Massive orchestra .rns

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Taff
Posts: 166
Joined: 30 Aug 2016

26 Apr 2017

Ok, as you may or may not know, I write bloody awful pseudo-classical-Celtic-ambient stuff.

What I have wanted to create for a long time is a .rns, with my "orchestra" already set up and ready to record in it.

This would have full strings, brass, woods, and a bit of timpani, arranged to sound the best that they can, and with mixer and effects settings to make it sound as "real" an orchestra as possible.

How would I use this? The aim would be to write tracks in a simple setup using "full orchestra" combie and other instruments, then to paste the "full orchestra" pieces across into my mighty orchestra.rns for transposing and orchestration.

So, my dear RT friends, if you wanted to indulge in this stupidity;

What instruments woudl you include/exclude?

How many of each?

How would you use the mixer to 'place" each instrument?

What effects would you use to add realism? (delays? reverbs? compressors?)

How best to set these effects?

What have I not thought of?

I have a good range of strings and orchestral refills, including Miroslav and Chambre stuff, plus bit and bobs found along the way.

Is there already a tutorial out the which covers all of this?

Any and all advice received with profound gratitude...

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normen
Posts: 3431
Joined: 16 Jan 2015

26 Apr 2017

Well first thing would be looking into typical orchestra placement, e.g.

Image

Left/right is achieved through panning, depth through reverb.

Copy/pasting won't really work I suppose, arrangement (i.e. deciding which instruments play which parts at which octaves etc.) is a thing in itself that requires at least as much attention as the composition itself.

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Taff
Posts: 166
Joined: 30 Aug 2016

26 Apr 2017

Thansk mate.
Copy/pasting won't really work I suppose, arrangement (i.e. deciding which instruments play which parts at which octaves etc.) is a thing in itself that requires at least as much attention as the composition itself
Agreed, but having the basic tune already written will make orchestrating the parts that bit more easy.

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Timmy Crowne
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Joined: 06 Apr 2017
Location: California, United States

26 Apr 2017

Section size would depend on the scale of the piece itself, and what the section is doing.

I would avoid compression as much as possible because dynamics are so important in this kind of work.

Adding more reverb to the more percussive elements and less to the legato parts tends to sound better than drenching already blurry legato lines.

Layering section patches with a solo lead mixed in can help with realism.

EQ is probably the biggest tool for orchestral work. For Orkester stuff, I usually wanna shape the tone of each section to bring out the air at the top and get rid of the boxiness in the mids. They're actually some good recordings but they need some EQ polish to really shine.


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modecca
Posts: 807
Joined: 07 Jul 2016

26 Apr 2017

Taff wrote:Ok, as you may or may not know, I write bloody awful pseudo-classical-Celtic-ambient stuff.

What I have wanted to create for a long time is a .rns, with my "orchestra" already set up and ready to record in it.

This would have full strings, brass, woods, and a bit of timpani, arranged to sound the best that they can, and with mixer and effects settings to make it sound as "real" an orchestra as possible.

How would I use this? The aim would be to write tracks in a simple setup using "full orchestra" combie and other instruments, then to paste the "full orchestra" pieces across into my mighty orchestra.rns for transposing and orchestration.

So, my dear RT friends, if you wanted to indulge in this stupidity;

What instruments woudl you include/exclude?

How many of each?

How would you use the mixer to 'place" each instrument?

What effects would you use to add realism? (delays? reverbs? compressors?)

How best to set these effects?

What have I not thought of?

I have a good range of strings and orchestral refills, including Miroslav and Chambre stuff, plus bit and bobs found along the way.

Is there already a tutorial out the which covers all of this?

Any and all advice received with profound gratitude...
When you finish this template, will you release it :?: :?: :?:
🔗💥

User avatar
Taff
Posts: 166
Joined: 30 Aug 2016

26 Apr 2017

Thanks all!

I'd be happy to release it modecca, how would I do that?

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modecca
Posts: 807
Joined: 07 Jul 2016

26 Apr 2017

Taff wrote:Thanks all!

I'd be happy to release it modecca, how would I do that?
I would just make a new topic in the "refills and patches" thread.

It could be titled "Massive Orchestra Templete."
Just attach the compressed .rns file (they are small) inside your comment.

example:
jestem.zip
(275.06 KiB) Downloaded 111 times
🔗💥

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Taff
Posts: 166
Joined: 30 Aug 2016

26 Apr 2017

Will do, that would be a very useful way to get feedback and improvements to it too.

I'll need some help with reverbs esp, as I have never really got the hang of using them

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Taff
Posts: 166
Joined: 30 Aug 2016

26 Apr 2017

First attempt, many more to come.

I threw a few chords at it and this is what came out;



Can someone with better ears than mine tell me if this is sounding like an orchestra?

The tune is irrelevant.

What needs improving?

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Taff
Posts: 166
Joined: 30 Aug 2016

27 Apr 2017

Right, I did rather rush that. Here's the same chords progression again, but with a bit more finesse on the levels.



Orchestraish?

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Catblack
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Joined: 15 Apr 2016
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27 Apr 2017

The only advice I could give is that you should keep in mind that violins and other stringed instruments have two different sounds depending on the bowing. And that woodwinds need to take a breath sometimes, and generally have a slightly sharper attack when they have. I'd also put your strings a little farther back, the cello cuts into the drums a bit too much.

Sounds great so far!
If you ain't hip to the rare Housequake, shut up already.

Damn.

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Taff
Posts: 166
Joined: 30 Aug 2016

27 Apr 2017

Thanks for the advice, I'l make those adjustments next.

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Taff
Posts: 166
Joined: 30 Aug 2016

27 Apr 2017

Decided to go a different route now.

The Orchestra .rns is too huge and cumbersome to make it practical, having some 56 NNXT samplers, plus assorted effects in it.

So, bright bugger here is now going to make up "strings", "brass", "woods" and timpani n & harps" etc as separate .rns entities.

This should allow me to get away with say 30 NNXT in each, and make placement, depth and "realism" more achievable.

The resulting audio tracks will be merged in reason or Audition for final mastering.

Am I mad?

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16BitBear
Posts: 247
Joined: 21 May 2016
Location: Arizona

28 Apr 2017

Taff wrote:Decided to go a different route now.

The Orchestra .rns is too huge and cumbersome to make it practical, having some 56 NNXT samplers, plus assorted effects in it.

So, bright bugger here is now going to make up "strings", "brass", "woods" and timpani n & harps" etc as separate .rns entities.

This should allow me to get away with say 30 NNXT in each, and make placement, depth and "realism" more achievable.

The resulting audio tracks will be merged in reason or Audition for final mastering.

Am I mad?
No, you are not mad at all. This is a wonderful project, and I hope you share the results. I have started getting into orchestration and this would really help me out. :thumbs_up:

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Taff
Posts: 166
Joined: 30 Aug 2016

28 Apr 2017

No worries, will do mate.

livero
Posts: 2
Joined: 08 Jul 2016

25 Feb 2018

Work still in progress?

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