Wavesfactory Cassette - It's Gorgeous

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TheGodOfRainbows
Posts: 458
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Post 10 Nov 2019

hurricane wrote:
09 Nov 2019
I like Wavesfactory Cassette, and it's very useable in most situations, however, I don't like the frequency response of the metal tape. I'm talking about the clean sound of the tape itself, without artifacts, 100% stability. Pro and home - where the hell did my bass go?? Anyone who is familiar with cassettes knows that if you wanted the ultimate sound quality - solid bassy bass and an extended HF response, you would use metal tapes. I mean you could practically mimic CD audio with a metal tape and a good tape deck. WF's metal emulation sounds thin and the highs are waaaay too..high. That's not metal tape. I'd like a bias knob. Or some sort of frequency adjustment.
I just bought Cassette, and I think Hurricane is right about the lack of bass on the metal tape setting. It sounds like its been high passed to an extreme. Surely metal cassettes from the time did not have THAT extreme of a bass loss. Perhaps that is something they might tweak on an update.

Have you thought about contacting the Wavesfactory about this? I might. The plugin is almost perfect, except for that one thing. Otherwise, it is a beautiful plugin!

EdGrip
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Post 11 Nov 2019

Always better to err on the side of leaving the user frequencies to cut, than not.

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jesusginard
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Post 11 Nov 2019

TheGodOfRainbows wrote:
10 Nov 2019
hurricane wrote:
09 Nov 2019
I like Wavesfactory Cassette, and it's very useable in most situations, however, I don't like the frequency response of the metal tape. I'm talking about the clean sound of the tape itself, without artifacts, 100% stability. Pro and home - where the hell did my bass go?? Anyone who is familiar with cassettes knows that if you wanted the ultimate sound quality - solid bassy bass and an extended HF response, you would use metal tapes. I mean you could practically mimic CD audio with a metal tape and a good tape deck. WF's metal emulation sounds thin and the highs are waaaay too..high. That's not metal tape. I'd like a bias knob. Or some sort of frequency adjustment.
I just bought Cassette, and I think Hurricane is right about the lack of bass on the metal tape setting. It sounds like its been high passed to an extreme. Surely metal cassettes from the time did not have THAT extreme of a bass loss. Perhaps that is something they might tweak on an update.

Have you thought about contacting the Wavesfactory about this? I might. The plugin is almost perfect, except for that one thing. Otherwise, it is a beautiful plugin!
Hi there!
I like being honest in... well, in life in general. That's why I don't like using hyperbolic marketing words and I always tend to say things the way that I think they are.
Ok, enough for this disclaimer.
I was also surprised about the Metal frequency response. I was expecting it to be flat, but in fact it wasn't. There's a big bump in high frequencies and low-cut.
In the manual you can see the frequency response of the different tapes and decks. Attaching the Type IV - Metal in the Tascam 424.

There isn't much more that I can say. This is the authentic curve that I got from my measurements. Maybe somebody with a Tascam 424 Portastudio and a Metal cassette can make their own test and compare?
I wouldn't like to include a correcting filter like a lowshelf to improve the bass sound of the Type IV because I want to stay true to the measurements. Staying true to them is what has made Cassette a great plug-in, IMHO.
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hurricane
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Post 11 Nov 2019

jesusginard wrote:
11 Nov 2019

Maybe somebody with a Tascam 424 Portastudio and a Metal cassette can make their own test and compare?
Are you sure you used the 424? Cuz the 414 is the one in your picture.


Screen Shot 2019-11-11 at 10.43.06 AM.png
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https://soundcloud.com/hurricane-music
Mac mini (Late 2012) | Logic Pro X | Reason 10.4 | DX7 | DX7s | TX7 | CZ-1 | JP-8080 | Virus Classic | Roland XP-80/XP-30/RD-700 | Steinberg UR22mkII | Emagic AMT8 | Mackie SR24x4 | StudioLogic SL990 PRO

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hurricane
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Post 11 Nov 2019

Anyway, the reason I am asking is because I have a 414 and I can run a test, however I believe there is no difference in the frequency response of the 414/424 so...

Also, do you realize the 414 is calibrated for a type II cassette?? If you put a type 4 in there the freq response/eq is going to be off. So that's what I think the problem is. You put a metal tape in a tape deck that supports metal tapes, and the bass rolloff and treble response would be way less drastic, even at -0db. I mean, that's why tape decks have bias knobs and switches for different tape types.

