Zvork SL1 - MIDI control?!

[Faastwalker]

Been getting into this device of late. Bought it some time ago but never got around to putting it to use for some reason.

I've just tried mapping my MIDI control to the x24 rotary controls on the front. Easy enough. But I noticed when I switched from set A to another set none of the mapping so worked. I went back to set A and everything worked. So hang on - 24 controls mapped but we need to do this for each set?! That's 288 mappings?! I might be missing something but would'nt it make more sense to just have the 24 controls mapped the same for each set so control remains when you switch between sets.

Maybe there is a good reason why it's set up like this. Maybe there is a way around it with a Remote template so that the same physical control can be mapped to a parameter across all the sets? I guess I'll have to try this but at the moment I'm just a bit baffled as to why the thing is set up like this. It doesn't seem to lend itself to control from a MIDI controller ...... Unless you have 288 knobs / sliders to assign to cater for each set!

[Olivier]

I have it mapped to my BCR2000. When i switch between two sets, i also have to go to another page of the map on the BCR which effectively reassigns all the dials. Making pages in maps is something that you can do on all sorts of controllers. Mapping wise thats how it works unfortunately. So yes, i can operate voltSL by making pages in my remote map which i have to switch to edit other sets.

From what i think i understand about how RE's receive their patch data, the current setup makes sense to me. But i agree some kind of Meta dial available for targeting in maps would be nice to have. Probably not there else i guess it would be implemented on props own instruments which it is not. Check for example the delay time dial on Parsec. 2 dials in 1 again.

[Faastwalker]

I have it mapped to my BCR2000. When i switch between two sets, i also have to go to another page of the map on the BCR which effectively reassigns all the dials. Making pages in maps is something that you can do on all sorts of controllers. Mapping wise thats how it works unfortunately. So yes, i can operate voltSL by making pages in my remote map which i have to switch to edit other sets.

Good you got it working with the BCR2000. I guess I could do something similar with the MPK49. But it still seems a weird way to set it up. So how do you switch pages on the map? Seems like it might be a pain jumping from set to set whilst also having to jump pages if you want MIDI control.

From what i think i understand about how RE's receive their patch data, the current setup makes sense to me. But i agree some kind of Meta dial available for targeting in maps would be nice to have. Probably not there else i guess it would be implemented on props own instruments which it is not. Check for example the delay time dial on Parsec. 2 dials in 1 again.

If that’s the way it works then that's it I guess. Not much we can do. I’ve experienced the same thing you mentioned with Parsec with Viking. The oscillator tuning has course & fine tuning on the same knob, with a different MIDI CC for each. I had issues with this when making a Lemur template for it. Found a neat way around. But it’s not such a big deal when you only have two values for one parameter (or one control I should say). A bit different with SL1 where you would have up to 12 for one control! Maybe I’ll just forget about MIDI control & go back to the mouse?! Unless I can get another Lemur template fixed up ……… I wouldn’t know where to start!

[Faastwalker]

............ then again I suppose it's not too much to have to map!!!

[Olivier]

Making pages in a map is not too difficult. I'm not home right now so I can't give an example for the MPK (I have one) but I'm positive it can be done.

[Faastwalker]

Making pages in a map is not too difficult. I'm not home right now so I can't give an example for the MPK (I have one) but I'm positive it can be done.

Cool. Would be good to see how that works

So presumably, in the case of the SL1, the 'pages' are changed by the set buttons?

[Olivier]

Making pages in a map is not too difficult. I'm not home right now so I can't give an example for the MPK (I have one) but I'm positive it can be done.

Cool. Would be good to see how that works

So presumably, in the case of the SL1, the 'pages' are changed by the set buttons?

i'm not sure I understand you correctly. Once I get home I can make an example.. Then it will be more clear

[Faastwalker]

Making pages in a map is not too difficult. I'm not home right now so I can't give an example for the MPK (I have one) but I'm positive it can be done.

