Where to put Ozone Maximizer exactly

[eXode]

This is what I'm seeing..

You can always increase the margin if you want more headroom.

[ScuzzyEye]

This is what I'm seeing..

That's not clipping. In the big meter, see those two lights that are separated slightly from the rest of the meter, on the right side of the L/R, that say "clip" between them? They are what light up when you're clipping. They will stay lit until you press the "reset" button too.

The red part of the meter just means you're above -12 dBfs (with the default setting, that can be adjusted). Also that wave has peaks of 0 dBfs, so the peak hold is holding at 0 dB on the meter. But the outputs are not being clipped.

[Jmax]

Starting to understand now guys.  So anything past the -12 default will show up in the red.  So to increase the margin to say 0 db that would be all the way to the right correct? What do you guys have yours set at?

[Jmax]

Also is it best to have the Ozone in Bypass mode until your track is near complexation then turn it on to give it a final push?

[ScuzzyEye]

Starting to understand now guys.  So anything past the -12 default will show up in the red.  So to increase the margin to say 0 db that would be all the way to the right correct? What do you guys have yours set at?

For the master output -12 dB is fine for me. I like to see the peaks just touching 0 dB, and the average dancing right under -12 dB. So having the yellow/red separation set there makes it easy to see.

[ScuzzyEye]

Also is it best to have the Ozone in Bypass mode until your track is near complexation then turn it on to give it a final push?

That's up to the individual. Just as some people like to work with the master bus compressor always active. I don't mind having a limiter on the final output all the time. I do put a Selig Gain just before Ozone, so I can see exactly how hard I'm hitting the limiter.

[Jmax]

Good idea with the Selig gain I inserted it.  Do I have the wiring correct at the back?  

[ScuzzyEye]

Good idea with the Selig gain I inserted it.  Do I have the wiring correct at the back?

Looks good to me.

[Faastwalker]

To be clear, just make sure it's the LAST thing that affects any audio signal.

This includes the master volume control, so it should outside of the master insert area. Jmax has it right. With Dan's setup, unless the master volume is set to -0 dB, Ozone may not be able to deliver what you're asking.

Just got Ozone yesterday. I was a bit unsure whether to put it as the last device on the Master Insert FX or, as Jmax has it, on the Master Outputs (between Master outputs & hardware I/O). At first I thought Master output then ended up putting it at the end of the Master inserts chain. In hindsight Master Outputs sounds like the way. But I was a bit confused about what you said regarding the Master Volume (needing to be at 0db). Can you explain this a bit? (a bit confused again now).

[ebop]

I stick Ozone after the master output with a Gain just before it to boost input volume as I mix with so much headroom I can't even trigger the bloody thing. I only started sticking Ozone after the master output after I saw a post from Selig in relation to wiring up for master bus side-chain compression. I assume wiring it this way takes away any potential influence from the master bus compressor (if used), is that right?

[Jmax]

Yes I now have it outside the master and as the last signal in the chain. Not to get off topic but I'm wondering how many people are using two compressors. 1 As part of the master inserts and then the SSL compressor to finish off later. This potentially lets the ozone do its job even more. I just bought the Dcam bundle soxurious to see it in action.

[ScuzzyEye]

But I was a bit confused about what you said regarding the Master Volume (needing to be at 0db). Can you explain this a bit? (a bit confused again now).

I was saying if you put it in the Master Insert section, you need to leave the Master Volume at 0 dB. This is for two reasons. If you are trying to hit a specific margin, and move the volume from 0 dB, that margin no longer applies. Also if you are using the dither option, and want 16-bit dither, if you change the volume you change the level of dither.

Placing Ozone after the volume control, makes all of those issues moot.

[zeebot]

I always put it at the end of my mastering chain

[Faastwalker]

But I was a bit confused about what you said regarding the Master Volume (needing to be at 0db). Can you explain this a bit? (a bit confused again now).

I was saying if you put it in the Master Insert section, you need to leave the Master Volume at 0 dB. This is for two reasons. If you are trying to hit a specific threshold, and move the volume from 0 dB, that threshold no longer applies. Also if you are using the dither option, and want 16-bit dither, if you change the volume you change the level of dither.

Placing Ozone after the volume control, makes all of those issues moot.

Okay. Thanks for explaining Have moved Ozone between Master Output & Hardware I/O

[Tincture]

Glad you got it sorted.

Don't any of you use the Control Room Outs (instead of Master Outs) so that you can listen to your Send FX returns etc?

I've found this very beneficial

[Pepin]

I prefer to have a mono switch (via Selig Gain) accessible from the insert effects combinator, and that needs to placed after the maximizer, so I put the maximizer in the master inserts section. I also map a couple of the maximizer controls on the inserts combinator. This setup means I can't touch the master fader, but that's easy enough to avoid.

[selig]

Starting to understand now guys.  So anything past the -12 default will show up in the red.  So to increase the margin to say 0 db that would be all the way to the right correct? What do you guys have yours set at?

The above is true ONLY if "VU Offset" (in the Rack "Big Meter" section) is set to -12 dB. You can adjust the meters to show "Red" anywhere from -20 dBFS to 0 dBFS - the default is -12 dBFS which is what you're seeing.

I mention this for those who have possibly seen videos with the VU offset at different settings, which can (and frequency does) cause much confusion IMO.

[selig]

I stick Ozone after the master output with a Gain just before it to boost input volume as I mix with so much headroom I can't even trigger the bloody thing. I only started sticking Ozone after the master output after I saw a post from Selig in relation to wiring up for master bus side-chain compression. I assume wiring it this way takes away any potential influence from the master bus compressor (if used), is that right?

