I won't buy another Waves plugin until they sort out copy protection

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tobypearce
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Post 31 May 2017

I'm going to drop Waves a note but also want to post on this forum. In fact, I'll simply send them a copy of this post.

Waves make great plugins, and it's a major step forward to be able to use them in the Reason environment. Yet, I won't give them any more of my money until they make their copy protection more user friendly.

They allow for use on multiple computers, but there's a catch, and it often catches me. You can only have one computer activated at once and have to manually assign the license to the different computer when you want to switch environments. Worse still, you have to do this from the computer on which the license is currently activated. For example, if you are in a home studio and want to continue work on a laptop later, you have to open the Waves Central software and transfer the licenses before you leave the studio - every single time. And if you forget, there's no way to use the plugins on your laptop; They don't allow you to do this remotely, even though you own the plugins. They do allow you to license a USB dongle, and you can use that on different computers, but the same thing applies: you have to remember to take the dongle with you - every single time. If you don't, you're out of luck, and you can't use the Waves plugins you bought.

Compare this to Propellerheads' system: you can sync licenses to both computers automatically. It works transparently, behind the scenes. It's no less secure than Waves, but much more user friendly.

As I say, Waves make great products, but their system simply isn't appropriate for the way many people now make music. If they want to sell their products to more people, they've got to fix this and provide a more flexible approach. Until then, I'll spend my money elsewhere.
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Loque
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Post 31 May 2017

Sigh...i guess you gonna find this protection type pretty often and i feel with you when protection disturbs the paying users instead of the non-paying users...
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MDTerps2015
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Post 31 May 2017

I won't touch them because of WUP. They have nice stuff but not worth the hassle imho. I would love to have vitamin and mv2 but upgrade prices every year kills the deal. I know people say that I don't have to upgrade but I would just rather not be stuck having to pay for an upgrade that is essential. I just downloaded a couple of free vst's from flux. Both are crazy good. Vst's add a little flare but I still prefer RE's as the meat of my mixes. Just that RE's don't have as many choices for fine tuning.
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QVprod
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Post 31 May 2017

It works just like Reason's copy protection does. You can only authorize one computer. Computer authorization is meant for your main computer. It's not possible to deauthorize from other computers so that no one can hack your account and deauthorize your computer remotely just the same way a dongle has to be plugged in to deathorize it. If your intent is to move between multiple computers, then that's the purpose of the ignition key, or for Waves the iLock key. Only difference is Reason also has internet authorization. RE's are able to move more easily because you have to be able to open Reason in the first place to use them.

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selig
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Post 31 May 2017

QVprod wrote:It works just like Reason's copy protection does…
Not in practice, right? Which is the whole point of this thread - or did I misunderstand it?


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QVprod
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Post 31 May 2017

selig wrote:
QVprod wrote:It works just like Reason's copy protection does…
Not in practice, right? Which is the whole point of this thread - or did I misunderstand it?


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From the process described , the only difference I see between the two is the internet authorization option for Reason.

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selig
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Post 31 May 2017

QVprod wrote:
selig wrote:
QVprod wrote:It works just like Reason's copy protection does…
Not in practice, right? Which is the whole point of this thread - or did I misunderstand it?


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From the process described , the only difference I see between the two is the internet authorization option for Reason.
I was referring to the process to move from one machine to another, MUCH simpler in Reason with REs - just close down Reason and you can open on another computer (choosing between Dongle and internet auth.).

To de-authorize and re-authorize a 'computer' with Reason would be more comparable to the description of using Waves on more than one computer - is that what you're talking about?
:)


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QVprod
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Post 31 May 2017

selig wrote:
QVprod wrote:
selig wrote:
QVprod wrote:It works just like Reason's copy protection does…
Not in practice, right? Which is the whole point of this thread - or did I misunderstand it?


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From the process described , the only difference I see between the two is the internet authorization option for Reason.
I was referring to the process to move from one machine to another, MUCH simpler in Reason with REs - just close down Reason and you can open on another computer (choosing between Dongle and internet auth.).