Still like Cassette, but the Metal tape is kind of unuseable and really harsh. Sketch cassette has a more accurate representation of the metal freq response.
https://soundcloud.com/hurricane-music
Mac mini (Late 2012) | Logic Pro X | Reason 10.4 | DX7 | DX7s | TX7 | CZ-1 | JP-8080 | Virus Classic | Roland XP-80/XP-30/RD-700 | Steinberg UR22mkII | Emagic AMT8 | Mackie SR24x4 | StudioLogic SL990 PRO

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jesusginard
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Post 11 Nov 2019

hurricane wrote:
11 Nov 2019
jesusginard wrote:
11 Nov 2019

Maybe somebody with a Tascam 424 Portastudio and a Metal cassette can make their own test and compare?
Are you sure you used the 424? Cuz the 414 is the one in your picture.



Screen Shot 2019-11-11 at 10.43.06 AM.png
Oops! Yes, I wanted to say 414.

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jesusginard
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Post 11 Nov 2019

hurricane wrote:
11 Nov 2019
Also, do you realize the 414 is calibrated for a type II cassette??
Yes, that's what I was thinking too. In fact, Type II is the one with the more float frequency response.
And, by the way, this deck doesn't have any bias setting or tape type selector.

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hurricane
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Post 11 Nov 2019

jesusginard wrote:
11 Nov 2019
And, by the way, this deck doesn't have any bias setting or tape type selector.
Yes I am aware, which is precisely why the Metal setting on your plugin sounds so off. The Tascam has an internal bias/eq for type II tapes. A metal tape requires a higher level of bias compared to a type II and since you obviously can't modify the bias on the Tascam 414, the resulting sound is going to be off, as it currently is. Now if your plugin was a Tascam 414 emulation, then the Metal setting is right on, because that's how a metal tape would sound on the Tascam, but for those of us who have experience playing and recording metal tapes on a Metal tape supporting deck, we know that's not how metal is supposed to sound.
https://soundcloud.com/hurricane-music
Mac mini (Late 2012) | Logic Pro X | Reason 10.4 | DX7 | DX7s | TX7 | CZ-1 | JP-8080 | Virus Classic | Roland XP-80/XP-30/RD-700 | Steinberg UR22mkII | Emagic AMT8 | Mackie SR24x4 | StudioLogic SL990 PRO

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hurricane
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Post 11 Nov 2019

This is why my most "pro" (i.e., expensive) tape deck has these controls:

biasccontrols.jpg
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https://soundcloud.com/hurricane-music
Mac mini (Late 2012) | Logic Pro X | Reason 10.4 | DX7 | DX7s | TX7 | CZ-1 | JP-8080 | Virus Classic | Roland XP-80/XP-30/RD-700 | Steinberg UR22mkII | Emagic AMT8 | Mackie SR24x4 | StudioLogic SL990 PRO

chaosroyale
Posts: 271
Joined: 05 Sep 2017

Post 13 Nov 2019

holy shit, this guy just flexed on the forum with a cassette player . I am legit impressed.
hurricane wrote:
11 Nov 2019
This is why my most "pro" (i.e., expensive) tape deck has these controls:


biasccontrols.jpg

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motuscott
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Post 13 Nov 2019

chaosroyale wrote:
13 Nov 2019
holy shit, this guy just flexed on the forum with a cassette player . I am legit impressed.
:D
Sometimes a cigar is just a synth that's on fire

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hurricane
Posts: 965
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Post 13 Nov 2019

chaosroyale wrote:
13 Nov 2019
holy shit, this guy just flexed on the forum with a cassette player . I am legit impressed.
Correction, my friend - it is not a cassette player, but a cassette deck. :puf_bigsmile:
https://soundcloud.com/hurricane-music
Mac mini (Late 2012) | Logic Pro X | Reason 10.4 | DX7 | DX7s | TX7 | CZ-1 | JP-8080 | Virus Classic | Roland XP-80/XP-30/RD-700 | Steinberg UR22mkII | Emagic AMT8 | Mackie SR24x4 | StudioLogic SL990 PRO

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TheGodOfRainbows
Posts: 458
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Post 15 Nov 2019

jesusginard wrote:
11 Nov 2019
TheGodOfRainbows wrote:
10 Nov 2019


I just bought Cassette, and I think Hurricane is right about the lack of bass on the metal tape setting. It sounds like its been high passed to an extreme. Surely metal cassettes from the time did not have THAT extreme of a bass loss. Perhaps that is something they might tweak on an update.

