Murf - State of Development

[Murf]

Hi All, I wanted to post to let everyone know I have not given up on Reason RE development. I tend to take long breaks from this space, but I am back again after my latest hiatus.

The first thing I wanted to mention is that I will be eventually replacing all of the "MODRACK" free RE's with a smaller number of combined REs (still free), primarily to reduce the number of things I have on the store (and therefore have to maintain and update).
This does not mean that anyone who uses these RE's will no longer have access to them, it just means they will disappear from the Shop in the future, but the functionality will be still available in a new smaller group of RE's.
(Anyone who has already downloaded the current ones will still get to keep those after they are removed).
If you don't know what I am talking about, please check them out here https://re.murf.net/modrack/, they are free, and great for people who are playing with Modular Synthesis.
Here is a preview of the first one that will combine LFO, ADSR, and SEQ (my CV based MODRACK REs) in an all in one RE:
.

MR_UT1.jpg (161.56 KiB) Viewed 10830 times

MR_UT3.jpg (172.93 KiB) Viewed 10830 times

And the back panel updates dynamically depending on which module you selected

MR_UT4.jpg (73.34 KiB) Viewed 10830 times

.
.
I expect the final number of new MODRACK REs to be 3 or so, and any new things I add to the range in the future will be just added to these (unless they are not a single 1U in height of course) as an extra module in an update.

In other areas, I will continue to do some more ports from the VCV ecosystem, more mixers, and maybe even something entirely invented by me.

I also hope this "state of development" style of post starts a trend, with more RE developers doing something similar here on Reasontalk, I would love to hear from them!

All the best,
Murf.

[zumBeispiel]

Thank you very much Murf!
Good job!

[Loque]

How dies the new things work? Everything still works, even if not visible? And the CV?

[RobC]

I always hoped someone would focus on creating individual modules for Reason.

Especially great for Combinator and less mess in the rack.

[Murf]

How dies the new things work? Everything still works, even if not visible? And the CV?

Just one module per instance Loque, so drag one to the rack for LFO, another for SEQ, etc. I view this as just a way to compact a whole lot of similar modular RE's into single REs, nothing groundbreaking, just neater and easier to manage. CV remains the same as the original RE in each case.
If you select the "Blank" module the RE will do nothing, not sure about this, but I do not want a default that is one of the modules. I dont think I do anyway, we will see.
I did not think Reason would approve the concept, but I have preliminary approval now.
Murf.

[Loque]

How dies the new things work? Everything still works, even if not visible? And the CV?

Just one module per instance Loque, so drag one to the rack for LFO, another for SEQ, etc. I view this as just a way to compact a whole lot of similar modular RE's into single REs, nothing groundbreaking, just neater and easier to manage. CV remains the same as the original RE in each case.
If you select the "Blank" module the RE will do nothing, not sure about this, but I do not want a default that is one of the modules. I dont think I do anyway, we will see.
I did not think Reason would approve the concept, but I have preliminary approval now.
Murf.

I think it is weird to have CV which does nothing.

I don't see a problem with individual modules. It's up to you, how you make your products.

Just note, that old patches cannot be shared anymore if you remove your old RE.

[_andreypetr_]

How dies the new things work? Everything still works, even if not visible? And the CV?

Just one module per instance Loque, so drag one to the rack for LFO, another for SEQ, etc. I view this as just a way to compact a whole lot of similar modular RE's into single REs, nothing groundbreaking, just neater and easier to manage. CV remains the same as the original RE in each case.
If you select the "Blank" module the RE will do nothing, not sure about this, but I do not want a default that is one of the modules. I dont think I do anyway, we will see.
I did not think Reason would approve the concept, but I have preliminary approval now.
Murf.

Maybe "thru" or CV splitter+merger will be a good alternative

[RobC]

I look for what I call "dead processing" solutions.

In other words, you generate a sound (for example, length is just as long as a wave cycle). And then you process that however you wish. Be it FM, AM, or any modulation (or similar) effect you wish. But I gotta stress how crazy rare sample-based FM is. Things like loading a wave cycle into sample-oscillator 'A', where another sample loaded into sample-oscillator 'B', which modulates the pitch of oscillator 'A' at audio rate.

Yes, I know it's a mess how I word things, but point is, there's literally no sample-FM. That would be really cool to have.

[Murf]

I think it is weird to have CV which does nothing.

