PX-7 Operators Must Need Additive Waveforms( Title Edited )

[Lunesis]

and i use a word call "Worthless".  i did not wish to insult PX-7. PX-7 was top RE in my wish list past time until last black Friday. and i also like it. if i don't like why i bought it. if my topic headline make PX-7 users  upset i'm sorry for that. 
but i'm still with my waveforms option. i'd like to move with time....... 

I'm having a tough time believing this for some reason..

[joeyluck]

What happened to the previous font?  Looked nice.  And can we ban font colors?  Lol

[boobytrap]

What happened to the previous font?  Looked nice.  And can we ban font colors?  Lol

madmacman
 
 
madmacman



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   have a problem about big letters.

[tibah]

I think we're done here.

[Lunesis]

What happened to the previous font?  Looked nice.  And can we ban font colors?  Lol

http://www.reasontalk.com/post/forum-su ... 1285952124

[joeyluck]

What happened to the previous font?  Looked nice.  And can we ban font colors?  Lol

http://www.reasontalk.com/post/forum-su ... 1285952124

Ok word.  Others being able to read is certainly more important.

[esselfortium]

Most of Dubstep and DnB users use FM-8 for make DROP section. in theory Frequency Modulation is SINE, when John M Chowning who Found in 1967. that's the theory of DX-7. But after that it's modified with time. it's comes with time and new genres.

I would argue that the vast majority of synths available in Reason aren't limited to any one particular genre of music, PX7 included.

honestly i'm not a professional sound engineer or music maker. i expect to make hard Dubstep Growl Bass drops in easy way. 

Well, there's always subtractive synthesis from Thor or Subtractor. That's a lot easier, both for programming from scratch and for the availability of countless more presets.

Though I'm not entirely sure how one can so confidently declare a synth to be worthless, or worthless for modern music, or whatever, if they don't consider themselves to have a professional-level understanding of synthesis. Subtractor has often been called limited and outdated, too, but you can craft a huge variety of sounds with it if you put in the time to understand its workings.

[lowpryo]

a great producer doesn't complain about limitations, he embraces them.

[kloeckno]

If you want to make a saw wave with FM, it's basically just one operator modulating another at the same frequency with the modulator turned up high. And feedback helps to add some more brightness.

So in other words, the extra waveforms are for people who want a shortcut in most cases! Especially if they say they're "not sound designers" or something similar.

[EnochLight]

:t2018:

 

[frog974new]

what about we're talking here :frown:  

But this classic DX-7 Clone is worthless for EDM, Dubstep or DnB.

in my mind, ( no offense here ) .. first make music then see its a Edm , DnB ... then may be people understand the powerfull of some Re like as the Px7 .

[Rice]

Sounds like someone from PH trolling trying to use 'reverse psychology'

[Pepin]

Here are some rough approximations of analog waveforms using two operators (from The Complete DX7 by Howard Massey):

(ratios are Modulator:Carrier)

Sawtooth
1:1 with modulator level 99

Square
2:1 with modulator level 71
+To change pulse width, change carrier to a higher odd number (2:3, 2:5, etc.)

Triangle
2:1 with modulator level 45

[challism]

Don't use a hammer to paint the wall. 

You have to use PX7 for FM synthesis, nothing more.  If you don't like FM synthesis, then you are correct, PX7 is worthless (to you) because that is what it does.  Personally, I love Px7 and use it all time.  I find it to be quite valuable and am continually surprised at the wide variety of sounds I can get out of it.  But to each his own... you don't like it, that's fine with me.  But I do fee like you are trying to use the tool for the wrong job.

[pedrocaetanos]

Major troll thread. Move out folks.

You mean it's a boobytrap?

[MirEko]

What a worthless post...

The px7 is killer for drum&bass sounds

[selig]

Can I just make an observation or two here about this thread (and some suggestions for everyone to consider)? BTW - No rules are being broken here that I'm aware of, but…

This is reminding me of PUF threads - many comments, little said. Do we want to carry this leftover attitude from the old PUF here?

There are two issues here IMO, and options for how it could have been handled. The OP, who I don't believe did this on purpose, could have more carefully considered the post title. Almost all everyone is responding to is the word "WORTHLESS" - eliminate that word and "tone" and this would have been a different thread IMO. For example, this COULD have been a very enlightening thread about sines vs complex waveforms in FM synthesis. But instead most jump on the "worthless" train. I'll just comment that most would agree that no instrument is truly worthless to everyone (there's value for someone in almost anything), and there's no point in arguing that to death here. 

The other issue is that everyone who responded only to the "worthless" comment could have taken a different tack as well, IMO. Again, trying to prove the worth of something, especially to someone who doesn't see it in the first place, is a fairly dead end approach in my experience. Asking the OP to clarify if that's what they meant (before jumping on them for using that word) is but one option for those responding to potentially dramatic threads.

Bottom line - it's pretty obvious thread titles like this can spawn drama for days - this thread is longer than any other in this sub-forum (with what little useful content it contains being well hidden among the weeds)! As a community, we can choose to "pick on" the OP for a poorly worded title and create more drama, or we can help each other to recognize and reduce the drama and guide the conversation to more positive places.

