philosophy of creativity - Music vs. Music Theory - Ignore the Gatekeepers!

Have an urge to learn, or a calling to teach? Want to share some useful Youtube videos? Do it here!
User avatar
bxbrkrz
Posts: 2518
Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 19 Aug 2020

guitfnky wrote:
19 Aug 2020
bxbrkrz wrote:
19 Aug 2020
[yt]
😳 that was super cool
You are your own gatekeeper.
757365206c6f67696320746f207365656b20616e73776572732075736520726561736f6e20746f2066696e6420776973646f6d

User avatar
bxbrkrz
Posts: 2518
Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 19 Aug 2020

BRIGGS wrote:
19 Aug 2020
bxbrkrz wrote:
19 Aug 2020
[yt]
i loled :lol:
It was really funny the first time I saw this many moons ago.
I believe our first mean of communication was through some kind of singing, and rhythmic noises, before the invention of language.
Just a hint I had many moons ago.
757365206c6f67696320746f207365656b20616e73776572732075736520726561736f6e20746f2066696e6420776973646f6d

User avatar
EdwardKiy
Posts: 727
Joined: 02 Oct 2019

Post 19 Aug 2020

guitfnky wrote:
19 Aug 2020

this isn’t the philosophy of creativity—you’re veering into the philosophy of human consciousness and what it means to be self-aware.
I'm not veering anywhere. I told you that knowledge and awareness of knowledge are two different things.
guitfnky wrote:
19 Aug 2020
and you’re saying everyone already knows theory now, on some fundamental human level. so what exactly is there to argue about?
that's a very peculiar interpretation of what I didn't say. What there is to argue about, is that if you want to become a composer, you are learning music theory, but the method - through learning it in books, or going to a conservatory or learning it by ear (learning from applied theory) - you are learning music theory.

Let's forget the pleasure reward centers and all that jazz for the minute. That stuff may be too complicated for this discussion. I think we can at least agree that some things sound good and some things sound bad to us. This perception of good and bad is built into our brains, evident from most of us experiencing it in the same way. This has been noted, applied, re-applied and noted again by generations of people. So there's that accumulated knowledge in writing or in application, and then there's you with an experience of a single lifetime. Hopefully, you can keep accidentally discovering awesome stuff like going from dominant to tonic, like you did in your second video (props on that one), but what if humanity somehow beats you to it? Then you're behind competition, because instead of having everything before you + your own built on top of it, you will only have your own.
Last edited by EdwardKiy on 19 Aug 2020, edited 1 time in total.
Reason 12 - last chance.

User avatar
guitfnky
Posts: 3640
Joined: 19 Jan 2015

Post 19 Aug 2020

EdwardKiy wrote:
19 Aug 2020
guitfnky wrote:
19 Aug 2020

this isn’t the philosophy of creativity—you’re veering into the philosophy of human consciousness and what it means to be self-aware.
I'm not veering anywhere. I told you that knowledge and awareness of knowledge are two different things.
guitfnky wrote:
19 Aug 2020
and you’re saying everyone already knows theory now, on some fundamental human level. so what exactly is there to argue about?
that's a very peculiar interpretation of what I didn't say. What there is to argue about, is that if you want to become a composer, you are learning music theory, but the method - by ear, through books, going to a conservatory or copying something by sight - you are learning music theory.

But a good thing you went from dominant to tonic with a new tuning in your second video. That one proved me totally wrong. Turns out you don't need to know theory to write music after all.
okay man, I can't take you seriously anymore. you type up a storm, but apparently aren't willing to read answers that have already been given--the other option is that you're not comprehending them, but you're no dummy, so I find that hard to believe. an honest discussion's got to be a two-way street.

User avatar
EdwardKiy
Posts: 727
Joined: 02 Oct 2019

Post 21 Aug 2020

guitfnky wrote:
19 Aug 2020

okay man, I can't take you seriously anymore. you type up a storm, but apparently aren't willing to read answers that have already been given--the other option is that you're not comprehending them, but you're no dummy, so I find that hard to believe. an honest discussion's got to be a two-way street.
The juxtaposition of you vs the human collective. Where has this been addressed? And don't use words like "tuning", "chords" or "melody" in your videos. Come up with your own, you little wonder, you free genius, you.
Reason 12 - last chance.