To de-authorize and re-authorize a 'computer' with Reason would be more comparable to the description of using Waves on more than one computer - is that what you're talking about?
:)


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Yep exactly. While REs can easily be moved, the computer (or ignition key) has to be authorized to run Reason in order to use them which basically makes it very similar to Waves and iLock. as far as authorization goes.

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selig
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Post 31 May 2017

QVprod wrote:
selig wrote:
QVprod wrote:
selig wrote:
QVprod wrote:It works just like Reason's copy protection does…
Not in practice, right? Which is the whole point of this thread - or did I misunderstand it?


Sent from some crappy device using Tapatalk
From the process described , the only difference I see between the two is the internet authorization option for Reason.
I was referring to the process to move from one machine to another, MUCH simpler in Reason with REs - just close down Reason and you can open on another computer (choosing between Dongle and internet auth.).

To de-authorize and re-authorize a 'computer' with Reason would be more comparable to the description of using Waves on more than one computer - is that what you're talking about?
:)


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Yep exactly. While REs can easily be moved, the computer (or ignition key) has to be authorized to run Reason in order to use them which basically makes it very similar to Waves and iLock.
OR internet - same for Waves?

All I can say is I've been moving back and forth a LOT lately (long distance relationship) and all I have to do is boot from my drive at the new location. Don't have to jump through any of the hoops described above, making it a VERY different process for me from what was described for Waves (and that's just ONE plugin dev, there will be other hoops for any other devs)!


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QVprod
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Post 31 May 2017

selig wrote:
QVprod wrote:
selig wrote:
QVprod wrote:
selig wrote:
QVprod wrote:It works just like Reason's copy protection does…
Not in practice, right? Which is the whole point of this thread - or did I misunderstand it?


Sent from some crappy device using Tapatalk
From the process described , the only difference I see between the two is the internet authorization option for Reason.
I was referring to the process to move from one machine to another, MUCH simpler in Reason with REs - just close down Reason and you can open on another computer (choosing between Dongle and internet auth.).

To de-authorize and re-authorize a 'computer' with Reason would be more comparable to the description of using Waves on more than one computer - is that what you're talking about?
:)


Sent from some crappy device using Tapatalk
Yep exactly. While REs can easily be moved, the computer (or ignition key) has to be authorized to run Reason in order to use them which basically makes it very similar to Waves and iLock.
OR internet - same for Waves?

All I can say is I've been moving back and forth a LOT lately (long distance relationship) and all I have to do is boot from my drive at the new location. Don't have to jump through any of the hoops described above, making it a VERY different process for me from what was described for Waves (and that's just ONE plugin dev, there will be other hoops for any other devs)!


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I left out internet since I had already mentioned it. The difference with your process is that you're moving the hard drive itself which could possibly work for Waves plugins and iLock as well.

OP is moving authorization from one computer to another (2 different hard drives) in which case 2 computers cannot be authorized (via computer authorization) to run Reason and REs simultaneously. For example. My laptop is using computer authorization. My desktop uses the ignition key. I can do the same exact thing with iLock.

That said though, I'll concede as I completely forgot Waves doesn't use iLock anymore but have their own separate authorization Waves Central. iLock allows for multiple authorizations, but it seems Waves Central does not. Clearly I misread myself. My apologies to the OP.

lowpryo
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Post 31 May 2017

My problem with Waves is having 2, 3, or 10 different versions of the same VST for various mono & stereo capability and slightly different features. especially horrid in Reason's new setup. ugh.

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tobypearce
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Post 31 May 2017

Waves really is more cumbersome that Reason - not the same.

With Reason and REs, I work on my studio desktop, simply leave the office, and when I open my laptop I can pick up where I started without having to do anything. Both computers are authorised (the studio one with the Propellerheads dongle, and the laptop via a *one-off* internet verification, and since I never use them simultaneously, it's all absolutely transparent.

With Waves, as a user I am required to manually transfer the license from one computer to another, via the Waves Manager, every single time I want to use the other computer. That's just too much of a pain - there are plenty of other great devs who don't impose this. Props included.
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Gulale
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Post 01 Jun 2017

While I agree with you on most part. As an option why don't you put your waves license on flash disk and when you move around just take the flash with you.
Gulale aka Bereket

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tobypearce
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Post 01 Jun 2017

That's certainly an option. Thanks.

