REs that make excellent use of collapsed/folded view:

[joeyluck]

I think it should be noted the REs that make excellent use of the collapsed view.
While REs currently can't fold or collapse sections, they can still 'completely fold/collapse.'
These Rack Extensions deserve a round of applause.



Aftermath Audio's CV8X4



Alien Seed Tech's PSDN CV Enveloper Generator


DLD Technology's Megasaur


GVXT's GClip


Jiggery-Pokery's Ammo 100LA



Jiggery-Pokery's Titus


Lectric Panda's Shape


Lectric Panda's Skope M4
 


Pepin Hazan's RVL-1
 


Pongasoft's A/B 12 Switch


Pongasoft's A/B Audio & CV Switch



Pongasoft's VAC-6



Propellerhead's Rotor



Selig Gain



Skrock Music's Iridium





So, what are the others that make good use of this view?
Which would you like to see updated to make good use of this view?

[ebop]

Agree Joey, it's useful when REs do this. Selig Gain is a good example. Ammo 100LA from JP is another good one that I use a lot.

[Pepin]

RVL-1



 


Also, CV8X4:

[challism]

I just went thru all of my REs.  I think JP's Ammo100LA is the winner.  Which is funny since Ammo100 doesn't use up hardly any real estate when fully expanded.  2nd place would have to be JP's Titus.  And 3rd place for my REs goes to Rotor (with the slow/fast toggle).  

It's surprising that so many RE devs do not take advantage of putting any controls on the collapse view panel.

[joeyluck]

Thanks for chiming in!  I knew there were more, just couldn't remember what they were...

I think it's important we celebrate these. And I may be sending a note to some devs with suggestions like this. Again, my current fav that would function in the folded view would be the FET.

[joeyluck]

Recently, I was actually thinking how great it would be if Softube included knobs on some of their REs in the collapsed view. Particularly the FET Compressor:

 
I know it's a fav GUI of many, so I wouldn't dare ask them to scale it down
But it's completely feasible to have maybe 5-6 knobs (Input, Ratio, Attack, Release, Parallel Inject, and Output) in the collapsed view. My Reason rack would certainly be happier to have collapsed FETs that I can actually operate!

Could look something like this:

 


They can most certainly do a better job than I with the gradient, font, contrast, etc.  Maybe even fit little numbers on around the ratio knob (not needing to see ratios like '1:1,' just 1, 4, 8, 12, 20)...?  But probably not necessary though with the feedback/tooltip. This is after all just a folded view. If you need more, well then you unfold it, right?  For instance, this mockup does not include anything for metering... 

What do you think?


But of all of them, why and the heck not this one? ;P

 

[ProfessaKaos]

Would be awesome if Normen Hansen's VMG-01 Sample Delay had a way of changing sample delay times when folded.
If your listening Normen is this a possibility?

[joeyluck]

I've begun emailing developers with a link to this thread...hoping it serves as a good resource of examples for inspiration.

[challism]

 

[joeyluck]

 

Thanks!

[joeyluck]

Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like Softube is interested (or can afford) an update such as this...

Email from Softube:

———
Hi Joey,

Thanks for your suggestion!

I can see your point, but this isn’t something that you can do in other hosts. The risk with this kind of interface is that it become way to cluttered to be useful.

Hmm, yes it might be easy, but it would double the cost for us to make the RE GUIs, which is our primary cost for developing the REs, and that would potentially make it less appealing for us to make REs. Compared to native plug-ins the RE fish pond is very small.
———

I think my definition of what clutters is different than theirs. I would have no issue having the FET collapsed as seen above. But I can't argue if they think it will cost them money and time they can't spare. 

But on that note—more the reason to praise those who have made good use of the folded view, right?

[selig]

Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like Softube is interested (or can afford) an update such as this...

Email from Softube:

———
Hi Joey,

Thanks for your suggestion!

I can see your point, but this isn’t something that you can do in other hosts. The risk with this kind of interface is that it become way to cluttered to be useful.

Hmm, yes it might be easy, but it would double the cost for us to make the RE GUIs, which is our primary cost for developing the REs, and that would potentially make it less appealing for us to make REs. Compared to native plug-ins the RE fish pond is very small.
———

I think my definition of what clutters is different than theirs. I would have no issue having the FET collapsed as seen above. But I can't argue if they think it will cost them money and time they can't spare. 

But on that note—more the reason to praise those who have made good use of the folded view, right?

Double the costs? Nah, hardly!!!
:frown:

[joeyluck]

Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like Softube is interested (or can afford) an update such as this...