User avatar
guitfnky
Posts: 3640
Joined: 19 Jan 2015

Post 21 Aug 2020

EdwardKiy wrote:
21 Aug 2020
guitfnky wrote:
19 Aug 2020

okay man, I can't take you seriously anymore. you type up a storm, but apparently aren't willing to read answers that have already been given--the other option is that you're not comprehending them, but you're no dummy, so I find that hard to believe. an honest discussion's got to be a two-way street.
The juxtaposition of you vs the human collective. Where has this been addressed? And don't use words like "tuning", "chords" or "melody" in your videos. Come up with your own, you little wonder, you free genius, you.
you seem under the impression this is all about me looking for some sort of validation. I’m happy with my creative ability—I don’t need to win you over to feel like my work is worthwhile. if that bothers you, feel free to stop commenting. I don’t mind the free bumps every so often though. ✌🏼

User avatar
EdwardKiy
Posts: 727
Joined: 02 Oct 2019

Post 21 Aug 2020

guitfnky wrote:
21 Aug 2020

you seem under the impression this is all about me looking for some sort of validation. I’m happy with my creative ability—I don’t need to win you over to feel like my work is worthwhile. if that bothers you, feel free to stop commenting. I don’t mind the free bumps every so often though. ✌🏼
I could care less about you or your creative ability. The purpose of your video is to acquire validation through giving comfort in your own or the viewers' ignorance. That is both damaging and unethical, not to mention it defies logic. The funniest thing about it, is that you're communicating how music theory is not needed by using devices of music theory. Without them you would've had fuckall to say.

It is unethical in a way an oncologist would tell a terminally-ill patient that he's doing just fine and "congratulations on the weight loss"(C). The difference is that in medicine this is also legally punishable.
It is illogical like a religious fanatic arguing the existence of god online, which in itself is proof of his failure.

If you enjoy people wiping the floor with you instead of taking a loss like a man, learning and moving on, you'll be getting these free bumps your whole life man. Enjoy the free bump. I'm done here. ✌🏼
Reason 12 - last chance.

User avatar
guitfnky
Posts: 3640
Joined: 19 Jan 2015

Post 21 Aug 2020

EdwardKiy wrote:
21 Aug 2020
guitfnky wrote:
21 Aug 2020

you seem under the impression this is all about me looking for some sort of validation. I’m happy with my creative ability—I don’t need to win you over to feel like my work is worthwhile. if that bothers you, feel free to stop commenting. I don’t mind the free bumps every so often though. ✌🏼
I could care less about you or your creative ability. The purpose of your video is to acquire validation through giving comfort in your own or the viewers' ignorance. That is both damaging and unethical, not to mention it defies logic. The funniest thing about it, is that you're communicating how music theory is not needed by using devices of music theory. Without them you would've had fuckall to say.

It is unethical in a way an oncologist would tell a terminally-ill patient that he's doing just fine and "congratulations on the weight loss"(C). The difference is that in medicine this is also legally punishable.
It is illogical like a religious fanatic arguing the existence of god online, which in itself is proof of his failure.

If you enjoy people wiping the floor with you instead of taking a loss like a man, learning and moving on, you'll be getting these free bumps your whole life man. Enjoy the free bump. I'm done here. ✌🏼
good lord, man, using a tuned instrument to play notes and chords when you create music isn't remotely the same thing as using music theory to help you write music--you don't have to understand harmony and scales in order to use them. this isn't difficult to understand. :lol:

the rest of that is just laughable. hence the laughter.

User avatar
EdwardKiy
Posts: 727
Joined: 02 Oct 2019

Post 21 Aug 2020

guitfnky wrote:
21 Aug 2020
EdwardKiy wrote:
21 Aug 2020


I could care less about you or your creative ability. The purpose of your video is to acquire validation through giving comfort in your own or the viewers' ignorance. That is both damaging and unethical, not to mention it defies logic. The funniest thing about it, is that you're communicating how music theory is not needed by using devices of music theory. Without them you would've had fuckall to say.

It is unethical in a way an oncologist would tell a terminally-ill patient that he's doing just fine and "congratulations on the weight loss"(C). The difference is that in medicine this is also legally punishable.
It is illogical like a religious fanatic arguing the existence of god online, which in itself is proof of his failure.

If you enjoy people wiping the floor with you instead of taking a loss like a man, learning and moving on, you'll be getting these free bumps your whole life man. Enjoy the free bump. I'm done here. ✌🏼
good lord, man, using a tuned instrument to play notes and chords when you create music isn't remotely the same thing as using music theory to help you write music--you don't have to understand harmony and scales in order to use them. this isn't difficult to understand. :lol:

the rest of that is just laughable. hence the laughter.
What is tuning, what is a note and what is a chord?
Reason 12 - last chance.

