superior drummer not responding to midi correctly

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limbophonic
Posts: 66
Joined: 21 Dec 2015

02 Jun 2017

Hello i have superior drummer 2 (SD2) ,when it's in stand alone mode i can setup the SD2 hi hat to respond to my Roland TD9 V kit correctly using the roland tab in midi settings,, i saved this setting, i then open superior drummer inside Reason, and load my saved setting, but when i play the Roland TD9 hi hat it now stays open, and even when i make changes inside SD2 to the HH curve response, it makes no difference!
i can only assume that the issue is with Reason.
any idea's

UPDATE:
ok there seems to be a difference between midi data being played into SD2 from Roland TD9 and recorded midi data from the TD9,
what do i mean?...will with no host DAW in the way of the midi data coming from the TD9, superior Drummer responds correctly to hi hat,
when SD2 is inside Reason, the midi data is going into reason first and then past into SD2, at this point the midi data seem to be corrupted!
however.. the record midi data from the TD9 playsback the Hi hat correctly? so that rules out an issue with TD9

dberndt7
Competition Winner
Posts: 22
Joined: 31 Jul 2017
Location: Seattle, USA

19 Sep 2017

Hey limbophonic. I saw your post from a few months ago and though I'd respond since I've been agonizing over the same problem. Here are my findings incase they are helpful to anyone on the board.

I have a Roland TD-1K kit going into Reason 9.5 and Superior drummer 2.0. Same experience. I can set up the hat pedal just fine when using SD stand alone. When I save the user preset and load SD as a VST in reason the pedal isn't responsive. You can go back to the default setting SD and open and close the pedal, but after some testing I determined SD is not receiving the CC4 messages from the Roland. At least not the way it does in stand alone mode. You can confirm this by viewing the mapping tab in SD for the Hat -> Pedal CC Control. On the cc control grid/square chart you should see a little dot move on the axis if it's receiving messages. It does this in stand alone, but not as a vst in reason.

I could talk more about this and all the things I tried, but here's a work around I discovered in reason for anyone who is having a similar issue. Create a combinator in reason, add SD as a vst inside the combinator. Under the reason options menu select Remote Override Edit Mode, then click on the mod wheel of the combinator until you see the yellow lighting bolt spinning over it. Then press your kick pedal. Doing this will assign the mod wheel of the combinator (and will control the mod wheel of the vst SD is on) to CC4 of your kick pedal. Now SD will receive the CC data on channel 1, which is what the mod wheel is assigned too. My SD was set to default to receive cc messages on CC1 and CC4, but you may have to confirm yours is set the same way. Reason will also record the mod wheel/kick pedal activity now.. so I guess you could edit that if you had any desire to do so. Now the hihat pedal is triggering SD in reason the same as it would in stand alone mode. :thumbs_up:

If you could actually change what cc channel the roland transmits to CC1, on that would also solve this.. but not seeing anyway to do that with the TD-1K.

It's a pretty tweaky use case I have to admit, but I got a little obsessive about figuring this out.. and it does seem to give the hithat better feel and realness. Another big benefit is I really got more familiar with SD's midi mapping with is pretty cool once you figure out how it all functions (not very intuitive). I definitely recommend checking out midi nodes and what you can do with triggering more then one instrument with a single pad. Anyway hope this was helpful to someone out there as I didn't see anything similar on this board or my google searches. Glad Reason seems to always have some kinda of work around available if you can hack it out!

limbophonic
Posts: 66
Joined: 21 Dec 2015

22 Sep 2017

Hi, thanks for reply, i have just bought superior drummer 3, but am getting the same issue, SD3 seems to work better with the generic setting cc Hi Hat, and setting on the TD9 midi control/pedal cc mod (1), HH compatibility TD9/TD20.
with the above settings I'm getting fairly good hi hat control including pedal splash off's.

I have reported the issue to propellerheads but they don't seem to understand the issue, or they think it's user error,

Swansong
Posts: 1
Joined: 31 Oct 2017

31 Oct 2017

Thanks for the Combinator tip, it was useful for me also, I'm having TD9KX and the same problem. Is it possible to do something similar to cymbal mute function as well? Also do you experience problems with recognition when playing with e-drums? Is it a configuration issue or has my hihat and crash cymbal flaws, mesh pads are my ride cymbal are working fine.

User avatar
kuhliloach
Posts: 880
Joined: 09 Dec 2015

31 Oct 2017

This may seem off topic but this discussion made me come up with an idea: separate RE's for each element in a drum set. Modular drum RE's! Kick RE, Snare RE, etc.

Imagine an RE that did nothing but Hi-Hats and was fully configurable for different scenarios.

Mantry
Posts: 4
Joined: 07 Dec 2017

07 Dec 2017

dberndt7 wrote:
19 Sep 2017
Hey limbophonic. I saw your post from a few months ago and though I'd respond since I've been agonizing over the same problem. Here are my findings incase they are helpful to anyone on the board.

I have a Roland TD-1K kit going into Reason 9.5 and Superior drummer 2.0. Same experience. I can set up the hat pedal just fine when using SD stand alone. When I save the user preset and load SD as a VST in reason the pedal isn't responsive. You can go back to the default setting SD and open and close the pedal, but after some testing I determined SD is not receiving the CC4 messages from the Roland. At least not the way it does in stand alone mode. You can confirm this by viewing the mapping tab in SD for the Hat -> Pedal CC Control. On the cc control grid/square chart you should see a little dot move on the axis if it's receiving messages. It does this in stand alone, but not as a vst in reason.