You mean the default blank panel? or..?

Just note, that old patches cannot be shared anymore if you remove your old RE.

This is a very good point, I may consider a stand alone patch converter tool if I go ahead and remove them (still not decided)
Murf

[Murf]

Maybe "thru" or CV splitter+merger will be a good alternative

I like the idea of the blank panel being a splitter merger... Thanks!
This will work for the audio processing versions of the RE as well

Murf

[Murf]

I look for what I call "dead processing" solutions.

In other words, you generate a sound (for example, length is just as long as a wave cycle). And then you process that however you wish. Be it FM, AM, or any modulation (or similar) effect you wish. But I gotta stress how crazy rare sample-based FM is. Things like loading a wave cycle into sample-oscillator 'A', where another sample loaded into sample-oscillator 'B', which modulates the pitch of oscillator 'A' at audio rate.

I guess this is what modular synthesis is all about, hooking modules together to achieve a unique outcome.
Modular in Reason is primarily limited by the latency introduced of one processing cycle every time you hook one modular output to the input of another (forward or reverse).
Coding them all into one RE is the solution (including signal flow) for example, Complex 1, which is not what I am trying to do with these new REs (as a side point), though I have considered it and may attempt something like that in the future.

Yes, I know it's a mess how I word things, but point is, there's literally no sample-FM. That would be really cool to have.

Would an FM module be something that would fill this void?
Something like this? https://library.vcvrack.com/Bogaudio/Bogaudio-FMOp
It does not do sampling though, it is just an FM Operator module
If you can show me a real world or VST equivalent I may get a better idea.
Murf

[Loque]

I think it is weird to have CV which does nothing.

You mean the default blank panel? or..?

Just note, that old patches cannot be shared anymore if you remove your old RE.

This is a very good point, I may consider a stand alone patch converter tool if I go ahead and remove them (still not decided)
Murf

Regarding CV, I meant if in general. It is confusing to have controls on the back relying of specific configuration on the front.

And a converter does not help in Combinators.

[joeyluck]

You mean the default blank panel? or..?


This is a very good point, I may consider a stand alone patch converter tool if I go ahead and remove them (still not decided)
Murf

Regarding CV, I meant if in general. It is confusing to have controls on the back relying of specific configuration on the front.

And a converter does not help in Combinators.

I guess you could look at it similarly as assignable CV ins and outs on other devices, where they don't do anything unless you have them assigned in a mod matrix or whatever on the front of the device. Although with this you could see on the back what is assigned and what isn't for the module chosen.

I'm also interested in experimenting with flipping modules while having CV routed just to see how it changes things. Doing that may or may not have useful results, but still something I'd try

[Murf]

I think the point of what I am trying for has been overlooked, once you load this RE into your rack and pick the module you want and cable it up, you wont be changing it to another module, it is just a "packaging efficiency" thing.
Murf

[joeyluck]

I think the point of what I am trying for has been overlooked, once you load this RE into your rack and pick the module you want and cable it up, you wont be changing it to another module, it is just a "packaging efficiency" thing.
Murf

Oh yeah I get that. I'm just saying I would still try changing modules lol

[Pepin]

I'd recommend making those labels on the back look like displays of some kind. That way, it's more obvious to the user that they can change.
The dropdown arrow on the front could also have a display beside it that shows the current setting.

Those would alleviate any confusion IMO.

[Murf]

Oh yeah I get that. I'm just saying I would still try changing modules lol

Change modules to what? Do you mean dont have a blank module as default? Like have a CV splitter/merger/Util instead?
If so, I like that idea and will probably do that, if I even go ahead with this concept, it is not a 100% given yet.
Murf.

[Murf]

I'd recommend making those labels on the back look like displays of some kind. That way, it's more obvious to the user that they can change.
The dropdown arrow on the front could also have a display beside it that shows the current setting.

Those would alleviate any confusion IMO.

This is a good idea, but depends on how much I want to move away from the simple look of the original MODRACK series.
The intent was to match it as close as possible.
Murf.

[joeyluck]

Oh yeah I get that. I'm just saying I would still try changing modules lol

Change modules to what? Do you mean dont have a blank module as default? Like have a CV splitter/merger/Util instead?
If so, I like that idea and will probably do that, if I even go ahead with this concept, it is not a 100% given yet.
Murf.