User avatar
bxbrkrz
Posts: 2518
Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 21 Aug 2020

guitfnky wrote:
19 Aug 2020
alright, so I shot this follow-up video on Monday, to try and clear up some of the confusion. I was waffling on whether to post it, after seeing this thread nearly devolve, but decided not to let a few unnecessarily negative comments change my approach (if we all did this with our music, we all would've quit by now, I wager! :lol:).

anyhoo, I use the first few minutes to do some clarification, then demonstrate that you don't need to know anything about your note/chord choices in order to come up with something usable.

it's long, but here are some handy-dandy timestamps, for those who don't have the time or inclination to watch the whole thing.
First ~5 min or so: clarifications+introduction
14:10: snark
27:15: end product after playing around for a little while+final thoughts

*for anyone who just goes right to hear the end product, the guitar is in a vastly different tuning than I'm used to, which is why you might notice the tuning/intonation is wonky.

To me there was no confusion in your first video. Nice followup video. Since I don't play guitar I could not tell why the new tuning would be such a dramatic change in output creativity. It's still your guitar, and you instinctively try to play your favorite groove (maybe). Next time switch to something else like a Hurdy-gurdy, or a Balalaika ;)
The gatekeeper is that green guitar, no matter how you tune it. You know it, you love it.
757365206c6f67696320746f207365656b20616e73776572732075736520726561736f6e20746f2066696e6420776973646f6d

User avatar
guitfnky
Posts: 3640
Joined: 19 Jan 2015

Post 21 Aug 2020

bxbrkrz wrote:
21 Aug 2020
guitfnky wrote:
19 Aug 2020
alright, so I shot this follow-up video on Monday, to try and clear up some of the confusion. I was waffling on whether to post it, after seeing this thread nearly devolve, but decided not to let a few unnecessarily negative comments change my approach (if we all did this with our music, we all would've quit by now, I wager! :lol:).

anyhoo, I use the first few minutes to do some clarification, then demonstrate that you don't need to know anything about your note/chord choices in order to come up with something usable.

it's long, but here are some handy-dandy timestamps, for those who don't have the time or inclination to watch the whole thing.
First ~5 min or so: clarifications+introduction
14:10: snark
27:15: end product after playing around for a little while+final thoughts

*for anyone who just goes right to hear the end product, the guitar is in a vastly different tuning than I'm used to, which is why you might notice the tuning/intonation is wonky.

To me there was no confusion in your first video. Nice followup video. Since I don't play guitar I could not tell why the new tuning would be such a dramatic change in output creativity. It's still your guitar, and you instinctively try to play your favorite groove (maybe). Next time switch to something else like a Hurdy-gurdy, or a Balalaika ;)
The gatekeeper is that green guitar, no matter how you tune it. You know it, you love it.
thanks! all very good points. 👍🏼 at some point I’ll probably do one on how to break out of these kinds of ruts too. I definitely have my go-to positions and rhythms on guitar, and if I had a hurdy-gurdy or balalaika (had to look that one up—what a wild-looking stringed instrument!), I would’ve loved to have tried that out.

Hearbnb888
Banned user
Posts: 5
Joined: 21 Aug 2020

Post 21 Aug 2020

:thumbs_down: Being the tldr ,
i will post a smart ass youtube vid to show the World ,
How much i did not read this thread

User avatar
bxbrkrz
Posts: 2518
Joined: 17 Jan 2015

Post 21 Aug 2020

guitfnky wrote:
21 Aug 2020
bxbrkrz wrote:
21 Aug 2020

To me there was no confusion in your first video. Nice followup video. Since I don't play guitar I could not tell why the new tuning would be such a dramatic change in output creativity. It's still your guitar, and you instinctively try to play your favorite groove (maybe). Next time switch to something else like a Hurdy-gurdy, or a Balalaika ;)
The gatekeeper is that green guitar, no matter how you tune it. You know it, you love it.
thanks! all very good points. 👍🏼 at some point I’ll probably do one on how to break out of these kinds of ruts too. I definitely have my go-to positions and rhythms on guitar, and if I had a hurdy-gurdy or balalaika (had to look that one up—what a wild-looking stringed instrument!), I would’ve loved to have tried that out.
:puf_smile: :thumbs_up:
757365206c6f67696320746f207365656b20616e73776572732075736520726561736f6e20746f2066696e6420776973646f6d

User avatar
huggermugger
Posts: 41
Joined: 16 Jul 2021

Post 17 Jul 2021

The only people who make music by consulting rules of music theory are "producers" who watch "tutorials" and couldn't tell the difference between a major and minor chord if it hit them on the head. Theory is DESCRIPTIVE, not PRESCRIPTIVE. People who are threatened by it don't get this distinction.