Still not as good as the PH solution though!
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Gulale
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Post 01 Jun 2017

To be honest I used to use flash and I lost once I recovered it. You only recover once a year. You lose it twice you are done and waves support team they are not good. It is all about money. They just told me to renew those WUP the one which was expired. I was mad like hell. Man crack users use their plugins without no worries me I pay them and treat me like shit. I have never used that flash thing ever again. So be careful not to lose it more than ones a year. if you do, you will have to wait a year to recover it back again. That if you don't want to renew WUP. If you do, the support team will do their best to help you. That is what the support said to me. Renew to get help.
Gulale aka Bereket

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nikolafeve
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Post 07 Jun 2017

If you have the waves licenses you probably have the "right" to use a cracked version of these plugins on one of your computer. Right ?
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bsp
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Post 07 Jun 2017

nikolafeve wrote:If you have the waves licenses you probably have the "right" to use a cracked version of these plugins on one of your computer. Right ?
As far as I am concerned, I would consider this an "unofficial patch", see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unofficial_patch

A "crack" does not change the "intended purpose" of a software and should therefore be legal, as long as it is being applied for personal use only, and you don't redistribute the patched binaries.

Keep in mind that I am not a lawyer and you are definitely getting on thin ice with this (especially in the US).

Then again, I can hardly imagine that a software company will come after you if you bought a license and then patch the binaries for personal use.

Before anyone gets the wrong idea: All my software is licensed and I find it quite sad that it is the honest people who have to go through all the licensing hassle while the illegal downloaders often enjoy the best user experience.

I've recently bought a couple of VSTs (Valhalla, Sonic Charge, TAL, .., Fabfilter) and one of them (Fabfilter) seemed to require an online authorization while the other ones used plain license key files that will probably work on multiple machines (the studio + laptop scenario).
(for example, see here for Valhalla's official stance on this: https://valhalladsp.com/faqs/can-instal ... p-machine/ )

p.s: "A Software worth using is a Software worth buying".

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Rectro
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Post 08 Jun 2017

Iv purchased 2 plugins from wave, and find their licence protection system fine. If you want real problems get a Softube VST. Your need 3 pieces of software to install which all need registration and account linking. It took me ages to just get a demo working.

Dan

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gak
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Post 09 Jun 2017

I've been hearing this for YEARS at KVR.

Funny, I've never had an issue. And I'm a pretty bad-luck sorta chap.

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tobypearce
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Post 24 May 2020

Just checked in with Waves to see if they have updated their user protection to make it easier to use on two computers (i.e. activate two computers).

Nope.
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zero-13
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Post 24 May 2020

Yep, this is exactly the reason I stopped buying Waves plugins after my original purchase of a few when Reason added VST support.

I don’t bother using them at all now and it’s a complete no go on buying anymore until this antiquated headache is removed.

It’s a shame because there are many cool products they offer but more digital annoyance and vibe killing headaches I need not. :D

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MrFigg
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Post 24 May 2020

WavesCentral was my first experience of trying to install a VST after getting a device free from Propellerheads. I found it so irritating that I didn’t look at any other VSTs for a long time afterwards. Everything good now but That experience has put me off ever buying a Waves product.
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joeyluck
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Post 24 May 2020

tobypearce wrote:
24 May 2020
Just checked in with Waves to see if they have updated their user protection to make it easier to use on two computers (i.e. activate two computers).

Nope.
Really? They didn't mention the Waves Update Plan? They just updated it to include a 2nd license option for covered plugins. If you're someone who needs use the plugins on different computers, it seems that would be the way. https://www.waves.com/support/waves-update-plan

DaveyG
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Post 24 May 2020

I've always thought it was particularly tight of Waves to only allow one licence. Like many people I have a main PC and a laptop for occasional mobile use. My main PC has legitimate Waves plugins. The laptop has a selected subset of Waves plugins that might not quite so, ahem, legitimate. They never get used simultaneously but I just got tired of doing the license transfer thing.

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Boombastix
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Post 24 May 2020

Just open Waves Central and move the license to the other computer. That's what I did when I needed them in my laptop during some travel. Pretty easy actually.
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