AD 480 Reverb is in the shop!

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selig
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19 Mar 2015

It's an "insta-TRY" for me!
;)
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ArcoZ
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19 Mar 2015

Waiting for 50% sales. (or 75%)

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Concep
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19 Mar 2015

Certainly not comparable with the IOS pricing.  Haven't trialed yet, but in all the sound examples the reverb seems very obvious and metallic.  I might trial soon, but not impressed at first glance.

SunSetCity
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19 Mar 2015

It can produce some really nice reverb but I'm a little disappointed about the pricing...

15 EUR for the pro version in the app store versus more than 4 times more for a RE? I think that this is no reasonable surcharge...

So unfortunately I'll have to pass on this until there's a sale or something! :frown:

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joeyluck
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19 Mar 2015

Well iOS is a different market.
And additional work went into this.

But folks if you stop and think about it in the reverse:
Thor for iOS is $14.99
What do you think the price tag would be if it was sold separately for Reason?
What would it be worth?
I mean, it should be as expensive or more expensive than the best synth in the RE shop at least, right?

This dev began in iOS I believe.
iOS has a larger market and an average, expected price tag for apps.
Plugins for DAWs have a different value and average price tag. 
You could say that Reason has a smaller market, but I don't think that needs to be factored.

How many iOS app ports have we seen?
I know that FM4 is on the way as a RE and I wonder what the price will be and how folks will respond...
I suppose that's the tougher direction to move (going from mobile apps to plugins for DAWs).

See Selig, this is good example. In particular, when I was talking about intro pricing and pricing for other formats... That first price people see is the value they will likely perceive for the product. We all are aware of these other factors that play a part in pricing, but it's easy to forget. And people have been staring at that other price tag next to this product for iOS.

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eusti
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19 Mar 2015

joeyluck wrote:Well iOS is a different market.
And additional work went into this.

But folks if you stop and think about it in the reverse:
Thor for iOS is $14.99
What do you think the price tag would be if it was sold separately for Reason?
What would it be worth?
I mean, it should be as expensive or more expensive than the best synth in the RE shop at least, right?

This dev began in iOS I believe.
iOS has a larger market and an average, expected price tag for apps.
Plugins for DAWs have a different value and average price tag. 
You could say that Reason has a smaller market, but I don't think that needs to be factored.

How many iOS app ports have we seen?
I know that FM4 is on the way as a RE and I wonder what the price will be and how folks will respond...
I suppose that's the tougher direction to move (going from mobile apps to plugins for DAWs).

See Selig, this is good example. In particular, when I was talking about intro pricing and pricing for other formats... That first price people see is the value they will likely perceive for the product. We all are aware of these other factors that play a part in pricing, but it's easy to forget. And people have been staring at that other price tag next to this product for iOS.
I like the AD 480RE. Helped to beta test it too.
Not sure if it's worth the money...
Would make it the second most expensive reverb RE in the shop, if I'm not mistaken...
But everyone needs to make up their own mind about it...

D.

Yonatan
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19 Mar 2015

Every RE developer and real effect or instrument is welcome but I will wait until a major sale before buying, but nice to have a 30 day trial.  

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Jagwah
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19 Mar 2015


This coming out straight after Republik makes me feel like there is a new trend for some developers to charge top dollar simply because this is the 'Reason format.' 

Not impressed at all.

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Jagwah
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19 Mar 2015

AUS $111.55


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eusti
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19 Mar 2015

Jagwah wrote: This coming out straight after Republik makes me feel like there is a new trend for some developers to charge top dollar simply because this is the 'Reason format.' 

Not impressed at all.
I agree about Republik... Not that it's not worth it... I just don't use percussion that much that it's worth it to me.

D.

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Jagwah
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19 Mar 2015

eusti wrote:I agree about Republik... Not that it's not worth it... I just don't use percussion that much that it's worth it to me.

D.
I love percussion, especially since Euclid made making percussion in Reason awesome. I love the idea of Republik, I love using it, I can afford it, but I would feel cheated buying it at that price. I would feel cheated buying this reverb at this price.

Apparently price point is a huge deal for sales, set it too low and you could lose money, set it too high and you turn away potential customers. This is the 2nd RE in a row where as soon as I saw the price I was instantly turned right off.

I'm finding all of this very unflattering at the moment.

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eusti
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19 Mar 2015

eusti wrote:I agree about Republik... Not that it's not worth it... I just don't use percussion that much that it's worth it to me.

D.
Jagwah wrote: I love percussion, especially since Euclid made making percussion in Reason awesome. I love the idea of Republik, I love using it, I can afford it, but I would feel cheated buying it at that price. I would feel cheated buying this reverb at this price.

Apparently price point is a huge deal for sales, set it too low and you could lose money, set it too high and you turn away potential customers. This is the 2nd RE in a row where as soon as I saw the price I was instantly turned right off.

I'm finding all of this very unflattering at the moment.
Interesting! What would be prices for both of those REs that you'd see as fair?

