Odd mixing idea

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RobC
Posts: 898
Joined: 10 Mar 2018

Post 12 Jun 2018

So I was just thinking...

Since there's the method where you mix everything as a start-off to pink noise, and then make adjustments;
and since there was my idea of setting a sound's loudness to a -16 LUFS pink noise sample, and whatever goes over that, gets multi-band saturated;

then what if we set a kick drum's loudness according to the sub bass ranges of both the kick and the pink noise, instead of a total loudness?
So, you isolate both sounds between 20-80 Hz for example on parallel channels, then set the fader of the kick drum, so that the sub bass is approximately as loud as the sub bass of the pink noise.

Similarly, you listen to some high frequency range in case of a high hat, and set loudness accordingly. (Obviously, when you're done, you turn off the isolated frequencies, and keep the set level of the whole sound.)

Aka, by the most important frequency ranges of the given sound. When it comes to the complete mix, and something is strong or weak in the given sound, you could equalize its 'other' frequencies, but the core frequency would be in place.

Pretty smart, huh? (Well, in my imagination it seems good. Maybe I should test now and then. xD - But hey! It happened before that a stupid idea inspired something clever.)

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jimmyklane
Posts: 737
Joined: 16 Apr 2018

Post 12 Jun 2018

They used to make a plug-in that EQed your song to match whatever you fed into it’s input.

Be careful using LUFS, better to use K-14 or K-12 for pop/electronic music. I use K-12, never touch my monitor volume, and always get mixes that sound pretty decent.
DAW: Reason 10,

SAMPLERS: Akai MPC 2000, E-mu SP1200, E-Mu e5000Ultra, Ensoniq EPS 16+, Akai S950, Maschine

SYNTHS: Mostly classic Polysynths and more modern Monosynths. All are mostly food for my samplers!

www.soundcloud.com/jimmyklane

RobC
Posts: 898
Joined: 10 Mar 2018

Post 13 Jun 2018

moneykube wrote:
12 Jun 2018
odd backwards sounds like doe... you are not Homer... rejoice
Knuckles is one step better than Homer : ) so all is not lost.

RobC
Posts: 898
Joined: 10 Mar 2018

Post 13 Jun 2018

jimmyklane wrote:
12 Jun 2018
They used to make a plug-in that EQed your song to match whatever you fed into it’s input.

Be careful using LUFS, better to use K-14 or K-12 for pop/electronic music. I use K-12, never touch my monitor volume, and always get mixes that sound pretty decent.
Thing is, a pink noise sample reaches that -16 LUFS recommendation. It sounds powerful enough for weaker portable systems, too. And whatever sample I have, I never set -16 LUFS with a program since it's really not the best. I rather listen to that pink noise, then switch to the sound in question, and set its level. And I do that A/B switching until I hear the given sample just as loud.

EQ-ing to pink noise is not what I want. It's just a loudness reference. I have mixed feelings whether it's a good one at this point.

Still, mixing by the most important frequency of a given sound doesn't seem to be such a bad idea. It happened before that I mixed a kick too quiet or too loud cause I had a hard time making out the lower frequencies.

jimmyklane
Posts: 737
Joined: 16 Apr 2018

Post 13 Jun 2018

Ok, so the IDEA behind what you’re speaking of (and it’s not a new idea, you’ve sort of reinvented the wheel :-) ) is to have the spectrum of your final mix approximate the spectrum of pink noise. You really don’t want to start EQing sources simply to match an analyzer because in general that’s a terrible idea. You are correct in using your ears to match the approximate volume, and when you’re DONE you’ll see that your entire mix AVERAGES OVER TIME to be at or very close to pink noise.

There are many examples to counter this idea and this theory, however, if you want solid and repeatable mixes this isn’t a bad place to start.

Rob, can I hear a piece of your music? I’d like something to “know you by” and hear where these ideas are coming from.
DAW: Reason 10,

SAMPLERS: Akai MPC 2000, E-mu SP1200, E-Mu e5000Ultra, Ensoniq EPS 16+, Akai S950, Maschine

SYNTHS: Mostly classic Polysynths and more modern Monosynths. All are mostly food for my samplers!

www.soundcloud.com/jimmyklane

RobC
Posts: 898
Joined: 10 Mar 2018

Post 13 Jun 2018

jimmyklane wrote:
13 Jun 2018
Ok, so the IDEA behind what you’re speaking of (and it’s not a new idea, you’ve sort of reinvented the wheel :-) ) is to have the spectrum of your final mix approximate the spectrum of pink noise. You really don’t want to start EQing sources simply to match an analyzer because in general that’s a terrible idea. You are correct in using your ears to match the approximate volume, and when you’re DONE you’ll see that your entire mix AVERAGES OVER TIME to be at or very close to pink noise.