I just mean change between the modules you bundle into one, because then the CV is doing something different. So say I have a patch built with cables connected and then I change the modules. Not sure how useful that exploration would be...might just render the patch broken, might result in something terrible, but I wound try it.

[Murf]

Change modules to what? Do you mean dont have a blank module as default? Like have a CV splitter/merger/Util instead?
If so, I like that idea and will probably do that, if I even go ahead with this concept, it is not a 100% given yet.
Murf.

I just mean change between the modules you bundle into one, because then the CV is doing something different. So say I have a patch built with cables connected and then I change the modules. Not sure how useful that exploration would be...might just render the patch broken, might result in something terrible, but I wound try it.

Oh I see hehe, yes, I would expect terrible, but who knows, innovation is born from experimentation.
Murf.

[Marc64]

Just a heads up. I noticed a typo on your website. Down where the modrack seq is and where it should say Download MODRACK SEQ for ReasonStudios Reason here. it says Download MODRACK DELAY for ReasonStudios Reason here

[Murf]

Just a heads up. I noticed a typo on your website. Down where the modrack seq is and where it should say Download MODRACK SEQ for ReasonStudios Reason here. it says Download MODRACK DELAY for ReasonStudios Reason here

Thanks!!

[RobC]

I look for what I call "dead processing" solutions.

In other words, you generate a sound (for example, length is just as long as a wave cycle). And then you process that however you wish. Be it FM, AM, or any modulation (or similar) effect you wish. But I gotta stress how crazy rare sample-based FM is. Things like loading a wave cycle into sample-oscillator 'A', where another sample loaded into sample-oscillator 'B', which modulates the pitch of oscillator 'A' at audio rate.

I guess this is what modular synthesis is all about, hooking modules together to achieve a unique outcome.
Modular in Reason is primarily limited by the latency introduced of one processing cycle every time you hook one modular output to the input of another (forward or reverse).
Coding them all into one RE is the solution (including signal flow) for example, Complex 1, which is not what I am trying to do with these new REs (as a side point), though I have considered it and may attempt something like that in the future.

Yes, I know it's a mess how I word things, but point is, there's literally no sample-FM. That would be really cool to have.

Would an FM module be something that would fill this void?
Something like this? https://library.vcvrack.com/Bogaudio/Bogaudio-FMOp
It does not do sampling though, it is just an FM Operator module
If you can show me a real world or VST equivalent I may get a better idea.
Murf

Ah! I never knew about the latency thing. That explains why certain things aren't possible/haven't been made yet.

As for FM: I think Reaktor has a sampler module or similar, with FM capability.
FM is just pitch modulation at audio rate, right? Although, the best use is, if at least the carrier ostillator is no longer than a wave cycle. (Think Subtractor, where oscillator 1 can be FM modulated by the noise oscillator.)

That said, I wonder if there's a solution to FM's limited use. Say, we make a cool sound, that has movement, and sample a few seconds of it. After that, there's no way to properly use FM on such long sample, otherwise it would just sound like a broken tape, or random noise.
However, I'm not sure if granular FM exists. If a longer sample was split into small bits, as short as a wave cycle, then those grains perhaps could be modulated.

Then, Europa synth comes to mind, which can load sounds and turn them into partials. I wonder, if grains can be turned into partials, and the two technologies could be combined...

Yes, I have complicated thinking... : D Makes sense in my head, but not as easy to type it out.

[Murf]

Ah! I never knew about the latency thing. That explains why certain things aren't possible/haven't been made yet.

As for FM: I think Reaktor has a sampler module or similar, with FM capability.
FM is just pitch modulation at audio rate, right? Although, the best use is, if at least the carrier ostillator is no longer than a wave cycle. (Think Subtractor, where oscillator 1 can be FM modulated by the noise oscillator.)

That said, I wonder if there's a solution to FM's limited use. Say, we make a cool sound, that has movement, and sample a few seconds of it. After that, there's no way to properly use FM on such long sample, otherwise it would just sound like a broken tape, or random noise.
However, I'm not sure if granular FM exists. If a longer sample was split into small bits, as short as a wave cycle, then those grains perhaps could be modulated.

Then, Europa synth comes to mind, which can load sounds and turn them into partials. I wonder, if grains can be turned into partials, and the two technologies could be combined...

Yes, I have complicated thinking... : D Makes sense in my head, but not as easy to type it out.

As far as simple modular stuff goes, FM is pretty straightforward
Check this out:

Murf