Kong momentary pads

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jfrichards
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Post 30 Jan 2015

How do I make all the pads on Kong into momentary pads so that the sample stops when I release the pad?  And how do I make the pad repeat the sample when I hold it down?  I Read The Fabulous Manual and still couldn't figure it out.

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jonheal
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Post 30 Jan 2015

This video may answer your question. Possibly ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvovmLrEItk
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eusti
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Post 30 Jan 2015

I'm not sure what you are precisely wanting to achieve...
If you want to just use Kong and only Kong in this matter, I wouldn't know how.
You could use an NN-XT for your sound source and use the Gate Out from the individual pad to trigger the gate.
The note CV could be triggered by a Matrix.

Hope that helps.

D.

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tumar
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Post 31 Jan 2015

You can't (it was moanned on PUF ;) ). You can use NNXT instead and try to tweak with "Release' parameter in global controls.
Here:
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Or try to use controller like Korg Pad Kontrol, where you can set each pad to "momentary" or "trigger" mode.

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Joerg
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Post 31 Jan 2015

You can do it (with some restrictions) with Thor:
Loop the audio of the Pad through Thor and scale it by the Gate of the Pad. So you only hear it, while the pad is pressed (Gate on) and its muted when you release the Pad (Gate 0)
The problem is, that Kongs Pad output routes are grouped to twins, ie Output 1/2, 3/4 ...
That means, that when you start a loop on on Pad1 and release it, its volume is 0 but nevertheless it finishes its run. When you press Pad2 (that is normally been routed through the same pair of outputs) you are hearing the rest of the loop1, which is obviously not intended. So the amount of momentary triggered Pads is reduced to 8. But maybe thats enough?

MDTerps2015
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Post 31 Jan 2015

I found if you use the Nano Sampler to load your sounds into kong you can use the gate effect that comes with it. Its the little button at the bottom in the Nano Sample with the slope/hat looking icons. I use it all the time to cut 808 bass drums that sustain too long. Its not like cutting the decay or sustain, using the button/switch allows the sample to come to an abrupt stop when the pad is released. 
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Joerg
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Post 31 Jan 2015

I had some time to create a combinator for you.
It's based upon my decription above. Since you can use only 8 pads for momentary run with this setup, I duplicated this and grouped it into a combinator.
Load and tweak your samles into the Rex1-8 or Rex 9-16 named Kongs. I muted the not usable Pads for easier visual feedback.
All pads are only audible, if you press the pad. Release the pad means cutting sounds off.
I loaded the Rex player as defult but of course you can change that to the Nano-Sampler or a drum module.

I assume, that there might be some samples in your setup, that should NOT be cutoff with pad release, ie crash or screams.
With the combinator buttons, you can set a complete row of pads to normal mode, so that triggering a pad plays the complete sample. So you can place thos samples/Sounds to that specific row.

Try it and feedback your opinon on that :)
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kloeckno
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Post 31 Jan 2015

Ryan Harlin asked about this a while back on the old PUF, and I came up with a very clever solution. It involved triggering another pad when you release the first one, and that second pad would mute the first one. I believe I used the Mute Groups function in Kong. You basically just invert the CV coming out of the main pad (so it's at 0 when you press it, and 127 when released) and feed it into the "muting" pad's gate input. As long as both pads are in the same mute group, it will work.

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jfrichards
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Post 31 Jan 2015

Thanks so much everyone.  I tried them all out and in the process stumbled across a way to do it just in a combinator for 4 pads by sending the gate out of the four pads to the CVin1-4, setting them on unipolar, then programming CVin1 to Drum 1 level, CVin2 to Drum 2 level, etc.  It seems to work perfectly with the Nurse Rex player on loop trig and you can adjust the start point of the rex loop.  The other drum modules seem to work well too, like the NN-Nano.  After doing that with pads 1-4, I created another combinator, set it up the same for pads 5-8, and ran the gate outs from 5-8 in the first kong over to the gate ins for pads 5-8 on the second kong/combinator.  Four kongs later, I have a 16 pad MPC that works off the first Kong, with level control, momentary and rex play when holding the pad or key down.  I've been converting samples and song clips to rex files to load into this little dude, which takes like 45 seconds these days.  Cool.

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Junky examples using all 16 pads on the first Kong (private discover files)

http://phead.mu/s/kYP8RRqb
http://phead.mu/s/XYCW2yLg  same but slower

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tiker01
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Post 01 Feb 2015

Don`t want to sound negative so I say it this way: PH should add the option to choose whether a pa should be momentary or play the whole sample after released. Maybe JP could add it to the "custs list".  ;)
    
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eusti
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Post 01 Feb 2015

Interesting, John! Thanks for sharing your results and experiences!

D.

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jfrichards
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Post 01 Feb 2015

tiker01 wrote:...PH should add the option to choose whether a pad should be momentary or play the whole sample after released...
Or putting 16 CV ins in a Combinator would be nice too (along with 4 more knobs and Selig's CV sweep curve adjuster).  This 4-kong setup is more or less exactly what live playing requires, hope you can have some fun with it.

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jfrichards
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Post 02 Feb 2015

Coming soon (after I transfer it to R7).  With brushed bronze faceplates, plus single volume, reverb, compression, and brightness controls. And pultec-style bass eq for any horizontal bank of four pads.

http://phead.mu/s/QohTz1tD

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eusti
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Post 02 Feb 2015

Cool. Looking forward to this!

D.

kloeckno
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Post 02 Feb 2015

Hey John, have you tried using a Thor for each Kong pad? You may be able to do it with only one combinator! Each Thor can take in the audio from the Kong pad, and you can use it's Global Envelope to cut off the audio going through the Thor. If you limit the notes the Thor receives in the combi programmer to the same one as it's corresponding Kong pad, it should work perfectly.