I could talk more about this and all the things I tried, but here's a work around I discovered in reason for anyone who is having a similar issue. Create a combinator in reason, add SD as a vst inside the combinator. Under the reason options menu select Remote Override Edit Mode, then click on the mod wheel of the combinator until you see the yellow lighting bolt spinning over it. Then press your kick pedal. Doing this will assign the mod wheel of the combinator (and will control the mod wheel of the vst SD is on) to CC4 of your kick pedal. Now SD will receive the CC data on channel 1, which is what the mod wheel is assigned too. My SD was set to default to receive cc messages on CC1 and CC4, but you may have to confirm yours is set the same way. Reason will also record the mod wheel/kick pedal activity now.. so I guess you could edit that if you had any desire to do so. Now the hihat pedal is triggering SD in reason the same as it would in stand alone mode. :thumbs_up:

If you could actually change what cc channel the roland transmits to CC1, on that would also solve this.. but not seeing anyway to do that with the TD-1K.

It's a pretty tweaky use case I have to admit, but I got a little obsessive about figuring this out.. and it does seem to give the hithat better feel and realness. Another big benefit is I really got more familiar with SD's midi mapping with is pretty cool once you figure out how it all functions (not very intuitive). I definitely recommend checking out midi nodes and what you can do with triggering more then one instrument with a single pad. Anyway hope this was helpful to someone out there as I didn't see anything similar on this board or my google searches. Glad Reason seems to always have some kinda of work around available if you can hack it out!
I literally made an account just to say thank you for sharing this. You are an absolute legend. No boundaries now!! Perhaps I will share this with Propellerheads!

User avatar
motuscott
Posts: 3420
Joined: 16 Jan 2015
Location: Contest Weiner

07 Dec 2017

Even mediocre drummers rarely respond correctly.
Who’s using the royal plural now baby? 🧂

dberndt7
Competition Winner
Posts: 22
Joined: 31 Jul 2017
Location: Seattle, USA

08 Dec 2017

Mantry wrote:
07 Dec 2017
dberndt7 wrote:
19 Sep 2017
Hey limbophonic. I saw your post from a few months ago and though I'd respond since I've been agonizing over the same problem. Here are my findings incase they are helpful to anyone on the board.

I have a Roland TD-1K kit going into Reason 9.5 and Superior drummer 2.0. Same experience. I can set up the hat pedal just fine when using SD stand alone. When I save the user preset and load SD as a VST in reason the pedal isn't responsive. You can go back to the default setting SD and open and close the pedal, but after some testing I determined SD is not receiving the CC4 messages from the Roland. At least not the way it does in stand alone mode. You can confirm this by viewing the mapping tab in SD for the Hat -> Pedal CC Control. On the cc control grid/square chart you should see a little dot move on the axis if it's receiving messages. It does this in stand alone, but not as a vst in reason.

I could talk more about this and all the things I tried, but here's a work around I discovered in reason for anyone who is having a similar issue. Create a combinator in reason, add SD as a vst inside the combinator. Under the reason options menu select Remote Override Edit Mode, then click on the mod wheel of the combinator until you see the yellow lighting bolt spinning over it. Then press your kick pedal. Doing this will assign the mod wheel of the combinator (and will control the mod wheel of the vst SD is on) to CC4 of your kick pedal. Now SD will receive the CC data on channel 1, which is what the mod wheel is assigned too. My SD was set to default to receive cc messages on CC1 and CC4, but you may have to confirm yours is set the same way. Reason will also record the mod wheel/kick pedal activity now.. so I guess you could edit that if you had any desire to do so. Now the hihat pedal is triggering SD in reason the same as it would in stand alone mode. :thumbs_up:

If you could actually change what cc channel the roland transmits to CC1, on that would also solve this.. but not seeing anyway to do that with the TD-1K.

It's a pretty tweaky use case I have to admit, but I got a little obsessive about figuring this out.. and it does seem to give the hithat better feel and realness. Another big benefit is I really got more familiar with SD's midi mapping with is pretty cool once you figure out how it all functions (not very intuitive). I definitely recommend checking out midi nodes and what you can do with triggering more then one instrument with a single pad. Anyway hope this was helpful to someone out there as I didn't see anything similar on this board or my google searches. Glad Reason seems to always have some kinda of work around available if you can hack it out!
I literally made an account just to say thank you for sharing this. You are an absolute legend. No boundaries now!! Perhaps I will share this with Propellerheads!
Sweet! I'm glad someone found this helpful. Ironically, posting this is why I made my account... after spending the time to figure this out I felt I had to put it out there. Liking the forum though, especially since upgrading and going all in on reason.... good luck.

dberndt7
Competition Winner
Posts: 22
Joined: 31 Jul 2017
Location: Seattle, USA

08 Dec 2017

Swansong wrote:
31 Oct 2017
Thanks for the Combinator tip, it was useful for me also, I'm having TD9KX and the same problem. Is it possible to do something similar to cymbal mute function as well? Also do you experience problems with recognition when playing with e-drums? Is it a configuration issue or has my hihat and crash cymbal flaws, mesh pads are my ride cymbal are working fine.
My roland kit doesn't have the cymbal mute option, so not sure if this is possible or not. If you want to explore I'd recommend checking to see if the roland is putting out cc data. If so, what channel. If that's happening then it's probably possible to make the same work around happen..

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