Have you thought about contacting the Wavesfactory about this? I might. The plugin is almost perfect, except for that one thing. Otherwise, it is a beautiful plugin!
Hi there!
I like being honest in... well, in life in general. That's why I don't like using hyperbolic marketing words and I always tend to say things the way that I think they are.
Ok, enough for this disclaimer.
I was also surprised about the Metal frequency response. I was expecting it to be flat, but in fact it wasn't. There's a big bump in high frequencies and low-cut.
In the manual you can see the frequency response of the different tapes and decks. Attaching the Type IV - Metal in the Tascam 424.

There isn't much more that I can say. This is the authentic curve that I got from my measurements. Maybe somebody with a Tascam 424 Portastudio and a Metal cassette can make their own test and compare?
I wouldn't like to include a correcting filter like a lowshelf to improve the bass sound of the Type IV because I want to stay true to the measurements. Staying true to them is what has made Cassette a great plug-in, IMHO.
Thank you for the response jesusginard! I really appreciate hearing from you. I didn't expect a developer from the VST world to stop by Rack Extension Land!

I wonder if this is a case of what has priority: functionality or accuracy? Like balancing game-play mechanics in a video game. What is more desirable? Fun game-play or realism.

In my very humble opinion (and I don't claim to know anything about anything), to make this plugin a perfect 10/10, I would tweak that bass response, for the sake of 'fun' over realism. But again, I don't know anything about anything really, so take my suggestion with a molecule of salt.

As it is now, I give Cassette a 9/10 :D


Again, thank you for the response and welcome to ReasonTalk :D

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guitfnky
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Joined: 19 Jan 2015

Post 15 Nov 2019

jesusginard wrote:
09 Nov 2019
guitfnky wrote:
08 Nov 2019
I’m not sure, but I may have run across a bug in Reason. I had multiple Cassette instances in a session, and when I only had the GUI window open for one, everything was good to go. when I opened the GUI for a second instance (so now have two Cassette GUIs open), there was a delay of maybe a second or two whenever I tried to do anything (like start/stop playback w/space bar, or move a window, close a window, etc.).

I ended up crashing my PC as a result, but I’m not certain that’s caused by the plugin...I was trying to change the buffer settings to see if that helped, and accidentally made several changes before the UI could catch up, so it may have been my Focusrite driver that actually caused the crash.

I’ll try to recreate when I have time, but that won’t likely be until tomorrow or Sunday.
If you experience any graphics lag you should disable the animation by clicking on the main menu (burger menu at the top right) and selecting "Cancel Animation".
there's definitely something funky going on with this for me...I tried turning off the animation as you suggested, and it doesn't eliminate the input lag I'm getting when I have more than one instance of Cassette showing on the screen.

I also had some issues with other VSTs--specifically I was using an NI-Vari-Comp plugin, and when I had three Cassettes in the session (even with them not on screen), the comp plugin would only update at something like 2 or 3 frames per second, making it difficult to use. I tried removing the three Cassette instances and the issue cleared up. interestingly though, that one happened the first time I started working in the session--i.e. I started the session, added my Cassette instances, added my Vari-Comp, and encountered the issue...after I closed out of the session and reopened it, that particular bug went away.

the input lag issue persists even after reopening. to be clear, I've tested with other VSTs and this doesn't happen (I opened two instances of Waves Vitamin, and no input lag, and an instance of the Vari-Comp and Vitamin, with no input lag).

if it's at all helpful, I'm on a Windows 10 machine, running Reason 10.4.

all that aside, I adore this plugin. it sounds incredible!

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hurricane
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Post 15 Nov 2019

New update out.
Screen Shot 2019-11-15 at 11.17.38 AM.png
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https://soundcloud.com/hurricane-music
Mac mini (Late 2012) | Logic Pro X | Reason 10.4 | DX7 | DX7s | TX7 | CZ-1 | JP-8080 | Virus Classic | Roland XP-80/XP-30/RD-700 | Steinberg UR22mkII | Emagic AMT8 | Mackie SR24x4 | StudioLogic SL990 PRO

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diminished
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Post 15 Nov 2019

Cool. Randomly complaining about something on an internet forum and seeing it fixed just a week later. Reason Studios, take notes!