D.

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Jagwah
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19 Mar 2015

eusti wrote:Interesting! What would be prices for both of those REs that you'd see as fair?

D.
Something lower that did not turn me away as soon as I saw it. This should be an important goal of any sales person when setting a price point. I'm not speaking on behalf of anyone else, this is how I personally feel about these prices. Rob Papen's Predator - that's worth $119, some other devices are nearing it in price but not in comparison.

As with pretty much everyone else I welcome any new developer, so having said my piece about this I shall move on.

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eusti
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19 Mar 2015

Fair enough, Jagwah! Didn't mean to derail the thread.

D.

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Jagwah
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19 Mar 2015

eusti wrote:Fair enough, Jagwah! Didn't mean to derail the thread.

D.
All good mate :comp:

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selig
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19 Mar 2015

Jagwah wrote: This coming out straight after Republik makes me feel like there is a new trend for some developers to charge top dollar simply because this is the 'Reason format.' 

Not impressed at all.
Not sure how this relates to Rebublik, but compare it instead to the lesser featured TSAR-1 Reverb at less than half the price…

Also not sure any developer in his right mind would consider the Reason market a "top dollar" market, least of all Jiggery who has produced many find and very reasonably priced products over the years IMO. I've experienced the Reason market as exactly the opposite, one that more often expects all prices to be at the "hobbiest" level!

And is that not exactly what you're confirming here, by suggestion this RE is somehow being priced at "top dollar" despite it being priced at less than half the price of the "competition"?
:)
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selig
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19 Mar 2015

AD 480

First impressions - the first 10 minutes…

Pricing:
This seems priced competitively IMO, as for me it's up against the $199 TSAR-1 because it's a single (versatile) reverb algorithm with a fair amount of control.

Features:
But the AD 480 is priced more in line with the $79 TSAR-1R while giving far more control. In fact, it has even more control "power" than the $199 TSAR-1, adding controls for low freq damp/tuning, low cut, high damp tuning, cross feed, dimension (not sure exactly what this does yet, maybe a density control?) and spread.

On the back panel the difference isn't even close - the AD-480 is covered with CV inputs, covering every parameter including the two bypass buttons! It also features a different approach to I/O, in that there is a dedicated "wet" output. Why is this needed? Because the default operation is intended to be serially (as opposed to a send/return setup), and as such all the patches save the "Mix" knob settings (unlike all other RE's and host devices I'm aware of). This is an extra step for those using presets and a send/return setup - otherwise you'll have to reset the Mix knob after loading each preset. At least there's a workaround (use the Wet outputs), and for that I'm thankful! 

Sound Quality:
My first sonic impressions have been quite good. Super long reverbs on high piano notes sound "right" to me, with just enough variation but no "warble" or obvious chorusing going on (which is good since there doesn't appear to be any way to control modulation). This appears to be a true stereo device, with it's own cross feed control allowing you to determine how much of the original "stereo" sound stage is retained (and even add delay to the cross-fed signal - quite nice)!

For drums and small rooms in general, I'm still not 100% sold on this algorithm (but I also don't have any other favorites at this time…). I like the middle to bigger sizes in general with this RE so far, with favorites on drums being Big Room 2, Percussion Club, and Drum Rehearsal. For the high piano notes, I liked Vocal Concert Hall, Big Hall (no top end clutter), and for the longer reverbs Storm Clouds, and Meditation.

Conclusion:
There appears to be enough controls to go nuts if you're not happy with the presets. I'm really liking having the low damp controls myself. And while I really like this reverb on many things, as a long time Lexicon 480 fan I'm not feeling the comparison if that's what was intended by the name.

Need to explore more - I still have 29 days left!
:)
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submonsterz
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19 Mar 2015

Hmm I just listened to demo tracks on my mobile and hmmmm most sound completely horrid on it I'll try listening on four other mobile devices I have to cross check..
will have to listen on a set of headphones and speakers (all crap ones I use of course, as if it don't sound good on them it won't on anything )
Price point disregarding anything else or even till now knowing the ios price I have two words so far
"Lol nope". Wouldn't even bother trialling it for that money sorry to say . Just like the other more expensive ones I would never entertain Them either.

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Jagwah
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19 Mar 2015

selig wrote:Not sure how this relates to Rebublik, but compare it instead to the lesser featured TSAR-1 Reverb at less than half the price…

Also not sure any developer in his right mind would consider the Reason market a "top dollar" market, least of all Jiggery who has produced many find and very reasonably priced products over the years IMO. I've experienced the Reason market as exactly the opposite, one that more often expects all prices to be at the "hobbiest" level!

And is that not exactly what you're confirming here, by suggestion this RE is somehow being priced at "top dollar" despite it being priced at less than half the price of the "competition"?
:)
For what it is, yes, I would say top dollar is being asked for it, and I am only 'confirming' this as being my opinion, not fact or anything else.  

If you are comparing prices with competition then the devices should be comparable, is AD 480 really comparable with Softube's reverbs?

