How to use Selig Leveler and DeEsser

[iramrezso]

Hi,

I'm interested in the proper order of Selig Leveler, DeEsser and EQ in processing vocals.
So according to my investigations I got the practice to put Leveler before DeEsser in order to avoid to re-gain esses that the DeEsser tried to remove.
However I'm not sure where the EQ-ing should come into the chain. I usually put a High Pass filter on vocals to cut out low frequencies. However should this filter be put before Leveler as unnecessary low frequencies could mislead that device in deciding where to change the signal? But in this case DeEsser would also process an EQ-ed signal, right?

So what do you suggest, how to use these tools in processing vocals?

The question could be phrased in a more general form, of course: which is the proper order of deessing, leveling and EQ-ing on vocals? However I like Selig's stuffs so much that I can easily make an equation between his rigs and the techniques they are for in Reason, at least And hope this may also be a call for him to help me

Hey, I very appreciate help from any of you, of course.

[selig]

Hi,

I'm interested in the proper order of Selig Leveler, DeEsser and EQ in processing vocals.
So according to my investigations I got the practice to put Leveler before DeEsser in order to avoid to re-gain esses that the DeEsser tried to remove.
However I'm not sure where the EQ-ing should come into the chain. I usually put a High Pass filter on vocals to cut out low frequencies. However should this filter be put before Leveler as unnecessary low frequencies could mislead that device in deciding where to change the signal? But in this case DeEsser would also process an EQ-ed signal, right?

So what do you suggest, how to use these tools in processing vocals?

The question could be phrased in a more general form, of course: which is the proper order of deessing, leveling and EQ-ing on vocals? However I like Selig's stuffs so much that I can easily make an equation between his rigs and the techniques they are for in Reason, at least And hope this may also be a call for him to help me

Hey, I very appreciate help from any of you, of course.

In this specific case, I always put the leveler first since it must be "calibrated" to a specific level for this application, and if it's not first in the processing chain then you'll have to re-callibrate it every time after making changes to any devices "up-stream".

As far back as I can remember there has always been a debate over whether it's better to compress then EQ, or EQ first then compress. Best advice I ever got was to always compare the two choices and choose the one that gets you closest to your goal.

Also, because of the way this DeEsser works, which is different from most, you can basically put it ANYWHERE in the chain and it will just work.

[pjeudy]

in case someone is interested in buying a plugin mostly because a known producer uses it...well there ya go !
Selig DeEsser used by Lucky Date   @ 7:06

https://youtu.be/aPKUoYz5B6c?t=7m6s

[selig]

Thanks for the heads up!
I see "Selig DeEsser" in his Effects list, but not Selig Leveler. Where are you seeing the Leveler?

in case someone is interested in buying a plugin mostly because a known producer uses it...well there ya go !
Selig Leveler used by Lucky Date   @ 7:06

https://youtu.be/aPKUoYz5B6c?t=7m6s

[pjeudy]

Ahh shoot... :s0959: saw DeEsser wrote leveler simply because I was adding it in all my tracks at the time! Need to go offline when making music ! I constantly do both

While I'm in correction mode..he's not actually using it,but I'm sure he tried it for 30 days or less and bought it he will have another video next week showing what he does to vocals, we shall see !

[InDeLiBLe]

I'm using the leveler on every vocal. 30-40% on the blend knob. With this RE you have to listen carefully. Often the quietest word is in the same range of the "s" and "t" words and maybe you'll need to adjust the settings. I always use the output knob to set the level as before while listening. This way you can't fooled by volume and you can hear the leveler in action. 

The Deesser is great tool too. The sibilance extracting is a useful feature but I always prefer the regular mode over it.

[iramrezso]

In this specific case, I always put the leveler first since it must be "calibrated" to a specific level for this application, and if it's not first in the processing chain then you'll have to re-callibrate it every time after making changes to any devices "up-stream".

As far back as I can remember there has always been a debate over whether it's better to compress then EQ, or EQ first then compress. Best advice I ever got was to always compare the two choices and choose the one that gets you closest to your goal.

Ok, so it's up to me This is what I do, just was interested in whether there is a common rule on this.

Also, because of the way this DeEsser works, which is different from most, you can basically put it ANYWHERE in the chain and it will just work.
 

Good to know

Thanks.

[selig]

I'm using the leveler on every vocal. 30-40% on the blend knob. With this RE you have to listen carefully. Often the quietest word is in the same range of the "s" and "t" words and maybe you'll need to adjust the settings. I always use the output knob to set the level as before while listening. This way you can't fooled by volume and you can hear the leveler in action. 

The Deesser is great tool too. The sibilance extracting is a useful feature but I always prefer the regular mode over it.

The Leveler, when setup as directed, will automatically keep the same peak level between the wet and dry signals (unlike any other compressor with a dry/wet control) allowing you to compare before and after levels accurately. Of course, the perceived loudness will change, but everyone hears that differently so "adjust to taste". 

As for the DeEsser, I mainly use the split mode when working on a slower ballad (especially to prevent sending too much sibilance to the reverb/delay), or to brighten up a dull vocal without affecting sibilance. I probably use the standard mode at least 75% of the time.

[iramrezso]

A question on DeEsser. How exactly does the crossover knob works? The standard is that sibilance take place around 2kHz and this is the default position of that knob. However my experience is that my sibilance through my mic comes at between 4-8kHz or higher. However changing that knob on DeEsser doesn't seem to affect too much how the device works, I only notice that remaining esses come back in a bit higher or lower frequencies into the processed vocal.
So what does the crossover knob control exactly?

[selig]

A question on DeEsser. How exactly does the crossover knob works? The standard is that sibilance take place around 2kHz and this is the default position of that knob. However my experience is that my sibilance through my mic comes at between 4-8kHz or higher. However changing that knob on DeEsser doesn't seem to affect too much how the device works, I only notice that remaining esses come back in a bit higher or lower frequencies into the processed vocal.
So what does the crossover knob control exactly?

The Crossover controls the input to the sibilance detector, which works differently than a dynamics based de-esser. It's not as sensitive as other devices IMO.

The crossover effect is subtle to be sure, and I included it just to be sure it was available to the end user. I typically never find the need to use it in normal operation, only when separating sibilance and/or breaths to a separate track (and not often even then). 

I've never seen sibilance down at 2 kHz, mostly in the range you describe. As long as the crossover is below the lowest sibilant frequency, you should be fine!