User avatar
avasopht
Posts: 2433
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

Post 17 Jul 2021

Modern (classical) music theory was designed specifically to exalt a small period of German music (Bach, etc) and exclude other cultures (according to the man who developed it).

It fails to recognise most music around the world, including ones that had been well developed and far more sophisticated hundreds of years ago (such as Indian music theory).

I love that era of classical music, but once you know the intently racist origins of modern music theory, it's hard to ignore it when it comes up on conversation.

It's not difficult to find sources for this as what I've said it's explicitly stated by the originator of modern theory.
Last edited by avasopht on 18 Jul 2021, edited 1 time in total.
---

User avatar
orthodox
RE Developer
Posts: 1659
Joined: 22 Jan 2015

Post 18 Jul 2021

avasopht wrote:
17 Jul 2021
Modern (classical) music theory was designed specifically to exalt a small period of German music (Bach, etc) and exclude other cultures (according to the man who developed it).

It fails to recognise most music around the world, including ones that had been well developed and far more sophisticated hundreds of years ago (such as Indian music theory).

I love that era of classical music, but once you know the intently racist origins of modern music theory, it's hard to ignore it when it comes up on conversation.

It's not difficult to find sources for this as what I've said it's explicitly stated by the originator of modern theory.
This outlook is itself a racist one and it smells politics. I have no doubt there are such 'sources', especially in our troubled times. Nobody has ever forbidden to develop other music theories as well and spread them. The originators of the classical theory had no racist intentions, they just developed a theory to serve their favourite kind of music best. Anybody can do the same with their kind of music.

It is also interesting to hear how do you think this 'injustice' could be corrected. Many people (including me) are not going to change their musical preferences any time soon.
Active Reason+ subscriber with the attested early R12 access
Reason 11 Suite gathering dust on the shelf

User avatar
avasopht
Posts: 2433
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

Post 18 Jul 2021

orthodox wrote:
18 Jul 2021

This outlook is itself a racist one and it smells politics. I have no doubt there are such 'sources', especially in our troubled times. Nobody has ever forbidden to develop other music theories as well and spread them. The originators of the classical theory had no racist intentions, they just developed a theory to serve their favourite kind of music best. Anybody can do the same with their kind of music.

It is also interesting to hear how do you think this 'injustice' could be corrected. Many people (including me) are not going to change their musical preferences any time soon.


I'd have presumed the exact same thing if someone said that until I watched this video.

It might be worth skipping to 28:24 to get to Heinrich Schenker, his influence on modern music theory and his stated relationship between his beliefs and theory before watching the earlier pieces (especially if you're sceptical, that way you get to the meat first).

So no, you presumed incorrectly about the 'sources' (a little patronising btw, but again, I'd have made that same mistake before watching this). Here are the sources from the video: https://bit.ly/2ZdxpMW
---

User avatar
orthodox
RE Developer
Posts: 1659
Joined: 22 Jan 2015

Post 18 Jul 2021

avasopht wrote:
18 Jul 2021
I'd have presumed the exact same thing if someone said that until I watched this video.
Of course I've seen it.
avasopht wrote:
18 Jul 2021
It might be worth skipping to 28:24 to get to Heinrich Schenker, his influence on modern music theory and his stated relationship between his beliefs and theory before watching the earlier pieces (especially if you're sceptical, that way you get to the meat first).

So no, you presumed incorrectly about the 'sources' (a little patronising btw, but again, I'd have made that same mistake before watching this). Here are the sources from the video: https://bit.ly/2ZdxpMW
What do that Schenker guy's beliefs have to do with the musical theory he developed? Reject that 'supremacy' thing and let alone the theory. Or did he and other 'German' musicians poison the whole branch with their filthy minds, so they all better be canceled altogether?