Email from Softube:

———
Hi Joey,

Thanks for your suggestion!

I can see your point, but this isn’t something that you can do in other hosts. The risk with this kind of interface is that it become way to cluttered to be useful.

Hmm, yes it might be easy, but it would double the cost for us to make the RE GUIs, which is our primary cost for developing the REs, and that would potentially make it less appealing for us to make REs. Compared to native plug-ins the RE fish pond is very small.
———

I think my definition of what clutters is different than theirs. I would have no issue having the FET collapsed as seen above. But I can't argue if they think it will cost them money and time they can't spare. 

But on that note—more the reason to praise those who have made good use of the folded view, right?

Double the costs? Nah, hardly!!!
:frown:

Yeah, I assume they are just attempting to give as many points as possible to put the nail in the coffin. I wouldn't even mind if they used stock knobs on the folded view...if it's too difficult for them to resize what they have? But being 3D assets, I'm guessing it wouldn't be difficult... Not trying to make assumptions. Just thought it could at least be something they could consider tackling if they return to it for a bug fix update or something...

And Selig Gain is at the top of my list for best use of the folded view!
Thanks!

[selig]

Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like Softube is interested (or can afford) an update such as this...

Email from Softube:

———
Hi Joey,

Thanks for your suggestion!

I can see your point, but this isn’t something that you can do in other hosts. The risk with this kind of interface is that it become way to cluttered to be useful.

Hmm, yes it might be easy, but it would double the cost for us to make the RE GUIs, which is our primary cost for developing the REs, and that would potentially make it less appealing for us to make REs. Compared to native plug-ins the RE fish pond is very small.
———

I think my definition of what clutters is different than theirs. I would have no issue having the FET collapsed as seen above. But I can't argue if they think it will cost them money and time they can't spare. 

But on that note—more the reason to praise those who have made good use of the folded view, right?

Double the costs? Nah, hardly!!!
:frown:

Yeah, I assume they are just attempting to give as many points as possible to put the nail in the coffin. I wouldn't even mind if they used stock knobs on the folded view...if it's too difficult for them to resize what they have? But being 3D assets, I'm guessing it wouldn't be difficult... Not trying to make assumptions. Just thought it could at least be something they could consider tackling if they return to it for a bug fix update or something...

And Selig Gain is at the top of my list for best use of the folded view!
Thanks!

Thanks for the compliment - just figured this was the type of device you didn't want taking up a bunch of space. 

LOL at the idea that the Saturation Knob's folded interface would be "too cluttered to be useful".

As for their other devices, you don't HAVE to put ALL of the controls in the folded view (I didn't do this for Gain, as one example). And yet there are kind folks here say that a folded view with controls IS more useful…I do cut non-Reasoners slack and give them more time to figure out how to best build interfaces for Reason users!

As for the actual "work" involved, it is strictly a GUI thing (no additional DSP code). Scale the knobs, lay them out on the folded view, and that's pretty much it! There can be MUCH copy/paste here, with the position and scale being the only things that would change. In the case of the huge Saturation Knob, you may not be able to scale that enough - but there are often small and large options for things like knobs etc. if you're working from the supplied library.

[selig]

I submit for your consideration, a crude mockup of the functioning folded FET (that's just fun to say)

 

They can most certainly do a better job than I with the gradient, font, contrast, etc.  Maybe even fit little numbers on around the ratio knob (not needing to see ratios like '1:1,' just 1, 4, 8, 12, 20)...?  But probably not necessary though with the feedback/tooltip. This is after all just a folded view. If you need more, well then you unfold it, right?  For instance, this mockup does not include anything for metering... 

What do you think?

Metering would be essential for my work - it's the FIRST thing I want to know about a compressor when scanning channels in a mix (one reason why I like the SSL consoles).

[joeyluck]

I submit for your consideration, a crude mockup of the functioning folded FET (that's just fun to say)

 

They can most certainly do a better job than I with the gradient, font, contrast, etc.  Maybe even fit little numbers on around the ratio knob (not needing to see ratios like '1:1,' just 1, 4, 8, 12, 20)...?  But probably not necessary though with the feedback/tooltip. This is after all just a folded view. If you need more, well then you unfold it, right?  For instance, this mockup does not include anything for metering... 

What do you think?

Metering would be essential for my work - it's the FIRST thing I want to know about a compressor when scanning channels in a mix (one reason why I like the SSL consoles).

That was my thought as well...but I reminded myself how many FETs are folded in my rack and how ANYTHING added to the folded view would be more useful. Just knobs, just meters, some knobs and meters...  

