Another reason for you to hate Waves

[Goriila Texas]

[dvdrtldg]

TBH if this means they stop bombarding me with their dumb fucking $29.99 "sale" adverts, that's a plus

[Goriila Texas]

I bought a bunch of them on sale back in the day and don't even use any now. It's crazy how those plugins use to cost thousands in a bundle. Aside from Sonnox Inflator and some specialty plugins I'm strictly Studio One stock, Fabfilter, iZotope and Softube. Every since I've went to a minimalistic approach to Vst's none of my software crashes.

TBH if this means they stop bombarding me with their dumb fucking $29.99 "sale" adverts, that's a plus

[_andreypetr_]

I think you should watch your video in context of this

[Goriila Texas]

Basically it looks like the selling point is pro presets which you can get without a sub with software like iZotope.

I think you should watch your video in context of this

[dvdrtldg]

It really sucks. The cheaper sub is pretty well useless, and the expensive one is overkill. Who the fk wants access to every single Waves plugin ever made? I'm hoping there'll be enough of a backlash to make them offer subscription deals on bundles rather than the all-or-(practically)-nothing choice you get now. I don't need *all* my Waves plugins, but I rely heavily on a few of them

[dan_g]

this is really bad news. a really bad move by waves.


luckily i only have really bought a few plugins of them besides some freebies. has anyone a good alternative to C6 Multiband Compressor and L1 Ultramaximizer?

[Loque]

NP. Uninstalled everything from Waves.

[jam-s]

Its not a reason to hate waves, but just a reason to not give them any money unless they get their act together.

[TritoneAddiction]

I don't own any Waves plugins, so I'm not affected in any way by this. But it's good to see some push back against subscription models in general. It's one thing to have subscription as an option. But I really don't want to see it becoming the norm or the only option to buy/use something.
In the end if enough people refuse to go along with crap like this, especially before all are doing it, companies will be forced to change their business model to something the customers accept. But it will take some sacrifice in some instances for sure.

I'm glad I haven't delved much into the VST world considering more and more companies are using subscription models. I'm just imagining how I would feel if I relied on a lot of VSTs from a bunch of different companies, all demanding a monthly subscription fee. What a nightmare.

I'm so greatful RS aren't doing subscription only, at least yet. I'm a bit worried for the future though.

[Neo]

With the endless flood of wave$ emails you'd think they would inform people about the change! I'm sure they would of made more sales.
Only positive is not having to pay for updates. Meh.
So to be able to use the subscription model you need internet access? - Be interesting to see how this pays/plays out for future wave$ users.
As much as I love some* of their plugins, I started phasing them out while ago. Fortunately for us we have many other alternatives.
Its one thing for a company to go subscription model, its another when you they give you no other option.
RIP Perpetual

[platzangst]

With the endless flood of wave$ emails you'd think they would inform people about the change! I'm sure they would of made more sales.

Well, I got an email about the change. Here's a quote from the mini-FAQ portion:

We know you must have many questions. Find all the answers in the link below—here are the ones that are probably first on your mind:

Can I still buy individual Waves plugins?

Starting today, Waves Creative Access will be the exclusive way to get Waves plugins. We wish to provide you a seamless way to use our massive plugin catalog, with instant updates, new plugins added as they’re released, and new AI-powered tools to enhance your creative process. To enable this, Waves Creative Access will be the way to get Waves plugins going forward.

What about the plugins I already own?

No worries. You continue to own your plugins, at the latest version you bought or to which you updated.

What about new plugins released in the future?

New plugins will be available as part of Waves Creative Access. Once you have a Waves Creative Access subscription, new plugins included in your subscription will be added at no extra cost.

What about plugin updates?

Waves Creative Access keeps all your plugins updated, always. You will get all updates for the plugins in your subscription, at no extra cost: no need for the Waves Update Plan. However, If you still have a valid Waves Update Plan, you will continue to enjoy all its benefits until it expires.

Does Waves Creative Access cover Waves live sound applications such as eMotion LV1 and SuperRack?

Waves Creative Access subscriptions are for plugins only. Waves live sound applications are still sold individually, as perpetual licenses. The Waves Update Plan still applies to these applications, no change.

[Popey]

I own a few waves plugins that I have either bought cheap or got free but never wup'd any of them so far (appreciate this is probably different for mac users who need wup for OS changes). Subscription only is not for me but I would be interested what happens now should you need to update one? Are you expected to subscribe for a month and update then or are you stuck on sub to use the updated version.

For me personally I will just use them until they break but will not be buying anything else from them. Probably worth me unsubscribing from the newsletter as well if it is just going to be sub ads.

I agree with TritoneAddiction and just hope subs only does not become the norm. Be interesting to see how this goes for Waves and if they feel the need to reverse this decision in the future.

[tallguy]

The only plugins worth getting are all in the ultimate bundle which would cost more than £200/year. Yeah, F that.

Unlike Soundtoys, Waves doesn't have any go-to plugins for me. Most Waves plugins I have were freebies that are now include with their essentials bundle

[Neo]

With the endless flood of wave$ emails you'd think they would inform people about the change! I'm sure they would of made more sales.

Well, I got an email about the change. Here's a quote from the mini-FAQ portion:

We know you must have many questions. Find all the answers in the link below—here are the ones that are probably first on your mind:

Can I still buy individual Waves plugins?