Anybody can develop their own, politically correct musical theory, though I doubt a universal one could ever be created. What is the point of raising the racial 'awareness' in every field?
Active Reason+ subscriber with the attested early R12 access
Reason 11 Suite gathering dust on the shelf

User avatar
avasopht
Posts: 2433
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

Post 18 Jul 2021

orthodox wrote:
18 Jul 2021
What do that Schenker guy's beliefs have to do with the musical theory he developed?
At 34:02: the co-writer to the AB guide to music theory wrote that, "for Schenker, both his political and musical ideas were armaments...in a cultural struggle that would eventually lead to a regeneration both of music and of society at large in a German-speaking world."

"Schenker believed that an aristocracy of some sort - at least in cultural matters if not also in political structure - would promote the selection and support of gifted individuals among whom the rare genius might emerge".

Of course, one could say "yes, but where is the 100% proof that Schenker believed this?" And so on ... a response that is quite predictable. He could have just made that stuff up and ascribed that objective to Schenker. Maybe it was his own view ... maybe there is absolutely nothing written or said by Schenker that would lead to that statement.

Maybe it's a mere coincidence that his music theory supports his views and just happens to exclude all other forms of music. Yeah sure. That sounds reasonable.

I did happen to find an explicit statement from either Schenker or another professor that was influential in establishing modern music theory that supported this that I shared with other students in the Music Perception and Cognition module I was attending at the time, ... I'll see if I can find it, but I lost a few things when I switched devices.
orthodox wrote:
18 Jul 2021
Or did he and other 'German' musicians poison the whole branch with their filthy minds, so they all better be canceled altogether?
Hold on.
1. Who said anything about cancelling
2. Who said anything negative against German musicians

I most certainly did not, nor did anyone in that video.
orthodox wrote:
18 Jul 2021
Anybody can develop their own, politically correct musical theory, though I doubt a universal one could ever be created. What is the point of raising the racial 'awareness' in every field?
You've lost me. "Politically correct". How about theoretically correct.

Where race comes in is addressed sufficiently in the video and the papers that it provides links for.

Other music theories are also explicitly described in the video. Those theories aren't "politically correct," they just happen to not be designed explicitly to exclude everything else.

Note, I'm perfectly fine with the theory. I use them. I enjoy listening to German classical composers and playing in their style. I've always related to Bach's music. I've not at any point said or implied I was against the theory itself.
---

User avatar
orthodox
RE Developer
Posts: 1659
Joined: 22 Jan 2015

Post 18 Jul 2021

avasopht wrote:
18 Jul 2021
orthodox wrote:
18 Jul 2021
Or did he and other 'German' musicians poison the whole branch with their filthy minds, so they all better be canceled altogether?
Hold on.
1. Who said anything about cancelling
2. Who said anything negative against German musicians

I most certainly did not, nor did anyone in that video.
I did not do that either, that was a sarcastic question.

The video tries to make a racial case out of two trivial things that have always been known (and now presented as a revelation):
a) That ANY musical theory fails to fit other kinds of music.
b) That the theoretical building of one musical genre is the tallest one (has a leg up on the other kinds).

What's new is that they bring the critical race theory arguments into the subject. That suggests the similar implications and raises the question as to what the intent of the authors was, to talk about music or to try racial paints on it.
Active Reason+ subscriber with the attested early R12 access
Reason 11 Suite gathering dust on the shelf

User avatar
guitfnky
Posts: 3640
Joined: 19 Jan 2015

Post 18 Jul 2021

I made this video and discussion to talk about why learning music theory is unnecessary in order to make good music. I think the first part that sparked this little revival was relevant in that it talks about the motivations behind some of that theory in the first place. feel free to agree or disagree with that premise, but I don’t think we need to steer off course and start talking about cancel culture or politics. I’d rather not see what I think is a worthwhile thread (yes, I’m biased) get locked. please keep the political talk and buzzwords out of it.

User avatar
avasopht
Posts: 2433
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

Post 18 Jul 2021

guitfnky wrote:
18 Jul 2021
I made this video and discussion to talk about why learning music theory is unnecessary in order to make good music. I think the first part that sparked this little revival was relevant in that it talks about the motivations behind some of that theory in the first place. feel free to agree or disagree with that premise, but I don’t think we need to steer off course and start talking about cancel culture or politics. I’d rather not see what I think is a worthwhile thread (yes, I’m biased) get locked. please keep the political talk and buzzwords out of it.
Agreed. There was no need to bring it in that direction.
Last edited by avasopht on 18 Jul 2021, edited 3 times in total.
---

User avatar
avasopht
Posts: 2433
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

Post 18 Jul 2021

orthodox wrote:
18 Jul 2021
I did not do that either, that was a sarcastic question.

