Can't get Drum Sequencer to behave correctly!

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Timedog
Posts: 5
Joined: 31 Jan 2021

Post 31 Jan 2021

So I'm making a song in Studio One 4 Pro, I am not using drum sequencer for the entire song, I have Reason Rack Plugin muted until bar 43 when I want to start using it. Not sure if this info is relevant or not.

For some reason drum sequencer starts playing my pattern not at the pattern start, but 1 beat into the pattern (eg. it starts playing the pattern on the snare when the pattern I made starts with a kick). I cannot seem to massage any midi cc's that i'm aware of to work around this weird offset.

The offset seems to go away if I change my "reset step" from 112 to 108, but that completely messes up my polyrhythm, as it makes the timing all wrong. I need the pattern to both start at the beginning (y'know, that place where all sequencer patterns should always begin unless there's an offset parameter) AND I need it to reset after 112 beats.

I must be missing something super obvious, please help.
Last edited by Timedog on 31 Jan 2021, edited 1 time in total.

PhillipOrdonez
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Location: Colombia

Post 31 Jan 2021

I would guess it has to do with the bar number you're starting with?

Easy solution? I would send to track and simply move the midi to where it I supposed to be and forget about it. πŸ˜‚
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PhillipOrdonez
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Joined: 20 Oct 2017
Location: Colombia

Post 31 Jan 2021

Have you tried extending the pattern clip a bit to the left?

If it starts with a snare on the downbeat, my guess is it has to do with the starting bar number not being 1, 17, 41, 65, etc, you know, the big ones...
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Timedog
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Joined: 31 Jan 2021

Post 31 Jan 2021

PhillipOrdonez wrote: ↑
31 Jan 2021
I would guess it has to do with the bar number you're starting with?

Easy solution? I would send to track and simply move the midi to where it I supposed to be and forget about it. πŸ˜‚
I have no idea, but the behavior is completely insane. printing to track doesn't fit with my workflow and makes using the drum sequencer nearly pointless.

PhillipOrdonez
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Post 31 Jan 2021

πŸ€·β€β™‚οΈ
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Timedog
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Joined: 31 Jan 2021

Post 31 Jan 2021

Well if someone that actually has helpful advice on my particular problem could reply, that would be great.

PhillipOrdonez
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Location: Colombia

Post 31 Jan 2021

Yeah guys, come on, help him out!
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Timedog
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Joined: 31 Jan 2021

Post 31 Jan 2021

I could move all of my clips in my song on all tracks to the left or right to compensate for Drum Sequencer acting weird and starting the drum loop in a weird spot when I change the reset step number, but it'll likely lead to some other error on the other tracks with automation or something else, and it's not something I should have to do. I'm guessing there's just something weird I'm not understanding about Drum Sequencer or some midi CC i can tweak, but I can't seem to google to find a solution.

I tried automating the reset step, starting it at 108 (which causes the loop to begin at the correct time), then immediately changing it to 112, but the playback skips ahead in the loop along with the reset step number :(

edit: I'm using Studio One 4 Pro, added that info to the OP in case it's not an issue in other DAWs.

PhillipOrdonez
Posts: 1756
Joined: 20 Oct 2017
Location: Colombia

Post 31 Jan 2021

Timedog wrote: ↑
31 Jan 2021
I could move all of my clips in my song on all tracks to the left or right to compensate for Drum Sequencer acting weird and starting the drum loop in a weird spot when I change the reset step number, but it'll likely lead to some other error on the other tracks with automation or something else, and it's not something I should have to do. I'm guessing there's just something weird I'm not understanding about Drum Sequencer or some midi CC i can tweak, but I can't seem to google to find a solution.

I tried automating the reset step, starting it at 108 (which causes the loop to begin at the correct time), then immediately changing it to 112, but the playback skips ahead in the loop along with the reset step number :(

edit: I'm using Studio One 4 Pro, added that info to the OP in case it's not an issue in other DAWs.
How much did you have to move everything for it to match? One bar?
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PhillipOrdonez
Posts: 1756
Joined: 20 Oct 2017
Location: Colombia

Post 31 Jan 2021

Just tested in live, pattern starts right on the money with the kick right on the downbeat when I automate the pattern. Both with step reset off and at 128.

Perhaps this has to do with your track lengths.

I imagine you have the pattern automated in the off until bar 43. If automating it just a bit before bar 43, like at 42.3.5 or something does not work, then it might be too do with the step lengths.

Is the drum sequencer locked to the transport? I would guess it is....

Just tested for it to start on the two (clap) and it went silent until the pattern started again, but automating it a smidge before did the trick.