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jfrichards
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Post 02 Feb 2015

kloeckno wrote:Hey John, have you tried using a Thor for each Kong pad? You may be able to do it with only one combinator! Each Thor can take in the audio from the Kong pad, and you can use it's Global Envelope to cut off the audio going through the Thor. If you limit the notes the Thor receives in the combi programmer to the same one as it's corresponding Kong pad, it should work perfectly.
I didn't go deeply into that option because Joerg Bacon said it would be limited by the 8 audio outs vs the 16 CV outs.  But maybe it could be done?

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Joerg
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Post 02 Feb 2015

I reworked my combi. Now I can use 1 Kong with 4 Thors and 2 Mixers in one single combinator.
I panned the pads alternating hard left and right, so they don't bleed into the other channel. The mixer sets it back to center. Embarrassing, not to get that before. The option of allowing 1-4 rows free running samples by Combi buttons still exists.
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ryanharlin
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Post 02 Feb 2015

I'm seeing a lot of complex solutions here and I haven't read the whole thread in detail so forgive me if all of the proposed solutions are about making the sample repeat but if you want momentary buttons in Kong with the nn-nano module it's one switch and one knob to set. Do the thing in the picture and your Kong pads will be momentary. They won't loop, however, since the NN-Nano doesn't have a loop function. For that, use the full NNXT.

Image 

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jfrichards
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Post 02 Feb 2015

Joerg wrote:I reworked my combi. Now I can use 1 Kong with 4 Thors and 2 Mixers in one single combinator.
I panned the pads alternating hard left and right, so they don't bleed into the other channel. The mixer sets it back to center. Embarrassing, not to get that before. The option of allowing 1-4 rows free running samples by Combi buttons still exists.
Very Nice !!!  The only weird thing is that when you load something new into a pad, it changes the audio out for that pad to master audio out and centers it, so you have to change it to say Audio 5/6 if it's pad 5 or 6 and pan it to one side.  Other than that it's great.  Once you have your 16 pads set up and saved, it'll stay that way for live playing.  Nice.

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jfrichards
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Post 02 Feb 2015

ryanharlin wrote:I'm seeing a lot of complex solutions here and I haven't read the whole thread in detail so forgive me if all of the proposed solutions are about making the sample repeat but if you want momentary buttons in Kong with the nn-nano module it's one switch and one knob to set. Do the thing in the picture and your Kong pads will be momentary. They won't loop, however, since the NN-Nano doesn't have a loop function. For that, use the full NNXT.
Nice Ryan!  Good for sample playing.  The other solutions do it with sampling, time-synced rex files, and the drum synths.  Question, if I drop a rex file into an audio track, then use that as a sample in an NN-Nano, will it still have a time stamp and sync with the song?  I'll try that out later.

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Joerg
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Post 02 Feb 2015

Are you on Reason8? I don't have the problem with loading files via my Reason 7 browser. Settings are kept. But when I copy/Paste the drumpatch from one pad to another via mouse context menue, Pan and Output are included and I have to readjust it, too. Probably Drag&Drop files in Reason 8 behave like Copy&Paste from Main Out, panned centered as default.

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jfrichards
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Post 03 Feb 2015

ryanharlin wrote:I'm seeing a lot of complex solutions here and I haven't read the whole thread in detail so forgive me if all of the proposed solutions are about making the sample repeat ...
For me, the thing I wanted was to have the kong pad keep playing something rhythmic in sync with the song when holding down the key, and just play the hit when only hitting the key, so not simply repeating the sample if it is out of sync.  Joerg's solution is almost perfect, I'm gonna keep working on it.  It makes playing the phenomenal kong even more of a thrill and inspiration for me.

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submonsterz
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Post 07 Feb 2015

ryanharlin wrote:I'm seeing a lot of complex solutions here and I haven't read the whole thread in detail so forgive me if all of the proposed solutions are about making the sample repeat ...
jfrichards wrote:
For me, the thing I wanted was to have the kong pad keep playing something rhythmic in sync with the song when holding down the key, and just play the hit when only hitting the key, so not simply repeating the sample if it is out of sync.  Joerg's solution is almost perfect, I'm gonna keep working on it.  It makes playing the phenomenal kong even more of a thrill and inspiration for me.
I have not read through whole thread so do not know if this has been fixed or answerd for you yet m8.
but im going to make a couple of combis for you anyhow.
I have couple of ideas how this works :) . be back soon.

 submonsterz kong pad trigger.zip  

simple one here just put what device into ya kong slots you like
but remember if you load via the patch or the drum patch menus you loose panning in kong pads.
if you select module and load directly into module you keep panning and routings.
all 16 pads here work as you wanted or as far as I can understand you`re wants here m8.
but got a nice monster idea being made right now.
akk you wanted not looping but repeating loops on the pads sorry that patch just does momentary and loop one shots.
im making one now that will loop all pads back soon lots of wires needing and routing.
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submonsterz
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Post 07 Feb 2015

I have made monster for you JF and others here  ;) .
ill post a vid of it lol.
gotta make one first.
and ill post the combi here too.
oo it gonna need explaining and instructions I suppose too.
a million wires I tell you lol.

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jfrichards
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Post 07 Feb 2015

submonsterz wrote:...
I have couple of ideas how this works :) . be back soon.

 submonsterz kong pad trigger.zip  

simple one here just put what device into ya kong slots you like
...
Yep, very nice Sub.  It's exactly the same as Joerg's combinator in post #17, so it looks like brilliant minds think alike.  I'm really enjoying the beats I can come up with using a momentary kong with rex loops!!  It's what I used to see Jeremy Ellis doing all over the place.

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