The video tries to make a racial case out of two trivial things that have always been known (and now presented as a revelation):
a) That ANY musical theory fails to fit other kinds of music.
b) That the theoretical building of one musical genre is the tallest one (has a leg up on the other kinds).

What's new is that they bring the critical race theory arguments into the subject. That suggests the similar implications and raises the question as to what the intent of the authors was, to talk about music or to try racial paints on it.
Does western music theory really have a leg up on other kinds given it fails to describe anything but a small segment of music, while some other music theories actually can describe other forms of music?

Being "tall" yet failing to generalize is actually not a good thing in a general theory. It can be useful when combined with lots of other tall yet poorly generalizing theories that collectively span all areas.

In my school, we were introduced to Indian music theory. I found it interesting that Indian Raga music has one of the same core rhythms found in Jamaican Ragga music (short example).

Anyways, while there may never be a Unified Theory of Music, we're not helping things by only considering Classical German Music Theory as Music Theory or pretending it really is or ever attempted to be a theory for music in general and not just a tiny segment of music.

There are music theories that do aid creativity (as mentioned in the video). It's only when music theory is restricted to classical German music theory that a question like this can even be asked.

James Coltane's theories, I would imagine, help aid creativity for that style of music. Ditto for classical music theory for classical players (to some degree).

During my Music Perception and Cognition module, I came across many theories that I was able to immediately apply to my compositions.

In relation to this question, I would say that creativity is the activity of constructing, manipulating or seeking a progression in the expansion of music theory (either implicitly or explicitly). Theories of music are implicitly formed in our minds. They govern what we enjoy and how we create.

Where there is form and structure, there is some theory to describe it (e.g. having a drop). Some theories are culturally relevant, and some will have relevance across all time, genres and cultures.
---

User avatar
integerpoet
Posts: 250
Joined: 30 Dec 2020
Location: East Bay, California

Post 21 Jul 2021

Apart from excoriating gatekeeping…

I think the only question worth asking is whether knowing theory hurts creativity. Because otherwise the debate seems to be about a bunch of states and conditions which aren't mutually exclusive. Like, if you're curious, maybe learn enough theory to be able to decide whether it feels like more will help you. Then continue or don't.

It's possible to focus on a single topic and see what happens. My partner teaches theory at the university level. We're both super-busy, so we've only had time for her to teach me the first thing she teaches her students in the first course: simple meter. After that one lesson, I wrote a fun satisfying piece because the knowledge prompted me to try something other than 4:4. Your mileage may vary.

(By the way, most rack devices don't support "interesting" meters terribly well. Not shocking, given Reason's lineage, but during the struggle it might help to know you are not crazy.)

User avatar
EdwardKiy
Posts: 727
Joined: 02 Oct 2019

Post 23 Jul 2021

avasopht wrote:
18 Jul 2021

Does western music theory really have a leg up on other kinds given it fails to describe anything but a small segment of music, while some other music theories actually can describe other forms of music?
But it's the same thing with languages. Why do we speak English here? Why not Swedish, French, Japanese, Russian, German or even Latin or Esperanto? Maybe because around a third of all Nobel Prizes in literature were written in English or is it because the language itself is versatile? Or (if we conveniently forget for a moment that Shakespeare still sits supreme ABOVE the list of all literature ever created) was it colonialism?
I can bet my time-travel trousers there's a whole lot of historical dirt underneath that language. Does it limit your creative and expressive ability? Would you rather have known Swahili instead to have stayed "free"?

Maybe the western music theory is prevalent because most of the worthwhile, labor/artistically/intelligence-intense musical pieces ever created, have been created within it?

Personally, I don't care if the guy who invented something good is bad by current standards. If we all benefited from it - it's our history. A page in a book and a monument saying "Great man, bit racist" is what he deserves. That's how we always did - going from worse to better. So what now, we're going to dismantle ALL of our history?

And what do we do? Take down the pyramids? That should keep the BLM busy for a while... How about banning chess - the ultimately racist game, where white always get the first move? Where does the idiocy stop?

Maybe we could just take what we already have and build on top of it while being grateful to everyone involved - past and present.
Reason 12 - last chance.

  • Information
  • Who is online

    Users browsing this forum: CommonCrawl [Bot] and 1 guest