Cool. Would be good to see how that works

So presumably, in the case of the SL1, the 'pages' are changed by the set buttons?

i'm not sure I understand you correctly. Once I get home I can make an example.. Then it will be more clear

I'm not sure I understand me correctly either! I'm probably not explaining my thinking to well ........ but I think I know what I'm thinking!!


I've been trying to get my head around how I can make a Lemur template for controlling SL1. I've got some ideas, some of which I implemented for my Viking / VK-1 template;

https://liine.net/en/community/user-library/view/361/

But I'm not sure how to translate the way things are set-up in the Remote template to Lemur. Will have a play tonight & try some things out.

[Faastwalker]

......... getting knowhere fast.

The more I think about it the more stupid the MIDI set-up on SL1 is. It should be the same MIDI control of the 24 knobs across all sets surely?! It's just daft the way it is.

[zvork]

Hi,
A number of you have had this issue. It is due to how remote / MIDI mapping works in Reason and / or how rack extension GUI works. The mapping of knobs to MIDI controllers (or remote controllers) is in fact a misunderstanding. You are in fact mapping device properties to MIDI controllers, not the physical UI knob. A RE knob (button, fader, etc.) is itself mapped to that same property. The Volt SL-1 works by switching the properties mapped to each control knob when you switch sets. But the MIDI mapping still remains linked to the same property, which is no longer mapped to the control knob.

Why do we do this, that is, change the properties linked to each knob, instead of keeping the same properties for each control knob and just change the value of that property when we change sets? Well, that's because the RE SDK doesn't allow us to do this. A RE engine cannot change the values of its properties, unless they are purely visual feedbacks like meters or blinking lights. In a nutshell, the RE engine can't modify properties that the user can modify at the same time. I can't really go into much detail as this would break the NDA every RE developer has signed with the Props.

Another point to understand is that for a certain number of physical MIDI controllers, what you are asking won't be perfect too because if we changed sets on the Volt SL-1, in some way, your physical MIDI knobs should rotate to the correct position. Unless you have alpha dials with a LCD display, this won't be practical.

So the besk workaround we've found, discussing this with other users, is, if you want to do this, use 2 Volt SL-1s. The first one is used for the basic set transitions, and can be considered like your usual SL-1. The second one is an "offset" controller that will remain on the same set all the time. This one you can map to your MIDI Controllers. Then, on the back panels, you just have to merge the CV control outputs of the first SL-1 with the second one in bipolar mode, for each controls you are using, and then use that signal as usual. Your MIDI controller can then be used to offset the control values (not replace them). We've attached a combinator with this setup to this post.

I hope this clears any misunderstandings on the Volt SL-1.

[Faastwalker]

Thanks for the very detailed explanation So it is really a limitation of the SDK as much as anything? Oh well. Not much to be done then.

Thanks also for the work-around Combinator. It's a decent way to keep the sets working whilst also retaining some control over each control.

[Faastwalker]

Here's a version of the Combinator file that Zvork uploaded. This one uses JP's Miranda CV Merger in place of the standard Spider CV Merger;
https://www.dropbox.com/s/4wqq4mnksuia7 ... 1.cmb?dl=0


I made a Combinator skin for the SL1 as well;
https://www.dropbox.com/s/n15a2dhzt5lz6 ... n.jpg?dl=0

[Pinkbox]

I tried the combinator from Zvork but it doesn't work very well.
When knob 01 from "transitions" Volt is set to zero, ok knob 01 from "offset" is giving an outpout cv signal from -100 to +100.
But, for example, if knob 01 from "transitions" is set to -100, I'll never manage to get a output cv signal higher than zero.

Attached the file.

[Faastwalker]

I tried the combinator from Zvork but it doesn't work very well.
When knob 01 from "transitions" Volt is set to zero, ok knob 01 from "offset" is giving an outpout cv signal from -100 to +100.
But, for example, if knob 01 from "transitions" is set to -100, I'll never manage to get a output cv signal higher than zero.

Attached the file.

That's about the best it can do the way it's set-up. It's only a work around for the problem of MIDI control over the SL1. Not ideal but the best we can do with the way it is.