I'm sorry if I'm not being helpful. I do not use S1, and it is difficult to assess without having the patch in front of me to figure out what's causing it to go haywire 😟
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antic604
Posts: 648
Joined: 02 Apr 2020

Post 01 Feb 2021

Timedog wrote: ↑
31 Jan 2021
So I'm making a song in Studio One 4 Pro, I am not using drum sequencer for the entire song, I have Reason Rack Plugin muted until bar 43 when I want to start using it. Not sure if this info is relevant or not.

For some reason drum sequencer starts playing my pattern not at the pattern start, but 1 beat into the pattern (eg. it starts playing the pattern on the snare when the pattern I made starts with a kick). I cannot seem to massage any midi cc's that i'm aware of to work around this weird offset.

The offset seems to go away if I change my "reset step" from 112 to 108, but that completely messes up my polyrhythm, as it makes the timing all wrong. I need the pattern to both start at the beginning (y'know, that place where all sequencer patterns should always begin unless there's an offset parameter) AND I need it to reset after 112 beats.

I must be missing something super obvious, please help.
Pattern devices running in other DAW than Reason don't have a way to tell they've been triggered, so they trigger at the start and just run in sync with transport. In Reason you can insert a pattern clip anywhere and it will start from there.

Just insert enough empty bars at the start of your song (move the whole song to the right) so that the drum pattern starts as you want.
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Timedog
Posts: 5
Joined: 31 Jan 2021

Post 01 Feb 2021

antic604 wrote: ↑
01 Feb 2021
Timedog wrote: ↑
31 Jan 2021
So I'm making a song in Studio One 4 Pro, I am not using drum sequencer for the entire song, I have Reason Rack Plugin muted until bar 43 when I want to start using it. Not sure if this info is relevant or not.

For some reason drum sequencer starts playing my pattern not at the pattern start, but 1 beat into the pattern (eg. it starts playing the pattern on the snare when the pattern I made starts with a kick). I cannot seem to massage any midi cc's that i'm aware of to work around this weird offset.

The offset seems to go away if I change my "reset step" from 112 to 108, but that completely messes up my polyrhythm, as it makes the timing all wrong. I need the pattern to both start at the beginning (y'know, that place where all sequencer patterns should always begin unless there's an offset parameter) AND I need it to reset after 112 beats.

I must be missing something super obvious, please help.
Pattern devices running in other DAW than Reason don't have a way to tell they've been triggered, so they trigger at the start and just run in sync with transport. In Reason you can insert a pattern clip anywhere and it will start from there.

Just insert enough empty bars at the start of your song (move the whole song to the right) so that the drum pattern starts as you want.
I'm just going to assume that it's not possible to use this module normally in VST format.

if the design of the module wasn't weird garbage I wouldn't need to have workarounds like this. How simple would it be to design in a parameter that allows you to change the playback location with midi cc? Or make the midi for the playback on/off switch not a weird and awful toggle? This sucks and I'm reasonably sure it will never be fixed because Reasons (pun intended).

If someone actually has a real workaround for this, I rescind my rant.

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antic604
Posts: 648
Joined: 02 Apr 2020

Post 02 Feb 2021

Timedog wrote: ↑
01 Feb 2021
I'm just going to assume that it's not possible to use this module normally in VST format.

if the design of the module wasn't weird garbage I wouldn't need to have workarounds like this. How simple would it be to design in a parameter that allows you to change the playback location with midi cc? Or make the midi for the playback on/off switch not a weird and awful toggle? This sucks and I'm reasonably sure it will never be fixed because Reasons (pun intended).

If someone actually has a real workaround for this, I rescind my rant.
Yes, ideally there should be a "button", automation destination or something to tell RRP "this is a start of the pattern". There's no other way because other DAWs don't have pattern lanes to get that info from. Let's just flood support with requests.

Have you tried my workaround, though? It's a good idea and should work unless the cycle you're trying to lock into isn't obscenely long or something. Alternatively just bounce the player to MIDI and use that moving it around however you want.

Unless you prefer to stay upset and offended by a thing not working perfectly :?
Music tech enthusiast.
DAW, VST & hardware hoarder.
My "music": https://soundcloud.com/antic604

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sonicbyte
Posts: 277
Joined: 16 Jan 2015
Location: Argentina

Post 19 Feb 2021

Same issue, If I automate to change patterns from an empty one with the pattern I want to play it starts off sync no matter what... a pretty useless player if I can't make this play in sync...
Why isn't behave like octorex for instance where you can sync every change of pattern perfectly ?

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