I had a lot of fun with the demo.
Doubling a vocal track, a Cassette on each, panned hard left and right, slapback echo and plate reverb on their bus. Adjust bus stereo width to taste. Then modulating wow and flutter with two different LFOs. Poor man's ADT. John Lennon says hi :)
:reason: Most recent track: The Test (feat. MrFigg) || Others: on my YouTube channel •ᴗ•

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reddust
Posts: 490
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Post 15 Nov 2019

diminished wrote:
15 Nov 2019
Cool. Randomly complaining about something on an internet forum and seeing it fixed just a week later. Reason Studios, take notes!
Totally agree, it’s really nice to see a company that cares about customers these days, going to update right now

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diminished
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Joined: 15 Dec 2018

Post 15 Nov 2019

jesusginard wrote:
07 Nov 2019
reddust wrote:
06 Nov 2019


I second this petition, I hope some of the Wavesfactory devs or CEO's is reading this thread :)
Hey! It's Jesús from Wavesfactory.

1. I can easily add that feature in the next update.
2. You're right, random snap is not controllable, it's pure random. Maybe not for Cassette but for a plug-in on its own in which you have different tape/vinyl glitches in a sequencer. It would be nice!
3. Funny that you mention tape stop. Coming soon:

Image

Thank you guys for the nice comments about Cassette! :)
Hey Jesús, if you're still reading this thread :) Is that tape start/stop plugin going to be bundled with Cassette, and what will it cost? Will all paramters be automatable?
:reason: Most recent track: The Test (feat. MrFigg) || Others: on my YouTube channel •ᴗ•

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diminished
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Post 15 Nov 2019

PSA: Cassette is available on Pluginboutique too, by the way. Might save you a buck or two depending on how much virtual cash you have in your accounts..
:reason: Most recent track: The Test (feat. MrFigg) || Others: on my YouTube channel •ᴗ•

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hurricane
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Post 15 Nov 2019

Umm....nothing has been fixed.

Two new "features" have been added, and a there are some new presets.
https://soundcloud.com/hurricane-music
Mac mini (Late 2012) | Logic Pro X | Reason 10.4 | DX7 | DX7s | TX7 | CZ-1 | JP-8080 | Virus Classic | Roland XP-80/XP-30/RD-700 | Steinberg UR22mkII | Emagic AMT8 | Mackie SR24x4 | StudioLogic SL990 PRO

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diminished
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Post 15 Nov 2019

hurricane wrote:
15 Nov 2019
Umm....nothing has been fixed.

Two new "features" have been added, and a there are some new presets.
IMO the sliders snapping to the click position is a fix to a minor UX flaw. Wether you agree or not, that's what I meant.
:reason: Most recent track: The Test (feat. MrFigg) || Others: on my YouTube channel •ᴗ•

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hurricane
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Post 15 Nov 2019

Well, ok then but I don’t agree because the sliders were never broken.

The metal emulation on the other hand...
https://soundcloud.com/hurricane-music
Mac mini (Late 2012) | Logic Pro X | Reason 10.4 | DX7 | DX7s | TX7 | CZ-1 | JP-8080 | Virus Classic | Roland XP-80/XP-30/RD-700 | Steinberg UR22mkII | Emagic AMT8 | Mackie SR24x4 | StudioLogic SL990 PRO

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challism
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Post 15 Nov 2019

I'm trying the demo now. This is pretty cool. Can anybody tell me what are the limitations of the demo? I can't seem to figure that out. Thanks

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diminished
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Post 15 Nov 2019

challism wrote:
15 Nov 2019
I'm trying the demo now. This is pretty cool. Can anybody tell me what are the limitations of the demo? I can't seem to figure that out. Thanks
Cassette will run in demo mode by default. It will output a 2-seconds volume dip every 60 seconds, parameters won’t be recalled when saving the session and preset saving is disabled. All other features will be available for full evaluation with no specific time expiration. While in demo mode the plugin will show the authorisation panel every time you open the UI, if you still want to evaluate it you have to click on “Continue evaluation” at the bottom of the pop-up.
https://www.wavesfactory.com/wp-content ... Manual.pdf
:)
:reason: Most recent track: The Test (feat. MrFigg) || Others: on my YouTube channel •ᴗ•

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diminished
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Post 15 Nov 2019

hurricane wrote:
15 Nov 2019
The metal emulation on the other hand...
Yeah it would be great if that issue was adressed, because what you said is 100% true, putting the wrong cassette type in a machine that doesn't support it will yield in the wrong sound / frequency response.
:reason: Most recent track: The Test (feat. MrFigg) || Others: on my YouTube channel •ᴗ•

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