You mix with over 20 dB headroom?!?

Not sure what you mean by "takes away any potential influence from the master bus compressor"? Using two compressors in serial does not result in the latter negating the former… is that what you were asking?

[selig]

Yes I now have it outside the master and as the last signal in the chain. Not to get off topic but I'm wondering how many people are using two compressors. 1 As part of the master inserts and then the SSL compressor to finish off later. This potentially lets the ozone do its job even more. I just bought the Dcam bundle soxurious to see it in action.

Using two compressors serially (serial compression) has been done for decades. Sometimes they are done at the same time, sometimes one compressor is added at track, another at mix (or one when mixing and another when mastering). In all cases the result is "serial compression". 

It is common, but not a rule, to use lower ratio compression with slower time constants first, followed by higher ratio/faster TCs ("limiting") second. But one should experiment, as always!

[ebop]

Selig, to be honest, I wouldn't have a clue how much headroom I have as I generally tinker about in Reason with the limiter on for that instant goodness. I know it's not the correct way and I'm doing it all wrong. But with a Gain just before Ozone, I can nudge the input volume up a bit to get more out of Ozone. Sometimes I mix with the limiter off to try and learn to do it properly, which means mix faders are much higher, but I tend to fall back into the bad habit. I'm a rookie after all

With respect to the master bus compressor, I was never sure where it sat in the signal chain, so sticking Ozone after the master output I thought I was safe to assume it was the very last thing in the chain and that any tweaks on the SSL master compressor was not going to cause clipping. Maybe it doesn't anyway because it's before the master insert fx section. I am still learning how to interpret the multitude of meters in Reason and the correct way to set things up.

Anyone know of a good YouTube vid that steps through how to mix and master properly in Reason and get the right levels across the various stages? I RTFM occasionally but I sometimes get a bit lost in that thing. I guess it's just a learning curve and time in the saddle.

[ScuzzyEye]

But with a Gain just before Ozone, I can nudge the input volume up a bit to get more out of Ozone.

The Threshold control does the same thing. You can bring it down the same number of dB as you would be pushing up with Gain. But Gain is still useful before Ozone, to get an actual numeric value of the peaks, which can in turn be used to adjust the Threshold.

I realize now that in a few posts about Ozone I said Threshold, where I meant Margin. I've edited those occurrences for archeological preservation of future societies. Threshold is basically what level Ozone should treat as a maximum. Margin is how much space below 0 dBfs should be left (mostly for safety reasons related to analog playback, or lossy compression).

[ebop]

Rightyo, well there you go, I don't have an effing clue. For some reason, I always thought to myself that when I brought the threshold slider down too far it got distorted at a faster rate or did something different than if I just boosted the incoming volume using Gain a bit and bring down the slider less. I've never done a comparison before. But I just did, and it didn't seem to make a difference. Like I say, I'm a rookie and I guess it's dangerous arming a fool with tools they don't know how to use. Cheers Scuzzy.

[ScuzzyEye]

Rightyo, well there you go, I don't have an effing clue. For some reason, I always thought to myself that when I brought the threshold slider down too far it got distorted at a faster rate or did something different than if I just boosted the incoming volume using Gain a bit and bring down the slider less. I've never done a comparison before. But I just did, and it didn't seem to make a difference. Like I say, I'm a rookie and I guess it's dangerous arming a fool with tools they don't know how to use. Cheers Scuzzy.

If you don't use something, you'll never learn how it works. Today you know something you didn't know yesterday. That's a great thing about playing around in Reason. The chances of killing, maiming, or damaging equipment are very low.

[K1TTENM1TTEN]

Haha, alrighty, so I am going to eat a nice fat piece of humble pie and admit that I still have no idea how to use this thing. I have never really attempted the whole mastering process within Reason, so I've actually never used any of the "master inserts," I don't really quite understand the concept of BUSing, and usually do all of my effects chains on each individual channel/instrument. I know that last part is high inefficient and chews through DSP usage, so I want to learn how to use Reason's mastering the "right" way.

I have read through the Ozone PDF guide, and I understand what a maximizer is in comparison to a limiter/compressor. But my issue is I am still getting a bunch of clipping with Ozone. I obviously don't know how to use it, so can we perhaps make a step-by-step guide with pictures for idiots from where to actually place this, what the cable routing looks like and why, what a good base setting is, the difference between "control out" and mixboard outs, and what knobs need to be adjusted on the mixing console? I really want to learn how to do this and honestly have been too prideful to ask, but at this point my pride is negatively effecting my mix, so at this point I am bidding my pride adieu, haha.

[Tincture]

I haven't really got the patience to do all of that but here's my reason template that I start every song with.

Just ignore/delete the SendFX REs etc (replace with your own send FX) that you might not have and ignore/delete the Flower Audio Loudness Meter if you don't have it.

I write my song with the Limiter set as it is then when it's done I just turn on the Dithering button (as I export at 44100 / 16bit) and drag down the Threshold slider until I'm getting peak of about -9.0 dB RMS on the Loudness Meter... you'll just have to judge for yourself maybe. Oh and I'll tinker with the master bus compressor too... I usually have it doing between 1 and 4 db (absolute max for me) of Gain Reduction. I sometimes move the attack from 10 to 30ms if I want more punch too. I'll probably try some EQ and comp inserts in the Master Section too but let's keep it simple

To hear your FX Sends simply go to the Mixer bottom right and in the Control Room Out panel just change from master to FX Returns and click on the number of the send you want to hear.