Never had a problem with JP's prices before Republik. It 'relates' because I felt the price point was set too high - as I mentioned already. I'm a big fan of JP's devices.

Judging by your last post you seem quite impressed with AD 480 and that's great, you should pick it up if you feel that way, me on the other hand, I feel the price point is set too high :angel:


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selig
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19 Mar 2015

selig wrote:Not sure how this relates to Rebublik, but compare it instead to the lesser featured TSAR-1 Reverb at less than half the price…

Also not sure any developer in his right mind would consider the Reason market a "top dollar" market, least of all Jiggery who has produced many find and very reasonably priced products over the years IMO. I've experienced the Reason market as exactly the opposite, one that more often expects all prices to be at the "hobbiest" level!

And is that not exactly what you're confirming here, by suggestion this RE is somehow being priced at "top dollar" despite it being priced at less than half the price of the "competition"?
:)
Jagwah wrote: For what it is, yes, I would say top dollar is being asked for it, and I am only
Jagwah wrote:'confirming'
Jagwah wrote: this as being my opinion, not fact or anything else.  

If you are comparing prices with competition then the devices should be comparable, is AD 480 really comparable with Softube's reverbs?

Never had a problem with JP's prices before Republik. It
Jagwah wrote:'relates'
Jagwah wrote: because I felt the price point was set too high - as I mentioned already. I'm a big fan of JP's devices.

Judging by your last post you seem quite impressed with AD 480 and that's great, you should pick it up if you feel that way, me on the other hand, I feel the price point is set too high :angel:
Well, technically it CAN'T be priced at "top dollar" if there is another reverb that is priced so much higher. Unless the phrase Top Dollar doesn't mean what it says. In other words, top dollar isn't an opinion of value, it's a price based on the market. Apologies if you're using that term differently, but that's the definition I grew up using.

What you seem to be saying is that you've listened to this device and it's not even half as good as the TSAR-1? Or something else? Otherwise I'm not sure how you can compare value if you've not heard them both.

I'm aware everyone has a different budget for things like REs, and that accounts for why someone finds one product over priced and another finds it to be a bargain. It's also about what tools you need, so if you don't need percussion the Republik device is worthless at ANY price! So it's silly to try to claim there is a "price" that is too high period - it's about value, and we each determine that value based on a number of factors. That is to say, whether or not a product has value for someone is a personal thing, not a factual thing.

Anyway, I've spent thousands of dollars on hardware reverb devices in the past, so I'm definitely not the typical market for REs. ;)
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tt_lab
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19 Mar 2015

Will wait till this is bundled in Space Rig or something...lol

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Marco Raaphorst
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19 Mar 2015

just checked out the demos. sounds nice. will try it out myself.

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Concep
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19 Mar 2015

I'm tempted to test this due to the wide range of controls, but I already have TSAR 1, and I really doubt this thing is anywhere near as lush given the supplied samples.  Can anybody put it up to TSAR 1 and compare the CPU hit?  That's the real downside of TSAR.  Since I have TSAR, I have a hard time even trialing this due to the price.  I pictured it being under $50.  

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Jagwah
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19 Mar 2015

selig wrote:Well, technically it CAN'T be priced at "top dollar" if there is another reverb that is priced so much higher. Unless the phrase Top Dollar doesn't mean what it says. In other words, top dollar isn't an opinion of value, it's a price based on the market. Apologies if you're using that term differently, but that's the definition I grew up using.

What you seem to be saying is that you've listened to this device and it's not even half as good as the TSAR-1? Or something else? Otherwise I'm not sure how you can compare value if you've not heard them both.

I'm aware everyone has a different budget for things like REs, and that accounts for why someone finds one product over priced and another finds it to be a bargain. It's also about what tools you need, so if you don't need percussion the Republik device is worthless at ANY price! So it's silly to try to claim there is a "price" that is too high period - it's about value, and we each determine that value based on a number of factors. That is to say, whether or not a product has value for someone is a personal thing, not a factual thing.

Anyway, I've spent thousands of dollars on hardware reverb devices in the past, so I'm definitely not the typical market for REs. ;)
I don't know why we are getting down to semantics here but 'top dollar' does not mean the highest price when compared with other items in the same field. It could be a cultural thing where it means something different to you and me. If I pay top dollar for some flight tickets, it does not mean I bought them through the most expensive airline and got first class tickets - it means there weren't any sales and I paid the maximum amount. That's the meaning I grew up with and that's what is being confirmed to me when I search the term.

Then you are getting back to comparing the two, I'm not saying AD 480 is half as good as a reverb twice the price, all I'm saying is the price point turned me away when I saw it. Maybe you are over-analyzing my opinion.

I don't know if you are confusing my posts with someone else's but as for complaining about a percussion device's price when one does not use / create percussion - you don't need to be telling me about that.   

I'm sorry if you find my opinion unsettling in some way, the price point of this reverb turned me away pretty quickly, that's about the long and the short of it.


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