And to ALL thread starters - it's your responsibility to try to create interesting topics that are useful to the community, and to guide those topics back "on topic" if they stray. Or you can allow them to stray if that's OK with you, it's your thread! I'm just pointing out that these types of "absolute" titles provoke drama (mainly because they don't really encourage a dialog), and I'm guessing most (like me) came here to get away from that and to try to raise the signal and lower the noise on the forum!

It's EVERYONE'S job to make this the place we want to be, not just the mods!

Just my 2 cents, carry on!

[Exowildebeest]

Let me input something technical and hopefully interesting then:

While I like PX7, Thor is still closer to my ideal FM synth (my ideal FM synth in RE doesn't exist at the moment :frown: ). For instance, the Mod Matrix makes programming much more intuitive than browsing through predefined algorithms. Regarding waveforms, I love using noise as a modulator, something that's easily done in Thor, with many different kinds of noise, but not easily in PX7 (not that you can't make noise using modulated sines, it's just extra work).

[boobytrap]

Almost all everyone is responding to is the word "WORTHLESS" - eliminate that word and "tone" and this would have been a different thread IMO.

New Title - 

PX-7 Operators Must Need Additive Waveforms, or 2nd Generation PX-8 in Future. 

I love FM synthases and i love PX-7 as a DX-7 legend.  i'm really sorry for that word call "worthless". just only want waveforms more than SINE. very simple & useful upgrade. that's better for beginner(new born) to expert for Dnb & Dubstep.  

“We are products of our past, but we don't have to be prisoners of it.” 
― Rick Warren   

[avasopht]

New Title - 

PX-7 Operators Must Need Additive Waveforms, or 2nd Generation PX-8 in Future. 

I love FM synthases and i love PX-7 as a DX-7 legend.  i'm really sorry for that word call "worthless". just only want waveforms more than SINE. very simple & useful upgrade. that's better for beginner(new born) to expert for Dnb & Dubstep.  

“We are products of our past, but we don't have to be prisoners of it.” 
― Rick Warren   

For FM synthesis, what would you be doing with complex waveforms? I would imagine the actual functionality desired would come from combining PX7 with another sound source such as Thor, Maelstrom or Subtractor.

[joeyluck]

New Title - 

PX-7 Operators Must Need Additive Waveforms, or 2nd Generation PX-8 in Future. 

I love FM synthases and i love PX-7 as a DX-7 legend.  i'm really sorry for that word call "worthless". just only want waveforms more than SINE. very simple & useful upgrade. that's better for beginner(new born) to expert for Dnb & Dubstep.  

“We are products of our past, but we don't have to be prisoners of it.” 
― Rick Warren   

You are able to update the thread title in this forums by editing your first post

[joeyluck]

I see the title changed.  Again, proving that this forum is a great place  Thanks for the consideration!

As a PX7 user, I am familiar with the approach mentioned by Pepin, but I don't think it would hurt to allow alternative waveforms to be chosen—if that helps someone else with the approach to programming the PX7...if it's easy to implement...?

[KEVMOVE02]

I love a lively debate. I respect well made arguments. For the life of me, I can't figure out the merit of this topic. Wanting a neo PX7; fair enough. But from the beginning, the PX7 was intended to be a recreation of the entire DX7 product line IN the Reason Rack. Meaning that I (like the wealthy musicians in the 80s) can have a rack full of DX7s. For the FM Fan, this is a wet dream made real. I'm sorry that this is not your wet dream, but what you are describing isn't a DX7. Its all the synths that came after the DX7. So pick one that meets your needs and come boast about it. Wait, was that your point? You wanted to tell us about the greatness the FM8 softsynth (or others synths like it)? 

[buddard]

For what it's worth, the Yamaha TX-81Z (from 1987 I think) has 8 different waveforms, but on the other hand it's limited to only 4 operators.

I wonder if adding those waveforms to the PX-7 would allow it to faithfully recreate TX-81Z presets as well? Or perhaps there are other differences between the two?

[selig]

I love a lively debate. I respect well made arguments. For the life of me, I can't figure out the merit of this topic. Wanting a neo PX7; fair enough. But from the beginning, the PX7 was intended to be a recreation of the entire DX7 product line IN the Reason Rack. Meaning that I (like the wealthy musicians in the 80s) can have a rack full of DX7s. For the FM Fan, this is a wet dream made real. I'm sorry that this is not your wet dream, but what you are describing isn't a DX7. Its all the synths that came after the DX7. So pick one that meets your needs and come boast about it. Wait, was that your point? You wanted to tell us about the greatness the FM8 softsynth (or others synths like it)? 

I get that you were confused about the original point of this thread, but that has now been clarified by the OP (thank you for that, boobytrap). Not worth arguing over what we think the OPs point was IMO; if you want a lively debate let's just take his word that he is simply asking for more waveform options for the PX7, and from there we can debate the pros and cons of that approach. 

If this thread still has no merit for you, that's par for the course - not every thread has merit for every reader, just like not every synth has merit (worth) for every user!

Bottom Line:
The debate over what the OP means or doesn't mean seems to be getting us nowhere at present, so I'm suggesting we move on for the sake of a drama free forum, that's all.

So in that spirit, everyone: what's your stance - pro Sine or pro Complex? It would be great to hear someone present audio examples of what some of you are talking about btw.