Starting today, Waves Creative Access will be the exclusive way to get Waves plugins. We wish to provide you a seamless way to use our massive plugin catalog, with instant updates, new plugins added as they’re released, and new AI-powered tools to enhance your creative process. To enable this, Waves Creative Access will be the way to get Waves plugins going forward.

What about the plugins I already own?

No worries. You continue to own your plugins, at the latest version you bought or to which you updated.

What about new plugins released in the future?

New plugins will be available as part of Waves Creative Access. Once you have a Waves Creative Access subscription, new plugins included in your subscription will be added at no extra cost.

What about plugin updates?



Waves Creative Access keeps all your plugins updated, always. You will get all updates for the plugins in your subscription, at no extra cost: no need for the Waves Update Plan. However, If you still have a valid Waves Update Plan, you will continue to enjoy all its benefits until it expires.

Does Waves Creative Access cover Waves live sound applications such as eMotion LV1 and SuperRack?

Waves Creative Access subscriptions are for plugins only. Waves live sound applications are still sold individually, as perpetual licenses. The Waves Update Plan still applies to these applications, no change.

[crimsonwarlock]

I never had any need for Waves stuff.

[bxbrkrz]

Don't hate Waves. Hate the game. Force a change of the game. We'll then get better players.

[joeyluck]

Subscription only is not for me but I would be interested what happens now should you need to update one? Are you expected to subscribe for a month and update then or are you stuck on sub to use the updated version.

I'm interested in how this works as well.

And will the WaveShell crap change? Lol

I stopped using Waves plugins simply because of the amount of time it takes to scan the WaveShells every time.

I do like the plugins. The Abbey Road Collection and Vocal Rider are great. But for now I still have them in a separate folder and that folder is currently not selected to scan.

[East Island]

Yes, bye bye expensive update plan!
I also found that to be an unfriendly system for customers.

Just like the subscriptions. No more waves for me!

[bxbrkrz]

Don't hate Waves. Hate the game. Force a change of the game. We'll then get better players.

How long before all of Waves products are replaced by some AI stuff?

[Popey]

Subscription only is not for me but I would be interested what happens now should you need to update one? Are you expected to subscribe for a month and update then or are you stuck on sub to use the updated version.

I'm interested in how this works as well.

And will the WaveShell crap change? Lol

I stopped using Waves plugins simply because of the amount of time it takes to scan the WaveShells every time.

I do like the plugins. The Abbey Road Collection and Vocal Rider are great. But for now I still have them in a separate folder and that folder is currently not selected to scan.

There are a couple of waves plugins I use occasionally but no big loss for me personally and will just use other options now. I would be cheesed off if I had bought a lot from them though.

I just hope other devs don't consider subscription only and it become the norm. That said I think I have only seen two positive posts about waves change and hundreds of negative ones

[joeyluck]

I'm interested in how this works as well.

And will the WaveShell crap change? Lol

I stopped using Waves plugins simply because of the amount of time it takes to scan the WaveShells every time.

I do like the plugins. The Abbey Road Collection and Vocal Rider are great. But for now I still have them in a separate folder and that folder is currently not selected to scan.

There are a couple of waves plugins I use occasionally but no big loss for me personally and will just use other options now. I would be cheesed off if I had bought a lot from them though.

I just hope other devs don't consider subscription only and it become the norm. That said I think I have only seen two positive posts about waves change and hundreds of negative ones

Yeah it changes nothing for me. I had no plans in updating the upgrade plan. So any plugins I have ever bought from them have been with the understanding that they won't be updated. Probably will be fine.

[robussc]

The economics of software is weird. On the one hand it's the only product we buy that we expect to get better (or at least updated) after we purchase it (and the cost of doing that has to be paid from somewhere). But on the other hand it's one of the few products where making 10,000,000 copies costs nothing. The profit margin on software is astronomical compared to many other product areas and one would think there would be enough left from that to cover the maintenance expenses (and, with plugins, what major maintenance expense is there - it's not like they're getting massive functional overhauls?)

The problem with the subscription approach is that at some point people are just going to say enough. No more subscriptions. We're already seeing it with streaming services.

I guess pros will just see it as another tax deductible business expense. I'm sure Adobe is doing fine with the Photoshop subscription service for example. But it does leave the amateurs and pro-sumers out in the cold.

[avasopht]

The economics of software is weird. On the one hand it's the only product we buy that we expect to get better (or at least updated) after we purchase it (and the cost of doing that has to be paid from somewhere). But on the other hand it's one of the few products where making 10,000,000 copies costs nothing. The profit margin on software is astronomical compared to many other product areas and one would think there would be enough left from that to cover the maintenance expenses

If only it were that easy.

Yes, it costs you nothing to sell another copy, but you still have to:
1. Develop it (including testing and support).
2. Market it (which still gives a cost to each sale).
3. Continue paying developers.
4. R&D (many of which will go nowhere).
5. Licensing (e.g. buying sounds, or for the use of a hardware brand name).
6. Office costs.
7. Hardware costs (for development and testing).

In a nutshell, we know that it's not a goldmine (hence why some DAWs went out of business completely or were bought out).

So no, the profit margin is not astronomical, because you first need to break even, and then continue to break even. This will be harder as each year goes by (until you end up with people complaining that you're taking too long to introduce features your competitors have, etc.)

[avasopht]

This seems like something that would have gone down much better 10-15 years ago.

But they have a strong brand, and I'm sure they've done market research to know what people will pay for it.

But at $15/25/mo, it could work as a one-stop-shop for effects (providing the lower tier is comprehensive enough).

The more important question is which deal seems better, this or Reason+?