There are many examples to counter this idea and this theory, however, if you want solid and repeatable mixes this isn’t a bad place to start.

Rob, can I hear a piece of your music? I’d like something to “know you by” and hear where these ideas are coming from.
I didn't reinvent it, I know it's a common method; but what I wanted to say is to set audio levels according to the most important frequencies of the given sound - whether one uses the pink noise reference, or not. Personally, I don't really like how pink noise sounds.
But in another (final) thread (for ideas), I've already taken yet another turn. xD

Song wise, I'm pretty much on hiatus since 2015. I should rather put out something new. But I design sounds from scratch and want to eliminate issues from the start.

jimmyklane
Posts: 737
Joined: 16 Apr 2018

Post 13 Jun 2018

RobC wrote:
13 Jun 2018
jimmyklane wrote:
13 Jun 2018
Ok, so the IDEA behind what you’re speaking of (and it’s not a new idea, you’ve sort of reinvented the wheel :-) ) is to have the spectrum of your final mix approximate the spectrum of pink noise. You really don’t want to start EQing sources simply to match an analyzer because in general that’s a terrible idea. You are correct in using your ears to match the approximate volume, and when you’re DONE you’ll see that your entire mix AVERAGES OVER TIME to be at or very close to pink noise.

There are many examples to counter this idea and this theory, however, if you want solid and repeatable mixes this isn’t a bad place to start.

Rob, can I hear a piece of your music? I’d like something to “know you by” and hear where these ideas are coming from.
I didn't reinvent it, I know it's a common method; but what I wanted to say is to set audio levels according to the most important frequencies of the given sound - whether one uses the pink noise reference, or not. Personally, I don't really like how pink noise sounds.
But in another (final) thread (for ideas), I've already taken yet another turn. xD

Song wise, I'm pretty much on hiatus since 2015. I should rather put out something new. But I design sounds from scratch and want to eliminate issues from the start.
You haven’t written a song since 2015? Rob, if that’s the case and you want to make music then get off of here and get to making music!!!! If on the other hand, you simply want to create your own sounds for either personal enjoyment or perhaps to release a refill....then I say keep asking good questions and take everything you learn to heart!

Could I please hear the last song you made? It gives me an idea how to go about giving you good advice and techniques.
DAW: Reason 10,

SAMPLERS: Akai MPC 2000, E-mu SP1200, E-Mu e5000Ultra, Ensoniq EPS 16+, Akai S950, Maschine

SYNTHS: Mostly classic Polysynths and more modern Monosynths. All are mostly food for my samplers!

www.soundcloud.com/jimmyklane

RobC
Posts: 898
Joined: 10 Mar 2018

Post 13 Jun 2018

jimmyklane wrote:
13 Jun 2018
RobC wrote:
13 Jun 2018


I didn't reinvent it, I know it's a common method; but what I wanted to say is to set audio levels according to the most important frequencies of the given sound - whether one uses the pink noise reference, or not. Personally, I don't really like how pink noise sounds.
But in another (final) thread (for ideas), I've already taken yet another turn. xD

Song wise, I'm pretty much on hiatus since 2015. I should rather put out something new. But I design sounds from scratch and want to eliminate issues from the start.
You haven’t written a song since 2015? Rob, if that’s the case and you want to make music then get off of here and get to making music!!!! If on the other hand, you simply want to create your own sounds for either personal enjoyment or perhaps to release a refill....then I say keep asking good questions and take everything you learn to heart!

Could I please hear the last song you made? It gives me an idea how to go about giving you good advice and techniques.
Rather I haven't finished/uploaded any. I'm interested in every part, I'd like to be able to control as much as possible, and use whatever I really like. I didn't realize, but I bet I'm at least 50% about sound design.

Since I had a system change, I need to dig all the stuff up some time maybe. But I want to make something new eventually anyway, where I really will need some testing feedback. The old stuff is way too dated.

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