount" slider. Carve can theoretically do this too but some carve problems have been pointed out to me that I am also discovering, it's not quite right.

Very rarely I used to use logic's match EQ to take a wimpy sound I might have had and then eq'd it to have the same frequency response of a sample that sounded great, with varying results. I can't argue it would be a nice feature to have, so why not request it from Richard @ Synapse? The basic footprint is there because he has the spectrum analyser. But even if he wants to do it there could be an issue. From what I understand, other RE's and GEQ itself, with the current RE technology, is absolutely maxing it out with just one spectrum. And RE's can;t spit out data yet. So I can't see a way to have GEQ7 save a spectrum then load it to another instance. I also can't see a way for it to have two overlapping spectrums (i am sure that is impossible to program at present). Perhaps internally it could have a capture button, then an apply button but we only get to see the one spectrum at any time, and no way to actually save spectrum responses we have captured. I guess that would be possible. I might bring it up in the synapse beta forum and see if there's anything that can be done.
Let's look at it another way - i am sure the SDK will get to the level that all our desires will be doable. I honestly believe that when the SDK makes something like this feature more sensible, that the DEVS would add it. You gotta blame Props a bit for this too, it seems the devs themselves get a bit too much "why haven't we got this and this yet" over the years when really, they do the best they can within the SDK limitations.