I guess the knobs could be smaller, or some knobs omitted to accommodate appropriate meters (like LED). Again, with the idea that the folded view offer something rather than nothing. But, I guess me speculating further on the best implementation of the FET folded view is irrelevant if they aren't going to consider it =\

But yes—definitely the Saturation Knob could take advantage of the folded view very easily.

Would enjoy seeing the Leveler and DeEsser with folded view controls, but those are already great sizes—efficiently sized—great layouts. 

The FET is just large. Sometimes I reach for the MCLASS just for it's convenient size in a chain lol. I was tempted to submit a rendering of the FET similar to what I suggested for RP-Verb in the past. But I know they would probably never change the overall GUI; and it's not as huge as RP-Verb was; and I don't see too many people complaining about it's current size. It seems to just sit right in the pocket of 'large, but not too ridiculously large.' Which is why some additions to the folded view would be a perfect solution/compromise  

I'll hang onto hope for a distant future reconsideration from Softube...

[joeyluck]

Here's another!

GVXT just updated GClip to include knobs on the collapsed view.

Thanks, Graham!

 

[joeyluck]

Another great one: Skope M4!

 

[joeyluck]

Please welcome to the club, Alien Seed Tech's PSDN CV Envelope Generator.
Phew! Now if only it's name could be collapsed ;P
Oh I see it now lol: PSDN-Env

[EpiGenetik]

Interesting discussion, and one worth noting for future developers

I'd just like to point out, in the interests of fairness to Softube, that not all software companies will have in-house GUI designers/developers, particularly when the 3D asset format is not the standard bread and butter for the company, as is the case for Softube at this time. It's well within the realms of possibility that there is an external consultant on their 3D GUI content. This is most likely a bigger problem for more established companies too, with continuous maintenance updates and feature upgrades of previous products to be provided.

Easier for them to do it going forward than it is for legacy products which the initial sales bang will have fizzled out somewhat.

Cheers
B

[JoshuaPhilgarlic]

Interesting discussion, and one worth noting for future developers

I'd just like to point out, in the interests of fairness to Softube, that not all software companies will have in-house GUI designers/developers, particularly when the 3D asset format is not the standard bread and butter for the company, as is the case for Softube at this time. It's well within the realms of possibility that there is an external consultant on their 3D GUI content. This is most likely a bigger problem for more established companies too, with continuous maintenance updates and feature upgrades of previous products to be provided.

Easier for them to do it going forward than it is for legacy products which the initial sales bang will have fizzled out somewhat.

Cheers
B

Sorry to disagree, but Softube is one of the few major companies in the RE universe. So who else should have access to professional GUI design? A bigger part of RE developers are Reason users (probably one-man business) with no design department at all. They advance themselves, and of course - beeing users - they may have better ideas of usability.

[EpiGenetik]

Interesting discussion, and one worth noting for future developers

I'd just like to point out, in the interests of fairness to Softube, that not all software companies will have in-house GUI designers/developers, particularly when the 3D asset format is not the standard bread and butter for the company, as is the case for Softube at this time. It's well within the realms of possibility that there is an external consultant on their 3D GUI content. This is most likely a bigger problem for more established companies too, with continuous maintenance updates and feature upgrades of previous products to be provided.

Easier for them to do it going forward than it is for legacy products which the initial sales bang will have fizzled out somewhat.

Cheers
B

Sorry to disagree, but Softube is one of the few major companies in the RE universe. So who else should have access to professional GUI design? A bigger part of RE developers are Reason users (probably one-man business) with no design department at all. They advance themselves, and of course - beeing users - they may have better ideas of usability.

I can't confirm if this is indeed the case with Softube, but a larger company who already employs someone to do 2D graphics for VST/RTAS etc will not necessarily employ someone to do 3D just for one format that they're dipping their toes in the water with - it's cheaper in the short term to hire a freelancer, particularly if your main GUI guy is busy with the other company product cycles.

The one man companies who are "just starting out" don't have such an issue with legacy products and standards. Keep in mind here that the GUI is going to be the lions share of the work for any VST to RE port, where the port is at all possible.

[joeyluck]

New to the family:

A/B Audio & CV Switch


Thanks Pongasoft! And thanks to challism for suggesting this to them!


Another for the list is Iridium:


I suppose I also missed the A/B 12 Switch from Pongasoft previously:

[joeyluck]

Also, Megasaur gives us access to the Gate:


It's been a while since I updated this thread. Any others I'm missing?